Oops, I did it again. I have an f-body again
#81
So many tuners are all about low ride height and super stiff springs. It isn't uncommon for guys to run 800-1000# front springs on a Miata, which seems excessive to me. Some of picking a spring rate revolves around spring compression ratio in relation to the tire movement.
#82
Sadly because I've been going so hard on this it'll likely have crappy painters tape numbers, and because the base classing for an SS has it starting 7 points higher than a like Z28 *and* I can't dyno it before on an official dyno I'll be in the craziest of all TT classes, TTU, Unlimited. So no wins, but I'll get some baseline times to work from in the future.
Unfortunately we too have to run in an unlimited class, ITE. Not many cars run it, mainly us, a CTS-V, and a BMW. We usually manage to pull the win. We are in the process of converting the car to GT2 specs to run US Majors Tour, while building another one for GT2 as well (the 98 in my sig). As soon as it's done being built I'm going to start sending out sponsorship request packets, trying to pay attention to the details on this car, nobody wants to sponsor a pile!
Edit: Here is a link to a photo of the car with the owner/primary driver if anybody wants to see.
Last edited by FIVEPOINT7; 11-05-2016 at 02:35 PM.
#83
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 9,598
Likes: 144
From: Brookville, PA
So many tuners are all about low ride height and super stiff springs. It isn't uncommon for guys to run 800-1000# front springs on a Miata, which seems excessive to me. Some of picking a spring rate revolves around spring compression ratio in relation to the tire movement.
One of the reasons for this car was the springs and dampers that were on it to start with which allowed me to do some A/B testing to see if I felt I was still on the right path. I'm confident I am.
__________________
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
#84
They make the chassis stiffer. So in that way they "tighten" up the car. But generally when folks add "ride" to that, it's a shock issue more than anything. I'd need a more definitive explanation of you mean by tighten up the ride. What's it doing that you don't like?
SFC's are not bad things. Happy to supply them to you IF that's what we determine is the low hanging fruit. I am big on the right parts first, not whatever part is easy.
SFC's are not bad things. Happy to supply them to you IF that's what we determine is the low hanging fruit. I am big on the right parts first, not whatever part is easy.
Thanks
#85
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 9,598
Likes: 144
From: Brookville, PA
your car was designed from the start to be a convertible. All 4th gens were, and then converts had additional bracing added. What you have now it far stiffer than the comparison car. If you want SFC's that's fine, and it would further stiffen it. But usually the issue is more down to the front and rear suspension don't play well together, leading to a two-phase turn in feel like a bendy city bus.
__________________
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
#86
Ok but I gotta ask, what about on a high speed road course situation? Do you think the same given car would benefit from a little stiffer springs (not like 1000lbs/in)?
I would expect a 4th gen setup for auto-x to be a little softer than one setup for higher speed courses.
#87
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 9,598
Likes: 144
From: Brookville, PA
Well, it's going to Summit Point WV this weekend. I was just doing a brake swap tonight.
But no. It's not an aero car. And this whole notion of autox vs. road course setups has never made sense to me. Both require the same things to go fast. Balance, predictability, power down, stability. Car doesn't morph when on a track. And *IF* say I were to do 120 on the interstate, I don't want to die there either.
But no. It's not an aero car. And this whole notion of autox vs. road course setups has never made sense to me. Both require the same things to go fast. Balance, predictability, power down, stability. Car doesn't morph when on a track. And *IF* say I were to do 120 on the interstate, I don't want to die there either.
__________________
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
#88
I would like to eliminate or minimize the feeling that the car is twisting in the middle at times. My last convertible and don't laugh was my first car when I was 17, a 64 Impala SS in 1972. It had a full frame and if I remember correctly it felt more solid.
Thanks
Thanks
While SFCs certainly don't hurt, its likely not the issue. Most people are not used to driving cars with solid axles. The front will react to things differently than the rear(especially with shitty shocks) and many people perceive this as "flexing". It also doesn't help that its a PHB setup so the rear is moving in an arc and can "pull" the body over and down sometimes and you will feel it.
When I got my car I knew about the SFC hype that all these cars "need" them, while it was on my to-do list I wanted to first fix the terrible high speed stability (float, bob and weave), my car only had ~40,000 at the time and the "better" WS6 valved decarbon shocks, so its not like I was pushing high miles with worn out or leaking parts. After searching and talking to people (and almost falling for the QA1 hype at the time, ugh) I bought Koni SAs and simply put it was the best mod ive ever done. Not only did I get the high speed stability fixed (glued to the road, my god...) but my ride significantly improved (german sports sedan like, firm but not jarring, the few rattles i had went away the car became super solid) and what I thought was the "flex" was actually gone as well, the front and rear were WAY more in sync. The car was totally transformed.
Much later down the road I wanted to see if SFC's would do anything for me, after I had strano springs, strano swaybars, and I think I had the watts link at the time too I bought the bolt in 3 point SFC's and had them welded. Simply put they did nothing noticeable. The friend that welded them is an fbody owner and knows the ins and outs and rode with me after the job was done and was kinda confused, difference was I had fixed the "problem" with actual good shocks that do their job.
#89
your car was designed from the start to be a convertible. All 4th gens were, and then converts had additional bracing added. What you have now it far stiffer than the comparison car. If you want SFC's that's fine, and it would further stiffen it. But usually the issue is more down to the front and rear suspension don't play well together, leading to a two-phase turn in feel like a bendy city bus.
#91
Another reason I buy from you, you actually test different products, and not just your own and learn from it.
Ok but I gotta ask, what about on a high speed road course situation? Do you think the same given car would benefit from a little stiffer springs (not like 1000lbs/in)?
I would expect a 4th gen setup for auto-x to be a little softer than one setup for higher speed courses.
Ok but I gotta ask, what about on a high speed road course situation? Do you think the same given car would benefit from a little stiffer springs (not like 1000lbs/in)?
I would expect a 4th gen setup for auto-x to be a little softer than one setup for higher speed courses.
#92
your car was designed from the start to be a convertible. All 4th gens were, and then converts had additional bracing added. What you have now it far stiffer than the comparison car. If you want SFC's that's fine, and it would further stiffen it. But usually the issue is more down to the front and rear suspension don't play well together, leading to a two-phase turn in feel like a bendy city bus.
#94
#95
A loud F bomb exclaimed from my mouth...but could have been worse. That was the last time driving the car on. Bought a HF 12,000lb winch and have been slowly/safely winching ever since. I can load the car myself now and not need someone to guide me on.
#96
They also extend the jack points to the whole length of the rocker. Made it nice when I was down to one working jack while doing my trans/clutch swap.
#98
#99
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 9,598
Likes: 144
From: Brookville, PA
I generally recommend jacking front and rear if possible to minimize flex on the body SFC or not. If you just think about the weight you are lifting that way, the chassis will flex in doing so. Note nothing is infinitely stiff, certainly not a car. SFC's stiffen it, they don't eliminate flex.
So if you don't want to be twisting on the unibody more than necessary and feel SFC's are an important part of that, then I'd suspect you would not want to jack it up on a corner either if possible.
So if you don't want to be twisting on the unibody more than necessary and feel SFC's are an important part of that, then I'd suspect you would not want to jack it up on a corner either if possible.
__________________
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion