Hurst Line Lock and Soft Pedal
02-11-2005, 04:08 PM
#1
Hurst Line Lock and Soft Pedal I need some opinions from you guys out there that have installed line lock on their cars. Recently I put in the SLM Hurst line lock kit. Installed it myself along with used Hawk pads with like 2000 miles on them and Goodridge braided brake lines.
I put it all back together and bled the system the old fashioned way (RR, LR, RF, LF) until the new ATE superblue came through each corner. Got it all back together and the pedal felt firm with the car off, but when the car is running I can push the pedal all the way till it runs out of travel. Line lock works fine and everything is tight with no leaks.
So then I'm pissed so I buy a Motive Powerbleeder (great system). Re-bleed the entire system and run another liter of the ATE though it and same thing, pedal can go to the floor. There's a guy at my work with the same year 2001 SS (stock untouched brakes) and his pedal is firm while the car's running and doesn't even come near the floor. Mine travels like twice as far as his when parked with the engine running!
The funny thing is that the car still stops well because I can lock up the ABS at 50 mph, but the pedal sure has to travel for this to happen.
I did some more digging on here and found one major mistake I made when installing the line lock, that I didn't bleed the air out of the new lines before tightening them down. I assume that air was pushed out the pass rear bleeder screw, instead.
So now I'm really pissed and take it to a shop to run the Tech 2 on it and bleed the ABS along with the entire system again. I pick up the car today and the freaking pedal still goes to the floor. It makes a whooshing sound as well as it's pushed down. Is this normal? Someone on here mentioned that the master cylinder might need bleeding? I mentioned that to the shop, but the mechanic had left for the day so I'll have to wait till Monday to see if he did it.
It is better than it was before because the pedal feels so much firmer when actually driving the car. It locks up the ABS at 60 mph but with less travel than before I took it in.
Is this whooshing sound normal when depressing the brake pedal?
Can a line lock cause the pedal to become softer?
Anyone else out there able to push there brake pedals to the floor with the engine running?
I'm freaking paranoid about the brakes on my car and just want to get everything back to normal. Thanks in advance for your help!
I put it all back together and bled the system the old fashioned way (RR, LR, RF, LF) until the new ATE superblue came through each corner. Got it all back together and the pedal felt firm with the car off, but when the car is running I can push the pedal all the way till it runs out of travel. Line lock works fine and everything is tight with no leaks.
So then I'm pissed so I buy a Motive Powerbleeder (great system). Re-bleed the entire system and run another liter of the ATE though it and same thing, pedal can go to the floor. There's a guy at my work with the same year 2001 SS (stock untouched brakes) and his pedal is firm while the car's running and doesn't even come near the floor. Mine travels like twice as far as his when parked with the engine running!
The funny thing is that the car still stops well because I can lock up the ABS at 50 mph, but the pedal sure has to travel for this to happen.
I did some more digging on here and found one major mistake I made when installing the line lock, that I didn't bleed the air out of the new lines before tightening them down. I assume that air was pushed out the pass rear bleeder screw, instead.
So now I'm really pissed and take it to a shop to run the Tech 2 on it and bleed the ABS along with the entire system again. I pick up the car today and the freaking pedal still goes to the floor. It makes a whooshing sound as well as it's pushed down. Is this normal? Someone on here mentioned that the master cylinder might need bleeding? I mentioned that to the shop, but the mechanic had left for the day so I'll have to wait till Monday to see if he did it.
It is better than it was before because the pedal feels so much firmer when actually driving the car. It locks up the ABS at 60 mph but with less travel than before I took it in.
Is this whooshing sound normal when depressing the brake pedal?
Can a line lock cause the pedal to become softer?
Anyone else out there able to push there brake pedals to the floor with the engine running?
I'm freaking paranoid about the brakes on my car and just want to get everything back to normal. Thanks in advance for your help!
02-11-2005, 05:08 PM
#2
Man... it sounds like it just needs to bled more, but from your description you already bled the hell out it. Don't know what to tell you... it took a good deal of bleeding the old fashioned way on my line lock, but my brake pressure is just like it was before the line lock.
02-11-2005, 06:46 PM
#3
Thanks Thanzor. It's good to hear that at least one person out there has normal pedal after installing one of these. Did you have abnormal pedal after the first bleed? How many times did it take you to get good pedal?
For mine, almost three full liters of brake fluid have been run though the brake system in three separate occasions over the past two weeks. Once with the two-man method, once with the Powerbleeder, and once more by a professional mechanic. I don't know what he used, but I bet it was some type of pressure bleeder.
I saw on the truck forum that one guy put a anti-flowback valve on all the openings and then opened all four bleeders screws at once. Pump, Pump, and Pump and it fixed his problem. I could do the same thing with the Powerbleeder. I don't see why this would be better than one at a time, but it's an idea.
I'd like to hear from some more folks to put my line lock paranoia to rest...
For mine, almost three full liters of brake fluid have been run though the brake system in three separate occasions over the past two weeks. Once with the two-man method, once with the Powerbleeder, and once more by a professional mechanic. I don't know what he used, but I bet it was some type of pressure bleeder.
I saw on the truck forum that one guy put a anti-flowback valve on all the openings and then opened all four bleeders screws at once. Pump, Pump, and Pump and it fixed his problem. I could do the same thing with the Powerbleeder. I don't see why this would be better than one at a time, but it's an idea.
I'd like to hear from some more folks to put my line lock paranoia to rest...
02-12-2005, 06:18 AM
#4
Last night, a friend and I bled a completely bone dry system, without ABS.
I had been told many years ago that when one flushes an existing solid system, the RR, LR, RF, LF method is best because it minimizes the amount of fluid one uses to flush the system.
When chasing and air bubble, one needs to flush just the opposite ... RF, LF, RR, LR. This pushes the air bubble(s) thought the system. It starts at one end and forces it though.
Last night, we used the latter system. after bench bleeding the MC, we opened all 4 bleeder screws and let gravity do it's things. Once we had fluid at each caliper, we then bled RF, LF, RR, LR. The pedal is hard as a rock.
When you used a power bleeder, did it push the fluid or was it the type that sucked the fluid?
I had been told many years ago that when one flushes an existing solid system, the RR, LR, RF, LF method is best because it minimizes the amount of fluid one uses to flush the system.
When chasing and air bubble, one needs to flush just the opposite ... RF, LF, RR, LR. This pushes the air bubble(s) thought the system. It starts at one end and forces it though.
Last night, we used the latter system. after bench bleeding the MC, we opened all 4 bleeder screws and let gravity do it's things. Once we had fluid at each caliper, we then bled RF, LF, RR, LR. The pedal is hard as a rock.
When you used a power bleeder, did it push the fluid or was it the type that sucked the fluid?
02-12-2005, 11:37 AM
#5
The Motive Powerbleeder is a pressure type bleeder. It has a chemical sprayer type tank with a pressure gauge on it. You put some brake fluid in the tank, clamp down the seal on the brake fluid reservoir and pump it up. I was pumping to about 17 psi. Now you go around to each bleeder screw just open them up and the old fluid is forced out while new fluid from the tank is drawn in.
I'll try opening all four at the same time and then follow that with the reverse order bubble chase method.
Another interesting thing as I was messing around. I activated the line lock and then pumped the pedal a few times and it was very firm. Released the line lock and it went back to mushy. I'm hoping that there's no air bubbles from the master cylinder to the line lock solenoid which means I don't need to bleed the MC. And since the pedal got firm with the line lock activated then it seems logical to say that the bubbles are in the front lines and not the rear. Comments?
I'll try opening all four at the same time and then follow that with the reverse order bubble chase method.
Another interesting thing as I was messing around. I activated the line lock and then pumped the pedal a few times and it was very firm. Released the line lock and it went back to mushy. I'm hoping that there's no air bubbles from the master cylinder to the line lock solenoid which means I don't need to bleed the MC. And since the pedal got firm with the line lock activated then it seems logical to say that the bubbles are in the front lines and not the rear. Comments?
