trackbird's alignment recommendations?
Thread Starter
TECH Enthusiast
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 702
Likes: 0
From: Lakeland, Fl
trackbird's alignment recommendations? I was just looking through some of your post on alignment and saw where you recomended 1/32 toe out for street use. Can you explain why you are using this? Also, for the set up you mentioned in the thread:
-1.3 camber
+4.5 caster
1/32 toe out
can any alignment shop do this or is it something that needs to be done w/specific equipment. My car is a 01TA WS6.
Thanks
-1.3 camber
+4.5 caster
1/32 toe out
can any alignment shop do this or is it something that needs to be done w/specific equipment. My car is a 01TA WS6.
Thanks
I'm not TB, but I am one of his groupies.
Toe out helps turn in and responsiveness to steering input. It also helps high speed stability.
Any alignment shop CAN align to specific specs. However many won't because of liabilty issues or will charge an arm and a leg.
TB ... how'd I do? I still haven't received that autographed picture you promised ...
Toe out helps turn in and responsiveness to steering input. It also helps high speed stability.
Any alignment shop CAN align to specific specs. However many won't because of liabilty issues or will charge an arm and a leg.
TB ... how'd I do? I still haven't received that autographed picture you promised ...
Originally Posted by mitchntx
I'm not TB, but I am one of his groupies.
TB ... how'd I do? I still haven't received that autographed picture you promised ...
TB ... how'd I do? I still haven't received that autographed picture you promised ...
Oh, no, no, no. I am but one of your many groupies. You are the Jedi master, I am just a humble scribe (though I swing a pretty mean torque wrench).
Mitch pretty much nailed it. Except he meant to say that toe out can decrease high speed stability (I have not had any issues with it, but that is how it makes the car turn better). By making the car "less stable" it naturally wants to change direction, if we make it only slightly less stable, it will change direction slightly better and have little to no negative effect on daily driving.
I usually have my alignments done at NTB (or by a friend) and they will do custom specs (they have so far).
I have to get the photos in the mail (I've not mailed them to anyone yet)....
Yes, toe out increases manueverability but decreases straight line stability, a common theme in many other areas as well. 1/32 is really too little to hurt stability; I think I had more than that wen I ran on the Salt Flats at 160 mph and had zero stability problems.
Thread Starter
TECH Enthusiast
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 702
Likes: 0
From: Lakeland, Fl
So using that setup on a daily driver will not give me problems except some more agressive tire ware? And when you say high speed problems, is 130-140mph high speed? Not that I drive that fast, just need to know......
I run that alignment on my daily driver. I had 30k on my tires (over 20k of that on this alignment) when I replaced them and the front tires had not yet hit the wear bars (they do wear more on the inside due to the negative camber), but the rears were shot and I replaced them all at once. So, I don't think you'll have any problems. And, my car is quite stable at high speeds and very high speeds.
I used to run 3/32nds toe out on my 3rd gen as a street car and it was still more than stable enough and tire wear was still very good.
I used to run 3/32nds toe out on my 3rd gen as a street car and it was still more than stable enough and tire wear was still very good.
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Originally Posted by 4mula1
That any where near the Morse-Granville jungle 
I think 90%+ of the people I've met in my life, have at one time or another lived in Columbus!
I think 90%+ of the people I've met in my life, have at one time or another lived in Columbus!
You notice, most of them don't live here now....
There may be a message there somewhere (though, I really like it here and Ive been here for almost 6 years now).
Remember, it's a jungle out there.
Originally Posted by trackbird
Oh, no, no, no. I am but one of your many groupies. You are the Jedi master, I am just a humble scribe (though I swing a pretty mean torque wrench).
Originally Posted by trackbird
Mitch pretty much nailed it. Except he meant to say that toe out can decrease high speed stability (I have not had any issues with it, but that is how it makes the car turn better)
If you can't get 4.5, you'll probably be closer to 5. But, if 4.3 is as far as it goes, use it. If 5 (or 4.8 or something) is as close as it gets, use that. It seems that most cars do 4.3 to 6 as a range of adjustment (meant to say that they seem to run higher, actual numbers vary between cars....alot).
Staging Lane
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 91
Likes: 11
From: SK, Canada
Originally Posted by mitchntx
I'm not TB, but I am one of his groupies.
Toe out helps turn in and responsiveness to steering input. It also helps high speed stability.
Any alignment shop CAN align to specific specs. However many won't because of liabilty issues or will charge an arm and a leg.
TB ... how'd I do? I still haven't received that autographed picture you promised ...
Toe out helps turn in and responsiveness to steering input. It also helps high speed stability.
Any alignment shop CAN align to specific specs. However many won't because of liabilty issues or will charge an arm and a leg.
TB ... how'd I do? I still haven't received that autographed picture you promised ...
ASCII ILLUSTRATION 101
\ /
Straight
| /
Right Turn
\ |
Left Turn
There is some exaggeration to this, but it should get the idea across. This is quite important with POSI, as the diff action tends to lean the car from neutral to understeer.
