Switch from ProKit to DMS or Hotchkis?
Switch from ProKit to DMS or Hotchkis? I purchased revalved Bilstein shocks and the LT1 eiback prokit from Sam Strano in January and was thinking of switching to a different spring. I don't like that the front fender/wheel gap is bigger than the rear gap and i really like the stance the DMS springs provide and the Hotchkis a little less.
Will i have a problem switching to either of these springs with the revalved Bilsteins? I would also like to hear what the difference in performance or ride quality i will see if i switch to either of these. Thanks!
Will i have a problem switching to either of these springs with the revalved Bilsteins? I would also like to hear what the difference in performance or ride quality i will see if i switch to either of these. Thanks!
You really ought to ask the guy who did the valving, because nobody on this forum or any other can know what I did to your shocks.
I'd recommend if you want to change that you use Hotchkis springs. The rates are a bit less than the Pro-kits are, and would leave you in a situation where you do not have a lack of damping. Also, despite the numbers that are commonly published the working rate of the Hotchkis springs are not very progressive, but more linear in their action. This is good because the spring rate is not always in flux and you don't run into issues with shock valving being wrong based on spring rate changes. The Pro-kits you have are also much more linear in their action (the close coils on the top of you front springs go dead and are out of play when at all loaded, not adding to active rate). Given you shocks are valved for a spring like that, and a certain area of spring rate, the Hotchkis are more similar.
I have the Hotchkis in stock as well....
I'd recommend if you want to change that you use Hotchkis springs. The rates are a bit less than the Pro-kits are, and would leave you in a situation where you do not have a lack of damping. Also, despite the numbers that are commonly published the working rate of the Hotchkis springs are not very progressive, but more linear in their action. This is good because the spring rate is not always in flux and you don't run into issues with shock valving being wrong based on spring rate changes. The Pro-kits you have are also much more linear in their action (the close coils on the top of you front springs go dead and are out of play when at all loaded, not adding to active rate). Given you shocks are valved for a spring like that, and a certain area of spring rate, the Hotchkis are more similar.
I have the Hotchkis in stock as well....
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Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
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www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
Originally Posted by Sam Strano
You really ought to ask the guy who did the valving, because nobody on this forum or any other can know what I did to your shocks.
I'd recommend if you want to change that you use Hotchkis springs. The rates are a bit less than the Pro-kits are, and would leave you in a situation where you do not have a lack of damping. Also, despite the numbers that are commonly published the working rate of the Hotchkis springs are not very progressive, but more linear in their action. This is good because the spring rate is not always in flux and you don't run into issues with shock valving being wrong based on spring rate changes. The Pro-kits you have are also much more linear in their action (the close coils on the top of you front springs go dead and are out of play when at all loaded, not adding to active rate). Given you shocks are valved for a spring like that, and a certain area of spring rate, the Hotchkis are more similar.
I have the Hotchkis in stock as well....
I'd recommend if you want to change that you use Hotchkis springs. The rates are a bit less than the Pro-kits are, and would leave you in a situation where you do not have a lack of damping. Also, despite the numbers that are commonly published the working rate of the Hotchkis springs are not very progressive, but more linear in their action. This is good because the spring rate is not always in flux and you don't run into issues with shock valving being wrong based on spring rate changes. The Pro-kits you have are also much more linear in their action (the close coils on the top of you front springs go dead and are out of play when at all loaded, not adding to active rate). Given you shocks are valved for a spring like that, and a certain area of spring rate, the Hotchkis are more similar.
I have the Hotchkis in stock as well....
So Sam, you don't think it would be a good idea to switch to the DMS springs? I really like the stance of the DMS's. Would i need to get my shocks revalved again?
Here's the issue. DMS doesn't say anything really about their spring rates, which poses an issue to me since the shock's job is to damp the springs. Then your shocks were valved to damp the springs you have. If you can get Eric to give you the rates, that'd be a start.
But, having looked at the pictures of the DMS springs, the way they are wound and the size of the wire diameter I'm quite sure they are stiffer than I valved for, and are definitely more changeable in working rate.
For what it's worth, if you are looking ot increase your rear wheel gap, that's easy to do with the springs you have. Just put some hose around the top coil of the spring along with the isolator (you do have the isolator in, right?).
But, having looked at the pictures of the DMS springs, the way they are wound and the size of the wire diameter I'm quite sure they are stiffer than I valved for, and are definitely more changeable in working rate.
For what it's worth, if you are looking ot increase your rear wheel gap, that's easy to do with the springs you have. Just put some hose around the top coil of the spring along with the isolator (you do have the isolator in, right?).
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Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
I understand now. This is the spring rate for the DMS Springs i found online:
Front 325-630, Rear 95-160 (lbs/in)
Compared to the eibachs (is this right?)
Front 377-600, Rear 94-160 (lbs/in)
I thought about increasing the gap in the rear, but the other reason why i want to go with DMS is that the front looks lower than the eibachs, judging from the cars i've seen them on. Don't get me wrong I love the ride and handling the way the car is now but i want to see if i can improve the stance. What do you think Sam? Thanks!
Front 325-630, Rear 95-160 (lbs/in)
Compared to the eibachs (is this right?)
Front 377-600, Rear 94-160 (lbs/in)
I thought about increasing the gap in the rear, but the other reason why i want to go with DMS is that the front looks lower than the eibachs, judging from the cars i've seen them on. Don't get me wrong I love the ride and handling the way the car is now
but i want to see if i can improve the stance. What do you think Sam? Thanks! I know the spring rates listed online for a few springs are flat out wrong, so I wouldn't go with that until you hear from the horse's mouth. Aside from that, the way the springs are wound dictate how much of that rate is in play at 1" of compression or 3". In other words the "rates" only tell you the softest and the stiffest, not what happens in the interim which is 95% of the time. The shocks can handle the stiffest rates fine from what I see here. But the unknown is what happens when you are damping the middle range??????
I can't answer that because I don't use those springs. I've have issues with cheap springs. I don't know who is making the DMS springs, or what they are made from. Further I've had offers from springs companies to supply me springs (and at price that would make me a lot more money) but I don't do it because I'm not comfortable with either the rates, the windings and/or knowing their origin.
The DMS's are wound a way I don't like. The rates aren't horrible at all. A number of folks like them, but that's not good enough for me because a lot of folks like a lot of stuff that I don't.
In the end it's your call. I'd use the Hotchkis myself.
I can't answer that because I don't use those springs. I've have issues with cheap springs. I don't know who is making the DMS springs, or what they are made from. Further I've had offers from springs companies to supply me springs (and at price that would make me a lot more money) but I don't do it because I'm not comfortable with either the rates, the windings and/or knowing their origin.
The DMS's are wound a way I don't like. The rates aren't horrible at all. A number of folks like them, but that's not good enough for me because a lot of folks like a lot of stuff that I don't.
In the end it's your call. I'd use the Hotchkis myself.
__________________
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
Ok, i think i will go with the Hotchkis Will i need another alignment afterwards? How long would it take to ship the springs to 90606? I will also need an adjustable panhard rod, which one do you recommend? Sorry for all the Q's but you've been good at getting back to me
Will i need another alignment afterwards? How long would it take to ship the springs to 90606? I will also need an adjustable panhard rod, which one do you recommend? Sorry for all the Q's but you've been good at getting back to me Trending Topics
It might be time for you to call me. I can address all your questions at once that way.
__________________
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
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Any time you change the front ride height, you also change the suspension geometry. So if you go lower or higher, yes, you would need an alignment.
For APHR, I would skip the poly ones and go straight for a rod ended one. There SHOULD be no noise increase as the APHR just doesn't transmit noise like the LCA's would.
For APHR, I would skip the poly ones and go straight for a rod ended one. There SHOULD be no noise increase as the APHR just doesn't transmit noise like the LCA's would.
