I'm looking to buy Ground Control coil-overs very soon. I'm looking to have stock height(Bilstein) when I drag race and have it lowered 2 inches when I'm riding on my 19s. Do you guys think the kit can perform that function efficiently? Thanks

 

Yes you can have the height adj you want, but anytime you change height it screws with the alignment. Also the kit does not reuse you springs. All the coil over kits change to the standard 2.75 in race spring which is cheaper and is avail in 25 lb/in increments. I have installed both the Global west and the ground control. The GW using is much stronger. it puts the spring force into thestock spring mount at the top where the GC unit pits the force onto the shock shaft. The shaft was never designed to take that force. That may be fine in a 2500lb rice rocket, but my 3500lb car puts a bit more stress on parts. A failure on this part could kill you.

 

Good point Bill, have you heard of anyone running into those problems with the shaft giving out?

Shaitiger, I'm running the GC's and I think they're great. I'm interested to see what Sam Strano would advise on this.....he runs GC's as well.

<small>[ April 17, 2002, 05:20 PM: Message edited by: Diesel ]</small>

 

Do have a link to this ground control. Sounds like something I might like. What can you do with it?

 

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Cool28:
<strong>Do have a link to this ground control. Sounds like something I might like. What can you do with it?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Ground Control's allow height adjustment up to 3" on ost cars and 2.5" on our cars I think (maybe 3" too). They are a perfect answer for me daily driver/show car. When I enter a show, I can jack the car up and slam it. When it's time to drive to work....jack it up and raise it and inch. The link to GC is Ground-Control.com check them out for more info, though be warned the site can be somewhat confusing.

 

TTT

 

the dampening forces that the shock shaft see can be 3-4 time larger than the force that the spring exerts. therefore, the shock shaft is actually plenty strong. the problem witht the gc kit the gw points out, is that the spring force is transmitted through the upper shock mount, which is rubber isolated. this could be a problem, but more than likely it is just a salespitch. in no way should the gc system cause a life threatening accident. their should be no reliability issues with the ground control system what so ever. imo, there is no way i would pay that king of money for the gw system when the ground control is totally adequate at half the price.

<small>[ April 19, 2002, 08:58 AM: Message edited by: ktm520 ]</small>

 

Remember the dampening forces are not a latteral force on the shaft. I have seen the top of a Koni sport snap off easily. and then this car had a GC unit installed. too much risk for me. The GW unit is much cheaper if purchased without springs, and then buy your own spring from any racecar supply shop in a sane spring rate. GW uses an 800+lb/in rate in their kit. Also the thread on the GW unit is much easier to turn, even under load. the GC thread is harder to use under load. After installing both units I was less than impressed with the GC unit. GW is not the best company to deal with, but if you go thru a vendor they have by far a better product. The LG coil over kit I hear is top notch, but costly if you allready have shocks.

 

When you think about it, all the coil-over kits, whether they be the stock spring, GC or GW apply force to the same places.....

With a GW kit, you have a little hat that adapts the spring to the upper mount.

With a GC kit you have a little hat that tapers down at the top and *appears* to apply more stress to the rod. However, it does not. The upper mount still goes on top, and the hat still applied that force into the upper mount.

BUT, think about a stock setup..... The shock rod is all that holds the stock spring on when it's not in the car. Once it's on the car, the weight of the car pushes down on the upper mount. The mount then pushes on the spring, which pushes on the perch...... The rod isn't really stressed at all when on the car, unless of course the wheel unloads totally. Even then, with coil-overs, you generally have little to no spring pre-load at that point.

The same mount and mounting is used no matter what setup you have.... Eventually all the force it transmitted into the upper mount. The difference is simply that the GW kit takes it over a bigger area on the underside of the mount. The GC kit has it concentrated on a more central location. No problem, because the weight of the car pushed down harder than the spring can push up. In other words, the most stress the shock rod threads are ever under is with the stock tall, preloaded springs, out of the car.....

Loads are not carried by the shock rod with any setup.

Further, I know GC has been making these things for a long time. I've never had any break. I don't know anyone that has ever had one (or a shock break because of one). I just don't see how the conclusion that the force is put through the shock rod is come to.....

I sell them, I'll continue to sell them. I think they are great bang for the buck. I think GW should be ashamed of "hiding" spring rates from their own customers. And they use too heavy springs anyway. IMHO.

It's hard to explain, but if you draw the pictures of the two setups, you'll see that it really doesn't matter how big an area the adapter hat touches. As they both end up resting on the mount. Actually, you'd get more rubber deflection with the GW setup than the GC setup.... Again, you have to imagine this in the car, with a load on it. Tower pushes on mount, mount pushes on hat, hat on spring and on down.

 

If I were to go with the GCs, what setup would I use(spring rate)? I am going to need stock height for the drag strip and then a 1.5 to 2 inch drop when I'm on the street. I need a rate that offers the most comfort and handling. When lowered, will the ride be worse than on my Eibach Sportlines? Thanks

 

Get the LG kit. Its race proven. plus the shocks have spherical ends, and LG can tune the package to what you want with your car.

 

the spring doesn't place any lateral forces on the shaft either. spring force is in the same direction as dampening forces. if the tip of the shock broke, it was either a buckling failure due to compression or a tensile failure. it had nothing to do with how the spring is mounted.

i still do not think that the gc coil-over would break a shock shaft. is it to be totally blamed on the gc spring hat? it could have been a faulty shock shaft. things do break, you just don't hear of shock shafts breaking that often. its mere coincidence that it happened to be a gc setup.

sam - the shock shaft doesn't carry any of the loads due to static or dynamic weight loads, but it does see all of the dampening forces created by the shock.

 

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Shaitiger:
<strong>If I were to go with the GCs, what setup would I use(spring rate)? I am going to need stock height for the drag strip and then a 1.5 to 2 inch drop when I'm on the street. I need a rate that offers the most comfort and handling. When lowered, will the ride be worse than on my Eibach Sportlines? Thanks</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I went with the 450lb fronts and 175lb rears. I think Strano's Z has 450lb fronts and 125lb rears....that might be a better way to go.

 

ttt

 

Will these work with my SLP Bilsteins? I need to make sure because I want to order today from Sam Strano. Thanks

 

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Shaitiger:
<strong>Will these work with my SLP Bilsteins? I need to make sure because I want to order today from Sam Strano. Thanks</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">If you're gogint o order from Sam you might as well ask him this question directly but the answer to your question is yes the SLP Bilsteins will work.....but they are not designed to work with more drop than the SLP Eibachs give. They'll probably work better than the DeCarbon's.

 

Yo Diesel that is the baddest camaro i have ever saw. Nice work!

 

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Bionik:
<strong>Yo Diesel that is the baddest camaro i have ever saw. Nice work!</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Thanks for the compliment Bionik. My SS is OK, but I've seen nicer......It's always nice to hear you have a nice ride though. Aloha, Da <img border="0" alt="[Burnout]" title="" src="graemlins/burnout.gif" /> ve

 

If you`re trying to get traction at the track by raising the car I don`t think this will do it for you.Traction has more to do with weight transfer than height. Shocks like Hals set on a low setting will alow weight transfer but stiff shocks no matter if 2 inches low or high ... I don`t think that will do what you want.

I want the same thing, weight transfer at the track and still have the car lowered. I went with lowering springs and Hals. This way I can adjust the shocks for handling or track use and I still have the option to raise or lower the car to any heigh in front.

You could also use stock springs/Hals in front (lower the car to any heigh) which will weight transfer better than lowering springs will and take out the spring perches in the rear to lower the rear.