kocheroni

Hey everyone,
I just registered today, after searching for information and finding out just how useful this site was. I should start off by saying I understand how to remove calipers and have successfully done it on other cars. However, when I heard squeeking and realized it was time to change my brake pads, I was sad to see the following as part of the calipers.





Those three pictures illustrate the caliper, the 2 guide pins, and a close up of one of the guide pins. This is a 1992 25th anniversary Camaro RS. The other couple cars I've changed pads/rotors only required a socket to take it off, however this looks like I need a Alen (sp?) wrench. Am I correct, and if so, does anyone know the diameter needed to take these pins out?

mitchntx

iTrader: (14)

The car's you are used to working on have a bolt that screws into the guide pin.

The car pictured, has a guide pin on the bottom 3/4 of the pin and the top 1/4 is threaded. You unscrew everything out.

It's a standard size. Go to your local parts store and get an Allen head socket for a late model GM. They are all the same and any parts guy worth his salt will know ...

mitchntx

iTrader: (14)

BTW ... welcome aboard ...

To kind of give you a history lesson on what all has happened over the last few years ...

stock rotors warp, Aimco from autozone worked great for a while, now Brembo OEMs are the ****.

don't even ask why cross-drilled and slotted rotors suck. They just do.

Bilstein HDs are just fine for a daily driver

BMR = K-Mart

Rod ends are the **** ... cheap ones suck

trackbird is my hero ...

trackbird

iTrader: (4)

No, you sir are my hero.

Yes, you need a 3/8" allen wrench or allen socket. I bought a 3/8" allen wrench mounted to a 3/8 drive "socket" and used it to change brakes on my '89 Formula many times over the years (and yes, I'm that old auto parts guy Mitch mentioned that would know the size).

Here you go (Lisle makes good stuff, either one will be fine).

http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/produ...id=00947742000

Or.

http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/produ...id=00946665000

trackbird

iTrader: (4)

In a single post, you've actually condensed the entire forum down to a single paragraph. My work here is done.

Actually, I used the Aimco rotors over the years (on my 3rd gen) and warped several sets of them, that's why I personally switched to the Brembo OEM's. But that's way off topic.....

kocheroni

Thanks everyone for the help. Trackbird and Mitch were extremely helpful. This should be relatively easy, just gotta go get the rotors.

kocheroni

So I changed the rotors/pads. It took a little time to figure out how to get the rotor off, as I wasn't familiar w/ the little pin/bolt setup that actually holds on the rotor. Once i figured that out though, I got the new rotor on and brakes on pretty quick. i did the other side in about 20-30 minutes, so I was really happy. Now I have a huge problem though. The car worked fine/braked fine at first. About 1/2 a mile of driving, or not even though, I see smoke and the wheel is getting sticky (feels mis-aligned). Well when I stop to see waht's up, the car doesn't even want to move, I relaly have to give it gas to get the front wheels to spin.

I limped the car home, and now the front left wheel does not even spin (the right one seems to be fine). Anyone know why this is, or what I did wrong that would cause this? I compressed the cylinder w/ a c-clamp, and got everything fitted back together fine. Could this be because I didn't have the lid off the brake fluid resevoir while doing the change? Also, what could be possible remedies?

trackbird

iTrader: (4)

You did pack the wheel bearings in grease before you installed the new rotors, didn't you?

The first question is if the wheel is stuck because of a brake problem or a wheel bearing problem.

If it's a brake that is sticking/dragging, etc you should have a rotor that is dark in color or has dark streaks (burn marks?) on it. If it's a wheel bearing problem, that is going to be easy to find by removing the caliper and pads and trying to turn the wheel. If it's still stuck, it's a bearing problem.

Quesion, how tight did you make the "castle nut" (the nut that has the notches in it that you had to pull the cotter pin and unbolt to remove the rotor)? If you torqued it down tight, you have probably burned up the wheel bearings (and will need to replace the "races" that the bearings ride on that are pressed into the brake rotor). You only need to snug it down to remove the slop and back it off sligtly (you don't want to be able to rock the wheel and feel any slop, but not much tighter than needed to remove that slop).

Answer those and we'll try to help you figure it out from there.

kocheroni

Ahh, pretty good questions you asked. No to the first one, I took the old bearings out of the old rotor and put them on the new one, as I figured that they didn't really wear down. Should i have replaced those? They were covered in grease already.

I will check the front/back of the rotor tomorrow. There was definately smoke coming from which (towards the backside of the rotor) which led me to believe it was a caliper problem, but perhaps it is the bearings. not quite sure what you mean by the races. I did snug the front bolt in quite a bit, so I'll have to take a look. Hope I didn't do any permanent damage to this. I'll take pictures tomorrow (as good as possible) to help diagnose the situation.

trackbird

iTrader: (4)

When you placed the bearings into the rotors, they landed on a "tapered" area inside that rotor. That is a "race" it is a machined surface that the bearings roll on. If you overheat the bearings (and if you torqued that nut "pretty good", you probably have overheated them), the race can be damaged from the heat.

You should always put some grease inside the rotor and add some to the wheel bearings when you change rotors. Turn that big nut until it's "snug", then back it off slightly (grab the disc and try to wiggle it, if you can feel it move and then "catch", it's too loose, but it needs to be just tight enough to not wobble). You do not want to torque that nut, it needs to be barely tight (very slightly "not loose"?). You may need to get a service manual or find some assistance (in the interest of safety) to complete this (we'll help as much as we can).

mitchntx

iTrader: (14)

What did I say?

kocheroni

Trackbird, tons of advice, it's much appreciated. I actually ordered the chiltons manual for the car as I figured that I will come along other things I have to do over time. I have one for a 1988 Lebaron I have and it has done wonders in providing me with information on pretty much anything I could need.

trackbird

iTrader: (4)

Nah, I'm just picking up the slack for you so you can have a night off.....

By the way, the races in the rotors can be replaced if the bearings are damaged (from overtightening the nut/lack of grease). When you buy new wheel bearings, you'll get new races with them. A machine shop (NAPA usually and others) can do it for you. We don't yet know if you will need bearings, but if you do, make sure you have the races changed or you can damage the new bearings with the old races. I just wanted to clarify that you can change the races in the rotors.

You do not have to replace the bearings with the rotors, but you do have to inspect them. If they are discolored or pitted (the actual roller surfaces), they should be replaced. If they are smooth and silver/grey in color (the surface of the rollers), they are usually fine to reuse. Once you see a bad set, you'll know what the difference is. Until then, take a good look and if you are not sure, take good pictures and we'll go from there.

And, you absolutely must put the cotter pin back in the end of the spindle (the "pin and nut") to keep the nut from coming off and taking the wheel with it. It doesn't look like much, but you MUST HAVE that pin in place. I'm not saying that you didn't re-install it, I just wanted to make sure that you did.

kocheroni

Yea, i reinstalled everything pretty much the way it came off, pin & all. I have a feeling I might have overtightened that bolt, not greased it enough or possibly something else stupid. I'll take a look @ it tomorrow morning. The only weird thing is why the right side worked fine and not the left.

Are you really supposed to bleed the brakes after doing a brake job if you haven't opened the system, or is that just what people say?

kocheroni

Looks like its frozen caliper. I removed teh guide pins and can't get anything to budge even an inch. I hit it w/ a hammer a couple times but that didn't seem to loosen it up at all (normally it's fairly easy to take off). At this point, that's why I figure it's not the rotor, but instead the caliper piston.

kocheroni

opened up the screw connecting the brake line to finally get it open, got the caliper off, put new caliper on, and it seems fine thanks all.

trackbird

iTrader: (4)

Excellent.

I'd still pull the nut off of the rotor, pull the outer bearing, pack some grease in there (wheel bearing grease), put some in the outer bearing and reinstall the nut (snug) and the cotter pin. If you tightened those nuts very much, you may still have bearing problems (if not now, soon) in the future. Just to be safe.

Have fun!