For those of you who pump premium (I do...) thoughts?
08-03-2007, 09:58 AM
#21
Originally Posted by MrDude_1
you will NEVER hear detonation in a stock LS1.
before its audible, the PCM will hear it and pull timing.
before its audible, the PCM will hear it and pull timing.
Anyone else heard detonation in a bone stocker or slightly modified car?
Besides, who the hell on this site has a bone stock car? <1% of the membership.
08-03-2007, 10:02 AM
#22
Originally Posted by TWS
Incorrect. I have personally heard detonation in a 99% stock LS1. It had a lid and egr tube was trimmed. That was the sum total of mods at the time.
Anyone else heard detonation in a bone stocker or slightly modified car?
Besides, who the hell on this site has a bone stock car? <1% of the membership.
Anyone else heard detonation in a bone stocker or slightly modified car?
Besides, who the hell on this site has a bone stock car? <1% of the membership.
i should have added the disclaimer of:
"never hear detonation from just the lower octane alone"
you could always just floor it in 6th from a low speed and make it ping.... but i expect people to either follow along enough to realise what im talking about... or just "not get it"
but yea, i know what you mean... as for the "bone stock car" comments.. thats just to eliminate the person coming in here and saying "i have a 14:1, afrheadded, blahblahblah --you're an idiot" comments...
reasonably stock, would be an ok substitution.. everyone can have a lid, headers, LS6... and still not worry about destroying the motor on 87
08-03-2007, 10:03 AM
#23
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Originally Posted by MrDude_1
you will NEVER hear detonation in a stock LS1.
before its audible, the PCM will hear it and pull timing.
the only way you can know what its timing trims and such really are, is to use software like HPtuners or EFIlive to log it.
before its audible, the PCM will hear it and pull timing.
the only way you can know what its timing trims and such really are, is to use software like HPtuners or EFIlive to log it.
WRONG! WRONG! WRONG! WRONG!
YOU'RE WROOOOONG!
I had MAJOR detonation in my stock LS1 (before headers and catback. Only thing I had was a lid). Ask the guys at G-Force, who helped me tune it out.
-Mike
08-03-2007, 10:08 AM
#24
Originally Posted by chupr0kabra
WRONG! WRONG! WRONG! WRONG!
WRONG! WRONG! WRONG! WRONG!
YOU'RE WROOOOONG!
I had MAJOR detonation in my stock LS1 (before headers and catback. Only thing I had was a lid). Ask the guys at G-Force, who helped me tune it out.
-Mike
WRONG! WRONG! WRONG! WRONG!
YOU'RE WROOOOONG!
I had MAJOR detonation in my stock LS1 (before headers and catback. Only thing I had was a lid). Ask the guys at G-Force, who helped me tune it out.
-Mike
soo.. did you fix your problem, or band-aid it somehow?
obviously if you have major detonation, and everyone else doesnt.. you had some kind of an issue.
(not trying to be a smartass, just stating the logical conclusion.)
08-03-2007, 10:13 AM
#25
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Originally Posted by TWS
Exactly. There is a lot of ignorance and misconceptions about fuel octane. If you are not experiencing detonation with your current grade of fuel, stepping up the grade of fuel just makes your wallet thinner while doing next to nothing for your car.
My 92 explorer ran pretty well on 87, until about 200,000 miles with the original heads. Then, when I went WOT on the highway, I could hear the detonation with 87. Every once in a while I would put 93 in to see if there was a difference. With 93, no detonation.
Now at 260k, if it doesn't go WOT, it still doesn't get detonation. Milage is still close to where it was at 130k when I put a catback on it. Car needs to be seafoamed I think though.
08-03-2007, 10:18 AM
#26
Originally Posted by lo_jack
Add to that marketers, who want to sell more expensive fuel, then you get people that "swear by V-power."
My 92 explorer ran pretty well on 87, until about 200,000 miles with the original heads. Then, when I went WOT on the highway, I could hear the detonation with 87. Every once in a while I would put 93 in to see if there was a difference. With 93, no detonation.
Now at 260k, if it doesn't go WOT, it still doesn't get detonation. Milage is still close to where it was at 130k when I put a catback on it. Car needs to be seafoamed I think though.
My 92 explorer ran pretty well on 87, until about 200,000 miles with the original heads. Then, when I went WOT on the highway, I could hear the detonation with 87. Every once in a while I would put 93 in to see if there was a difference. With 93, no detonation.
Now at 260k, if it doesn't go WOT, it still doesn't get detonation. Milage is still close to where it was at 130k when I put a catback on it. Car needs to be seafoamed I think though.
if you want to clean the carbon off, you can do the oldtime trick of pouring water into the running motor.... not enough to hydrolock it of course, but the water turns into steam, and the steam breaks off the carbon... works great.
you can see examples of this all the time, just look at an engine that ran with a blown headgasket.
08-03-2007, 10:25 AM
#27
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Originally Posted by MrDude_1
alot of that is probably carbon build up..
if you want to clean the carbon off, you can do the oldtime trick of pouring water into the running motor.... not enough to hydrolock it of course, but the water turns into steam, and the steam breaks off the carbon... works great.
you can see examples of this all the time, just look at an engine that ran with a blown headgasket.
if you want to clean the carbon off, you can do the oldtime trick of pouring water into the running motor.... not enough to hydrolock it of course, but the water turns into steam, and the steam breaks off the carbon... works great.
you can see examples of this all the time, just look at an engine that ran with a blown headgasket.
I assumed carbon was reducing the volume of top end.
Someone told me that trick, and I was thinking about doing it. I was also thinking about grabbing a new set of heads for it, but part of me wants to see how far it will go with the original everything.
But that goes back to our main point. If you actually are seeing detonation on your correct spec octane, you have a bigger problem than buying expensive gas, or not.
08-03-2007, 10:38 AM
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Originally Posted by MrDude_1
soo.. did you fix your problem, or band-aid it somehow?
obviously if you have major detonation, and everyone else doesnt.. you had some kind of an issue.
(not trying to be a smartass, just stating the logical conclusion.)
obviously if you have major detonation, and everyone else doesnt.. you had some kind of an issue.
(not trying to be a smartass, just stating the logical conclusion.)
I agree, if you've got a healthy stock LS1, it shouldn't detonate. It just seems like there are a lot of unhealthy ones out there. It's a great platform, but I know very few people who haven't had some sort of problem. Of course, the same can be said of any car, really.
-Mike
08-03-2007, 10:58 AM
#29
Originally Posted by MrDude_1
i should have added the disclaimer of:
"never hear detonation from just the lower octane alone"
you could always just floor it in 6th from a low speed and make it ping.... but i expect people to either follow along enough to realise what im talking about... or just "not get it"
but yea, i know what you mean... as for the "bone stock car" comments.. thats just to eliminate the person coming in here and saying "i have a 14:1, afrheadded, blahblahblah --you're an idiot" comments...
"never hear detonation from just the lower octane alone"
you could always just floor it in 6th from a low speed and make it ping.... but i expect people to either follow along enough to realise what im talking about... or just "not get it"
but yea, i know what you mean... as for the "bone stock car" comments.. thats just to eliminate the person coming in here and saying "i have a 14:1, afrheadded, blahblahblah --you're an idiot" comments...
I guess I'm just trying to err on the side of caution with my advice/input. I have two FI cars, so I am very sensitive to detonation and what it could do.
08-03-2007, 12:52 PM
#32
Originally Posted by ckyconan2003
11:1 compression ratio....ima put premium in my car till i buy a civic
and along thoes lines....once direct injection catches on with everyone... we might start seeing diesel-ish compression ratios on cars.
08-03-2007, 12:58 PM
#33
Originally Posted by ckyconan2003
11:1 compression ratio....ima put premium in my car till i buy a civic
and along thoes lines....once direct injection catches on with everyone... we might start seeing diesel-ish compression ratios on cars.
08-03-2007, 01:03 PM
#34
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Originally Posted by MrDude_1
funny thing is.. theres a very good chance a new civic might have 11:1....
and along thoes lines....once direct injection catches on with everyone... we might start seeing diesel-ish compression ratios on cars.
and along thoes lines....once direct injection catches on with everyone... we might start seeing diesel-ish compression ratios on cars.
08-03-2007, 01:17 PM
#36
Originally Posted by lo_jack
I heard MB was working on just that as we speak - in fact trying to compress ignite gasoline.
they compress the air (just think NA air intake, with no gasoline taking up volume in the port...) then spray in the fuel and ignite it a second later.
if the compressed air is hot enough it has the potential to light off then (like the MB setup).. but most of them still rely on spark. along with timing the fuel.
i personally think its an exciting concept for performance engines. i think 15 or 20 years from now, we will all be working on performance cars that operate that way.
08-03-2007, 06:20 PM
#37
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LS1/2/3/6/7 gets premium or better, period. If you're running anything else, and your life doesn't depend on it... you obviously don't care much about your car. I've been in situations where I needed those few dollars just to eat, so I put premium in the car anyways, and gnawed on my hand for a while. Why trust a computer to detune your motor, make it run poorly, just to save a couple bucks at the pump? If you wanna save a little money, make the extra effort to find a convenient station that sells premium for +0.20 instead of +0.25 or +0.30 over regular. I don't know about Texas, but in Missouri, I've even seen a couple places that sell premium for +0.10.
08-03-2007, 07:01 PM
#38
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it does matter where you pump and what kind you get. A month ago i pump at a shitting gas station b/c i was on E but i still pump 93... after about 5 miles my car started to run like **** =( ...it was back firing i had no power so i drain what i could and let it idle until it turn off then i got some 93 from shells ... my car was running fine with no problems =)
