taman86

iTrader: (19)

So for the past couple of weeks I've been doing a lot of research regarding this very topic. I've come across some interesting info and I started piecing together somethings together. So at first, it was the ctsv gen 1 upgrade, with camaro rotors or c6 z06 rotors. Well that option doesn't seem viable to me for a couple of reasons:

1. I have to machine a camaro rotor which is perfect for the caliper, but I don't have access to a machinist locally so for functionality of the situation that's of the table.
2. Z06 rotors "can" work but doesn't fit the caliper perfectly, so that option is off the table, and I don't want to spend another couple hundred on caliper relocation brackets.

So then going through pages and pages of installs I came across an interesting post of a member stating that he used ATS calipers and that with base c7 rotors will basically bolt right up, only need to drill the spindle mounting holes to m14, even stock lines will work. That set up with base c7 rotor will give a 12.6 setup. Not bad.......

But then I came across another post possibly same individual, that said that the z51 caliper is essentially the same thing, just more expensive and longer mounting ears to the bracket, light bulb...... if it's essentially the same casting as the ATS calipers then those should work just fine with the larger C7 Z51 brake rotors, and still be essentially a bolt on upgrade, without having to get new lines or machine rotors or have mismatched rotors to calipers and EVERYTHING will be off the shelf parts that can be bought at ANY local parts store. So I started digging a little deeper into the rotors themselves and here's what I found:

1. The stock hat depth and the c7 hat depth are NEARLY IDENTICAL! Stock is 51.9mm, c7 is, get this, 51.0...... So the c7 rotor will sit pretty much identical on ls1 f body hubs.
2.Like I said already the c7 rotors are 12.6 and the z51 are 13.6.... So everything for the z51 priced out on rock auto comes out to 750 bucks shipped, just about the same as the ctsv kit but everything is truly bolt on and go.

So there you have it, pick your poison, 12.6 setup with ate calipers for around 400 to 500 or z51 13.6 setup for 750. It's not a true 14" but will be more then sufficient for track duty

handyandy

Logically it sounds like the Z51 brakes should work - as you say, the Z51 calipers are the exact same as the JL9 / Base C7 calipers, just with longer mounting ears. Ultimately somebody is going to have to be the guinea pig and try it out.

Just keep in mind that you likely won't be clearing stock 17" wheels with those 13.6" Z51's. That's the main reason I'm going with the 12.6" JL9 / ATS setup. I'd also question the overall gains of the Z51 over the JL9 - I've read elsewhere the Z51 package has 5% better braking performance, but I'm guessing that's in a high heat / track environment. To me, if the caliper bores are the same, and all I'm gaining is 1" diameter, I'm not sure it's worth the extra money (and especially not if it requires new wheels). But then again I don't track mine, so I'm just looking for everyday performance and pedal feel.

I'm still interested to see the outcome if you do this though.

taman86

iTrader: (19)

Ya I'm running 18s anyways but need to get new wheels, but I think I'm gonna still stick with 18s from oe wheels. They have a set of 18" c7 z06 replicas that look killer.
Sam strano runs a 12.8 wilwood setup and says that it's sufficient. I totally understand cost versus gain, but 700 bucks for 13.6 bbk is well worth the advantage versus a comparable aftermarket cost

BeatonZ06

That makes me wish I had 18" wheels to be able to run the Z51 brakes. I'm currently piecing the ATS with C7 rotor swap together. All I lack now is rotors.

taman86

iTrader: (19)

Check out rock auto. They seriously have the lowest prices from what I've seen, and many options for rotors

BeatonZ06

I'm spending a little more on rotors, just because I want the design I found. They're called Brakenetic RS rotors, and have a very neat slotted design. $185/pair shipped on ebay. I'm doing all 4 so they match.

taman86

iTrader: (19)

Oh ok those look pretty cool. Unfortunately for the z51 rotors on rock auto there's not a lot of options for the heavy duty brakes. Pretty much just ac Delco, and those are 80 bucks a rotor and they're slotted.

taman86

iTrader: (19)

So after doing a considerable amount more of research and comparisons I don't think i will be doing this after all. The c6 z06 appears to be the better option for the money. You get more brake for less money. I think the c7 z51 setup is a great option still but the cost is significantly higher, probably because that the car is still fairly new, and there don't appear to be any aftermarket 'reman' companies yet that have a stock of them. The Ats calipers new from ac Delco on rock auto are selling at 125 each. But the z51 calipers are selling at 340 each. For a VERY cost effective upgrade over stock, the ats setup can be had for 400 bucks roughly. But at 800 for a 13.6 z51 after everything is said and done, you can a 14" c6 z06 setup for 600 or 700 depending on what rotors you use. Plus that's a 6 piston design. Plus every thing is still off the shelf parts, and every thing is still bolt on, literally. Only thing needed is some washers to line up the caliper with the z06 rotor off set. Even uses the same size m10x1.25 bolts. Also flynbye sells a kit for the rear to use z06 13" rear rotors with the stock caliper and retains the parking brake.

I know a lot of debate has been given about upgrading the rear because f bodies have so much rear bias but this is my thought process:
the z06 use 14/13 set up, 6 positions in the front but only a single floating caliper in the rear with 42mm bore. So that would obviously put more emphasis on front braking, but use that same set up on the f body but with the stock caliper at 45mm bore, that would balance out the brake bias back to the rear like originally designed for. But utilizing a 13" rotor instead of the factor 12" just allows the factory braking to be more efficient. Plus it would just balance the overall look out better along with the performance aspect.

anybody have thoughts or opinions on this, or feedback from install?

The Batman

iTrader: (4)

The c6z brakes do not have the best track history.

taman86

iTrader: (19)

Ya I was reading up on that today. Some say they have had little to no problems, while others have had catastrophic failure. The ones that don't have problems either a. Do regular maintenance and/ or use ss brake lines, titanium shims, brake ducting, upgraded pad pins or b. Don't track their car as a true blue track car. The ones that have had problems use their cars as dedicated track car and the pins come out, or beat them so hard back to back to back that it boiled the fluid and toasted the seals. For aggressive street driving, auto x, or a weekend warrior, they seem to hold up on

taman86

iTrader: (19)

Also I read that the calipers are built by pbr, which are not known for building high performance brake systems, unlike brembo.

taman86

iTrader: (19)

I noticed that some later calipers were made by akebono, are there any noticeable advantages with those versus the pbr calipers?

dojob

regardless of either make... those c6z calipers on the front of a fbody with stock rear brakes will not work correctly, piston bores are not paired correctly with rear

taman86

iTrader: (19)

Yes agreed