Bilstein coilovers for SS
09-22-2005, 12:45 PM
#6
If you want adjustable damping, and coil-overs you are going to end up using KYB AGX's or Koni's. Bilstein doesn't have an adjustable damper for the car.
I strongly suggest that you opt for Koni's over the KYB's. The Koni's are a far superior shock in a number of ways. Then we use a coil-over sleeve setup, I use Ground Control. The entire setup starts at $1130 for 4 Koni's and the GC kit setup for you needs. You get the choice of spring rates, ride height adjustment and damping rate adjustment *and* save yourself about $1k. Even if you opted for Double Adjustable Koni's with the GC's you are looking at just over $1600 and then you get separate compression and rebound adjustments as well.
I strongly suggest that you opt for Koni's over the KYB's. The Koni's are a far superior shock in a number of ways. Then we use a coil-over sleeve setup, I use Ground Control. The entire setup starts at $1130 for 4 Koni's and the GC kit setup for you needs. You get the choice of spring rates, ride height adjustment and damping rate adjustment *and* save yourself about $1k. Even if you opted for Double Adjustable Koni's with the GC's you are looking at just over $1600 and then you get separate compression and rebound adjustments as well.
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Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
09-22-2005, 04:06 PM
#7
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I was thinking of the QAI's single adjustables if the koni's are that cheap I might go with them . I don't want the double adjustable just to many setting I don't have the time to set it up
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09-22-2005, 04:11 PM
#8
Many folks think that Koni's are like a minimum or $1k.... They aren't. You can get into 4 Koni's for $705.
FWIW, based on damping performance comparing a Koni to a QA1 is like comparing a Corvette to a Chevette. The difference is so huge between the two it's laughable. The KYB AGX would be a better choice than the QA1. The adjuster is a joke, the shocks aren't even gas charged which keeps the cavitation away and ensures the damping after an hour is the same as it was after 2 minutes. The Koni's adjustment is on the shock piston, the QA1 simply opens a bigger hole to let oil pass to the outer chamber. Because of this the Koni's are much better at dealing with sudden sharp hits (they essentially blow some force off) because the piston reacts to that impact. The QA1's can't react to that change in force, so if you have them stiff, they become very jarring.
FWIW, based on damping performance comparing a Koni to a QA1 is like comparing a Corvette to a Chevette. The difference is so huge between the two it's laughable. The KYB AGX would be a better choice than the QA1. The adjuster is a joke, the shocks aren't even gas charged which keeps the cavitation away and ensures the damping after an hour is the same as it was after 2 minutes. The Koni's adjustment is on the shock piston, the QA1 simply opens a bigger hole to let oil pass to the outer chamber. Because of this the Koni's are much better at dealing with sudden sharp hits (they essentially blow some force off) because the piston reacts to that impact. The QA1's can't react to that change in force, so if you have them stiff, they become very jarring.
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Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
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13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
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www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
10-05-2005, 03:45 PM
#9
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Originally Posted by Sam Strano
Many folks think that Koni's are like a minimum or $1k.... They aren't. You can get into 4 Koni's for $705.
FWIW, based on damping performance comparing a Koni to a QA1 is like comparing a Corvette to a Chevette. The difference is so huge between the two it's laughable. The KYB AGX would be a better choice than the QA1. The adjuster is a joke, the shocks aren't even gas charged which keeps the cavitation away and ensures the damping after an hour is the same as it was after 2 minutes. The Koni's adjustment is on the shock piston, the QA1 simply opens a bigger hole to let oil pass to the outer chamber. Because of this the Koni's are much better at dealing with sudden sharp hits (they essentially blow some force off) because the piston reacts to that impact. The QA1's can't react to that change in force, so if you have them stiff, they become very jarring.
FWIW, based on damping performance comparing a Koni to a QA1 is like comparing a Corvette to a Chevette. The difference is so huge between the two it's laughable. The KYB AGX would be a better choice than the QA1. The adjuster is a joke, the shocks aren't even gas charged which keeps the cavitation away and ensures the damping after an hour is the same as it was after 2 minutes. The Koni's adjustment is on the shock piston, the QA1 simply opens a bigger hole to let oil pass to the outer chamber. Because of this the Koni's are much better at dealing with sudden sharp hits (they essentially blow some force off) because the piston reacts to that impact. The QA1's can't react to that change in force, so if you have them stiff, they become very jarring.
Nice Info, I have the G2 coil-overs with revalved Bilstein's.
I would like to change these to Koni's. maybe i could send them down to Sam
and have them re-built?
10-05-2005, 06:22 PM
#10
LG's coil-overs are a complete kit that uses the acutal shock body as the threaded portion. Can't use Koni's with those, but you can put coil-over sleeves onto Koni's. That's what I have on my car.
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Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
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www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
10-05-2005, 07:29 PM
#11
Originally Posted by Red Cell
Nice Info, I have the G2 coil-overs with revalved Bilstein's.
I would like to change these to Koni's. maybe i could send them down to Sam
and have them re-built?
I would like to change these to Koni's. maybe i could send them down to Sam
and have them re-built?
I considered both setups for awhile, and then ended up going to LGM.
10-05-2005, 08:06 PM
#12
Red Cell will have to answer for himself. But we've replaced a couple of sets with Koni/Ground Control kits for customers (who came to me). Some of the complaints were the lack of adjustability, and noise from the rod-ends those were the two most common. One person didn't like the damping so much he has them dynoed so I could revalve them. I wouldn't because I wasn't going to get in the middle of it. However, I saw the curves and know just what I don't like about them aside from the fact you can't adjust them. I won't say here as it's not my place to give out those kind of details randomly over the internet. But I know, and I will use it when people call me to compare and contrast my setup to theirs. You hear the reason for the lack of adjustable shocks is so you don't screw them up, or if they work they don't need to be adjusted. That's pretty good salesmanship. However, if damping is "perfect", then why not ride height? Why offer a coil-over at all? The reason is that adjustment is important. I just played with my damping last weekend on my car....
In the end, for less money you get a lot of practical use of out adjustable shocks. You get all the advantages of a coil-over kit, run the springs you want, set the ride height you want, corner weight the car if you want. And the adjustable damping, rebound on SA Koni's, or bump and rebound both on DA Koni's. Even if you drop all the money on DA's and the coil-overs you have spent on the order of $500 too.
MHO.
In the end, for less money you get a lot of practical use of out adjustable shocks. You get all the advantages of a coil-over kit, run the springs you want, set the ride height you want, corner weight the car if you want. And the adjustable damping, rebound on SA Koni's, or bump and rebound both on DA Koni's. Even if you drop all the money on DA's and the coil-overs you have spent on the order of $500 too.
MHO.
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www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
10-06-2005, 02:36 AM
#13
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I believe that since the LGM coil-over kit uses a motorsport bilstien, and not a simple OEM upgrade, then the only option to fitting a Koni would be to consult the Koni motorsport catalog. I want to believe that LG does offer the option of different shocks upon sale, and maybe afterwards also, but that's not my place to speculate.
Here's a Koni catalog just to get an idea. Just be aware that Bump adjustment is a little more of a complicated task than meets the eye.
http://www.koni-na.com/pdfcatalogs/K...ortCatalog.pdf
http://www.koni.com/_racing/frame.html
That's all I really can mention, since I haven't attempted nor advised on what would fit the LG coil-over sockets that the shocks mount to. Acutally, another thing I can mention is that if you should go with the Koni 2812's shocks, they certainly won't be cost effective, since they're almost twice the price of the LG kit itself.
Here's a Koni catalog just to get an idea. Just be aware that Bump adjustment is a little more of a complicated task than meets the eye.
http://www.koni-na.com/pdfcatalogs/K...ortCatalog.pdf
http://www.koni.com/_racing/frame.html
That's all I really can mention, since I haven't attempted nor advised on what would fit the LG coil-over sockets that the shocks mount to. Acutally, another thing I can mention is that if you should go with the Koni 2812's shocks, they certainly won't be cost effective, since they're almost twice the price of the LG kit itself.
Last edited by Foxxton; 10-06-2005 at 02:42 AM.
