Has Anyone Converted to a Short Front Spindle?
02-23-2009, 10:59 AM
#83
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It's hacked up because I'm doing a front breather conversion (done actually) and flipping the stock radiator the other direction.C4 and C5 hub assemblies are not interchangeable (one is 3 bolt the other is 4).
Steering arm isn't that big of a deal. Like you said, Detroit uses a bolt on one...no reason we couldn't.
02-23-2009, 04:36 PM
#85
Here is the 91-96 Corvette hub:
And here is the 4th gen f-body hub:
I'm thinking maybe GM used the same basic hub for the F-body when it came out in 93 with one exception. They improved the mounting. Instead of bolts and nuts, like the earlier vette, they threaded the hub flange so only a bolt is needed. You can see it in the pics above.
And here is the 4th gen f-body hub:
I'm thinking maybe GM used the same basic hub for the F-body when it came out in 93 with one exception. They improved the mounting. Instead of bolts and nuts, like the earlier vette, they threaded the hub flange so only a bolt is needed. You can see it in the pics above.
Last edited by JasonWW; 03-22-2009 at 09:02 PM.
02-23-2009, 07:15 PM
#86
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I have an early C4 hub at work...I ordered one to look at since that's the spindle you got. I hope the mounting dimensions of the later C4s are the same.
Last edited by fast377; 02-23-2009 at 07:21 PM.
02-24-2009, 08:25 PM
#89
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That....is damn pretty. Almost makes it look easy. Are you still thinking you will need to lower the uca mount?
If your picture is remotely close to being dimensionally accurate, it's going to take one hell of a bump steer kit. Unless you can make a bolt on steering arm like Detroit does.
It's promising
. And with that C4 spindle, you can use a cheap fabricated uca like the one in the griggs setup. You can pick that up at any circle track shop.
If your picture is remotely close to being dimensionally accurate, it's going to take one hell of a bump steer kit. Unless you can make a bolt on steering arm like Detroit does.
It's promising
. And with that C4 spindle, you can use a cheap fabricated uca like the one in the griggs setup. You can pick that up at any circle track shop.
02-24-2009, 09:45 PM
#90
I measured both C4 spindles at a salvage yard so I know their heights. I then propped up both arms to match the 9 3/4" spindle height I'll be using. Then I plugged in the picture of the spindle. I used the stock UCA just because it was handy.
The UCA length is 7" pivot to pivot.
The LCA length is 14" pivot to pivot.
I would say it's pretty accurate.
I will probably have to bolt on a new steering arm.
The C5 has the engine further back which allows them to mount the steering rack in front of the engine. That Detroit shop has to put the steering rack under the oil pan. You pretty much have to on the 4th gens and most older muscle cars. That's also the reason for our LCA shape. To clear the steering linkage.
The UCA length is 7" pivot to pivot.
The LCA length is 14" pivot to pivot.
I would say it's pretty accurate.
I will probably have to bolt on a new steering arm.
The C5 has the engine further back which allows them to mount the steering rack in front of the engine. That Detroit shop has to put the steering rack under the oil pan. You pretty much have to on the 4th gens and most older muscle cars. That's also the reason for our LCA shape. To clear the steering linkage.
Last edited by JasonWW; 02-24-2009 at 10:16 PM.
02-24-2009, 10:22 PM
#91
Yes, it needs to be in the frame area.
Scratch this idea.
Scratch this idea.
One idea I have to cut the K-member into 3 pieces right under the inside of the frame. Then weld the 2 ends to the frame. The center section can drop down for engine replacement. The entire suspension will stay with the car, but the steering rack will drop with the engine. Only the shock would need to be unbolted and the tierod ends would need to be seperated from the spindle.
After looking at some pictures, it looks like the LCA mounts are well inside the frame rails. That means you would have to unbolt the headers first, then drop the engine down.
Should I even worry about how many things would have to be unbolted before I can drop the engine? Yes or no? It's not like I would have to do it very often.
After looking at some pictures, it looks like the LCA mounts are well inside the frame rails. That means you would have to unbolt the headers first, then drop the engine down.
Should I even worry about how many things would have to be unbolted before I can drop the engine? Yes or no? It's not like I would have to do it very often.
Last edited by JasonWW; 03-22-2009 at 09:31 PM.
02-24-2009, 11:26 PM
#92
Scratch this idea.
Here's the problem with the 3 piece k-member idea.
The LCA bolt is in the way.
Here's the possible solution. As you can see, you don't have as much room to drop the engine down.
The LCA bolt is in the way.
Here's the possible solution. As you can see, you don't have as much room to drop the engine down.
Last edited by JasonWW; 03-05-2011 at 06:05 AM.
02-25-2009, 12:34 AM
#94
Scratch this idea.
I can clean everything up by cutting away a section of the k-member end and weld in a new boxed section which can then be welded to the cars frame rails. Something like this. The old frame rail on top would be completely removed.
Last edited by JasonWW; 03-05-2011 at 06:06 AM.
02-25-2009, 12:39 AM
#95
Actually, I may have a better idea. Just run new frame rails 4" lower.
I can shorten the height of the k-member ends and then run the new frame rails lower. This way I can still unbolt the entire k-member. I'll do a picture tommorrow.
I can shorten the height of the k-member ends and then run the new frame rails lower. This way I can still unbolt the entire k-member. I'll do a picture tommorrow.
02-25-2009, 08:25 AM
#96
All right, something finally goes my way. I can basically notch the K-member down 3" and run a new 2x4" frame rail right over the top. I can cut away the entire stock rails as well as the outer edges of the k-member giving me lots of room for airbags.
As you can see here, I can get a much longer UCA as well as the geometry I've been wanting. There's plenty of room.
The modded k-member will still drop down in one piece.
As you can see here, I can get a much longer UCA as well as the geometry I've been wanting. There's plenty of room.
The modded k-member will still drop down in one piece.
Last edited by JasonWW; 03-05-2011 at 06:07 AM.
02-25-2009, 02:26 PM
#97
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As long as you boxed the k-member, I don't see why that wouldn't work. The more I look at the pictures, the more I like that idea. If you did the uca pocket, from the pics, it looks like one of the k-member bolts would be in that pocket...and I don't like that idea.
Your last picture still keeps everything beefy. The new rails would give you lots of nice, new, strong steel to weld to also. If you welded the tubing to the bottom of the stock frame, then took the entire frame out, you could probably get a piece of 2x4 tubing bent for you to fit like stock.
Your last picture still keeps everything beefy. The new rails would give you lots of nice, new, strong steel to weld to also. If you welded the tubing to the bottom of the stock frame, then took the entire frame out, you could probably get a piece of 2x4 tubing bent for you to fit like stock.
03-19-2009, 02:32 AM
#98
Well, I recieved my early C4 spindle a little while back and I took some pics. You know what they look like so I'll only post a couple.
In thinking about how high the stock steering arm is and how a much lower one might rub the rim, I have an idea to raise the steering rack a couple of inches.
In thinking about how high the stock steering arm is and how a much lower one might rub the rim, I have an idea to raise the steering rack a couple of inches.
Last edited by JasonWW; 03-19-2009 at 03:16 AM.
03-19-2009, 04:25 AM
#99
Since I don't think anyone has ever seen a C4 spindle on a 4th gen, here are several pics.
I don't want to pull a spindle off my black car, but I may pull a wheel off so I can take some comparison pictures of the 2 spindles. I also need to measure the lower balljoint to horizontal hub seat distance to see if the wheel is going to stick out any more or less. I'll so measure the lower ball joint to vertical hub centerline to see exactly how much of a drop these spindles give you.
I don't want to pull a spindle off my black car, but I may pull a wheel off so I can take some comparison pictures of the 2 spindles. I also need to measure the lower balljoint to horizontal hub seat distance to see if the wheel is going to stick out any more or less. I'll so measure the lower ball joint to vertical hub centerline to see exactly how much of a drop these spindles give you.
03-20-2009, 04:07 PM
#100
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Looks good. Kind of puts things into perspective. It looks like a pocket in the frame rail would work just fine. That would keep you from from having to screw with the k-member. That steering arm that steering might be a problem. Here is a pic I stole from ebay (until we get your measurements )
It looks like you will be getting about an inch or so of drop. With a bumpsteer kit, you might be okay...since you have 19" wheels. Just as long as you get the tie rod level, you should be okay.
Looking forward to updates.
.
)It looks like you will be getting about an inch or so of drop. With a bumpsteer kit, you might be okay...since you have 19" wheels. Just as long as you get the tie rod level, you should be okay.
Looking forward to updates
..