New Street suspension setup - Strano Koni/Bilstien, plus some deviation from the norm
07-03-2004, 11:32 PM
#23
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Strano Parts, right? I'll have to look into this myself. I"m running Hotchkis on stock deCarbons and it sucks!!!! If this is the result, I'll shell out the cash for it, thanks for posting your results.
07-03-2004, 11:47 PM
#24
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Just an FYI. SLP Level 1 (eibachs I think) lower the car about 3/4 to 1".
http://www.angelfire.com/my/fastcar/suspension.html
This site has some good info on it in case anyone might need it.
JasonG
http://www.angelfire.com/my/fastcar/suspension.html
This site has some good info on it in case anyone might need it.
JasonG
07-07-2004, 09:11 PM
#25
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To those wondering about the alignemt mentioned above...
I just got my car aligned today. I aimed to achieve the specs that TTopJohn, mitchntx, and trackbird have recommended.
TTopJohn
-------------
CAMBER: -.7*
CASTER: +4* (max this out, priovided you still can get -.7* camber)
TOE IN: 1/32nd"
mitchntx
-------------
CAMBER: -1*
CASTER: +4.5*
TOE IN: 0"
I ended up with:
CAMBER: -0.6* (maxed out)
CASTER: +4.4* one side and +4.6* the other side (closest they could get)
TOE IN: 1/32
I noticed an improvement in steering. The car wanders a bit less and feels more confident on the highway. Its a bit calmer now.
Thanks for the advice guys.
I just got my car aligned today. I aimed to achieve the specs that TTopJohn, mitchntx, and trackbird have recommended.
TTopJohn
-------------
CAMBER: -.7*
CASTER: +4* (max this out, priovided you still can get -.7* camber)
TOE IN: 1/32nd"
mitchntx
-------------
CAMBER: -1*
CASTER: +4.5*
TOE IN: 0"
I ended up with:
CAMBER: -0.6* (maxed out)
CASTER: +4.4* one side and +4.6* the other side (closest they could get)
TOE IN: 1/32
I noticed an improvement in steering. The car wanders a bit less and feels more confident on the highway. Its a bit calmer now.
Thanks for the advice guys.
Last edited by VIP1; 07-07-2004 at 09:18 PM.
07-11-2004, 01:56 PM
#26
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Originally Posted by TTopJohn
Bit the bullet and ordered an all new suspension the other day from Sam Strano. I highly recommend Sam, he'll spend hours with you on the phone answering any questions you can come up with, and bringing up things you hadn't even thought of. I ended up with the normal Koni/Bilstien setup, with a few tweaks to ensure zero increase in NVH and account for the 111,000 miles on the car. Figured I would post up since I've been picking everyone's brain for about a year to come up with this, and someone might want to duplicate the whole thing or parts of it.
Up Front
Stock springs with Koni SAs on the lower perch for 3/4 inch drop.
35mm Hollow anti-roll bar with poly endlinks and poly bushings.
New rubber bushings (Lower control arm, Upper control arm) ball joints, tie rod ends - a mix of TRW & Moog parts.
In Back
Stock springs isolators removed and replaced with 5/8 heater hose, with 3rd Bilstiens
New moog rubber LCA bushings
Energy suspension poly panhard rod bushings,
poly torque arm bushing
The desire was to freshen the 111K mile dead stock suspension, not lower it (much - 3/4 inch drop should still clear everything), and end up with something that was a comfy BMW like daily driver, that could hold up to an occasional road course lapping event.
The increased stiffness of the 35mm front bar will let me run the Koni's softer for a better ride. The mix of mostly rubber and a few poly bushings should provide a solid suspension setup with no increase in NVH over stock.
Should be installed and aligned in about 2 weeks - I'll report back then.
Up Front
Stock springs with Koni SAs on the lower perch for 3/4 inch drop.
35mm Hollow anti-roll bar with poly endlinks and poly bushings.
New rubber bushings (Lower control arm, Upper control arm) ball joints, tie rod ends - a mix of TRW & Moog parts.
In Back
Stock springs isolators removed and replaced with 5/8 heater hose, with 3rd Bilstiens
New moog rubber LCA bushings
Energy suspension poly panhard rod bushings,
poly torque arm bushing
The desire was to freshen the 111K mile dead stock suspension, not lower it (much - 3/4 inch drop should still clear everything), and end up with something that was a comfy BMW like daily driver, that could hold up to an occasional road course lapping event.
The increased stiffness of the 35mm front bar will let me run the Koni's softer for a better ride. The mix of mostly rubber and a few poly bushings should provide a solid suspension setup with no increase in NVH over stock.
Should be installed and aligned in about 2 weeks - I'll report back then.
High speed sweepers were taken flatter than before, and mid-corner bumps did not make the car sidestep...in addition it had a overall solid-damped feel, like nothing was reaching the cabin. Transitions were well predicted and it took quite a bonehead move to get the car upset. Much like the 330i it did what was asked and didn't complain much when you did something you shouldn't be doing, lol.
I had some complaints however that I couldn't help by notice...first with the progressive springs...as I tried those before and they are a bit wallowy until they have a chance to take a set. Also I went with poly strut rod bushings, and that added some impact harshness that I vowed I would avoid with my next setup. The Eibach specifications for the SHO only lowered it about 0.75", so I had plenty of suspension travel for parking lot maneuvers and street obsticles, yet the lowered center of gravity worked extremely well at keeping a consistant arc around a skidpad for example and allowing for understeer/oversteer based on throttle response. It was awesome, but a little towards the extreme side for the performance targets I originally had in mind.. .mostly because of the poly strut rod bushings and stiff un-adjustable valving of the tokicos I was running.
Anyway I'm glad to hear there is an equivilent setup for f-bodies, and I'm sure this will be a great street setup for many people. Personally I'm working on a slightly different combination for the 'bird, which I'd love to describe and debate about options and characteristics soon.
07-11-2004, 02:11 PM
#27
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Btw, the alignment specs I went with (for the SHO) helped tremendously for the same type of application:
front
-------------
CAMBER: -0.75*
CASTER: +5.0 (achievable because I added caster/camber plates
TOE OUT: 1/32" (for a bit more turn-in response, sacrificed forward tracking)
rear
-------------
CAMBER: -0.50*
TOE OUT: 0
I believe it's interesting to note aligment specs across cars, and how they differ, but still with the same goal in mind for good handling...with these specs my front tires wore very evenly; with the spirited cornering I do the outer third didn't wear more like it did with mismatched stock alignment settings. The extra caster helped high-speed stability, and also increased camber dynamically as the wheel turned, since the front strut-link suspension did not gain camber like the double-a-arm setup of the f-body or other sports cars. Bite was was crisp on both ends and with sticky street tires I could hustle it around rotating the rear when I needed to and keep up with most cars in the mountians out here. I tried that (same road) with my stock f-body suspension and cringed at how unstable and "twitchy" it was when upset...something that I know now can be cured to address the same type of handling characteristics.
front
-------------
CAMBER: -0.75*
CASTER: +5.0 (achievable because I added caster/camber plates
TOE OUT: 1/32" (for a bit more turn-in response, sacrificed forward tracking)
rear
-------------
CAMBER: -0.50*
TOE OUT: 0
I believe it's interesting to note aligment specs across cars, and how they differ, but still with the same goal in mind for good handling...with these specs my front tires wore very evenly; with the spirited cornering I do the outer third didn't wear more like it did with mismatched stock alignment settings. The extra caster helped high-speed stability, and also increased camber dynamically as the wheel turned, since the front strut-link suspension did not gain camber like the double-a-arm setup of the f-body or other sports cars. Bite was was crisp on both ends and with sticky street tires I could hustle it around rotating the rear when I needed to and keep up with most cars in the mountians out here. I tried that (same road) with my stock f-body suspension and cringed at how unstable and "twitchy" it was when upset...something that I know now can be cured to address the same type of handling characteristics.
07-11-2004, 10:34 PM
#28
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Funny that you mention the late, great 1989 to 1995 SHO - it seems to be a common point of reference among a certain type of performance enthusiast.
I was on the Shotimes mailing list around 1994-96. If I could have found an MTX SHO in good shape locally in the 3 months I was car shopping back in early 1996, I would have bought one, but the market was mostly flooded with automatics after 93. I ended up with an LT1 Z28, and the rest is history.
V6 SHOs were great cars, do you still have your 91? Was it a "+" model?
I was on the Shotimes mailing list around 1994-96. If I could have found an MTX SHO in good shape locally in the 3 months I was car shopping back in early 1996, I would have bought one, but the market was mostly flooded with automatics after 93. I ended up with an LT1 Z28, and the rest is history.
V6 SHOs were great cars, do you still have your 91? Was it a "+" model?
07-12-2004, 01:24 PM
#29
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Spoke with Arlyn Strano on Friday and I'm definetly going to get this setup once I return from Italy. The SS will be a garage/around the block queen for the next three years until we return. Thanks LSTech for having a place to find out good info that works!!!
