Upper control arm and shock angles
Upper control arm and shock angles I'm struggling with a "stiff" front suspension; I haven't been able to find any binds when it's in the air sitting with all four rotors on blocks. Everything front and back moves smoothly ; hit a bump or a manhole cover going down the road, though, and it feels like the suspension is welded together.
2 things I've noticed:
1. The driver side upper arm rotates around the bushings; there's no play, but the arm doesn't grab the bushings like the passenger side does (passenger side is actually flexing the rubber of the bushing as it rotates, which I assume is correct)
2. The front shocks seem to be sitting with the top mount forward of the bottom mount, which seems backwards; I'd expect the bottom mount to be very slightly ahead of the top so that the shock compresses correctly. Is this configuration correct?
2 things I've noticed:
1. The driver side upper arm rotates around the bushings; there's no play, but the arm doesn't grab the bushings like the passenger side does (passenger side is actually flexing the rubber of the bushing as it rotates, which I assume is correct)
2. The front shocks seem to be sitting with the top mount forward of the bottom mount, which seems backwards; I'd expect the bottom mount to be very slightly ahead of the top so that the shock compresses correctly. Is this configuration correct?
On The Tree
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 148
Likes: 0
From: Warren, OH
That sounds backwards. Google 'caster angle' and that should explain some things to you. I wouldn't be surprised if something was actually bound upon compression; however I am unaware how this could happen unless the control arms could somehow be flipped (tubular?) or are off the wrong vehicle. I wouldn't think the left could be installed on the right and actually bolt up. Are you running a front swaybar? I wouldn't think it would bolt up if so.
As for the bushing although incorrect ( the one that allows the arm to free spin) should be replaced it should not cause positive caster angles. However if it is split in the center a jolt you could feel would be the arm bottoming out on the through bolt. It should be replaced.
Hope that helps.
As for the bushing although incorrect ( the one that allows the arm to free spin) should be replaced it should not cause positive caster angles. However if it is split in the center a jolt you could feel would be the arm bottoming out on the through bolt. It should be replaced.
Hope that helps.
The first thing I thought of was I managed to switch them, but there's the extra nub on the forward side of each that acts as a key, so they can't be swapped (they/re the original stock ones). The shock lines up with the lower arm, too, so I guess that's evidence that it's all correct, seems wrong though. When I get it all back together I'll put the angle finder on it just to be sure.
I have a couple of sets of upper bushings and some fit snug in the arm while others will slide right in and out. None are tight enough to prevent it from rotating, I don't think. I'm going to try to tap the flange in a bit with a punch as far around as I can go; that'll at least give me a little more peace of mind until I can locate a pair of replacement arms.
Thanks for the feedback
I have a couple of sets of upper bushings and some fit snug in the arm while others will slide right in and out. None are tight enough to prevent it from rotating, I don't think. I'm going to try to tap the flange in a bit with a punch as far around as I can go; that'll at least give me a little more peace of mind until I can locate a pair of replacement arms.
Thanks for the feedback
The upper arm bracket is not physically attached to the rubber upper shock mount. It only sits on top, and is held in place by the studs and bolts. Check that those 4 fasteners on the shock tower are tight.
Yeah, I was about to correct myself, the arms themselves (w/o the shock mount) can be swapped, back and forth accidentally, and that would push the top of the steering knuckle way forward, but wouldn't affect the shock angle. That's governed by the shape of the shock tower under the hood. The angle must be right.
I actually loosened the upper shock nuts and bolts and re-torqued them the other day as I noticed the book says 30 and 37lbft and I was way over that. For a minute, i thought it made a little difference, but I don't think it did.
I'm under there this weekend swapping out the motor mounts so I'll take look around and see if anything else is out of whack.
Curious what RSBeast sees when he looks at his.
I actually loosened the upper shock nuts and bolts and re-torqued them the other day as I noticed the book says 30 and 37lbft and I was way over that. For a minute, i thought it made a little difference, but I don't think it did.
I'm under there this weekend swapping out the motor mounts so I'll take look around and see if anything else is out of whack.
Curious what RSBeast sees when he looks at his.
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TECH Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 6,080
Likes: 17
From: So.Cal.
Yes, correct, the rubber flexes/twists between the bushing's outer shell and it's inner sleeve as the arm articulates...
but, there should be no free rotation between the outer shell and the inner sleeve, the rubber twisting is resisting this rotation
(if there is free rotation, then the rubber has become detached, and the bushing has failed)...
is this what you're asking...?
but, there should be no free rotation between the outer shell and the inner sleeve, the rubber twisting is resisting this rotation
(if there is free rotation, then the rubber has become detached, and the bushing has failed)...
is this what you're asking...?
Your last post is my dilemma; I have 3 sets of bushings from changing them out over the years and about half of them I can push in by hand, the other half will bottom out with a smack from a rubber mallet while I hold the arm in the air. This is true with both sides of the driver side arm, but the pass side requires my makeshift press rig to take them in and out.
I noticed today while changing the balljoints that the driver side lower balljoint doesn't take nearly as much pressure are the pass side to get it in. Looks like it's time to find a new set of upper and lower arms
I noticed today while changing the balljoints that the driver side lower balljoint doesn't take nearly as much pressure are the pass side to get it in. Looks like it's time to find a new set of upper and lower arms
