Machinists ... best machine to do seat and guide work ?
11-21-2005, 02:42 PM
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Machinists ... best milling machine to do seat and guide work ? On cylinder heads.
There are the Winona /Peterson style with the floater tables,
The Serdi /Sunnen style with the floater head (which I know is much better than the floater table style),
Or the option of bolting a cradle (head fixture) to the table of a bridgeport style milling machine, which doesn't float anything.
I know that the floater head style is much much faster to kick the work out with, but that's not my main concern. What I worry about most is the precision in which the head is lined up to drill the guide bores.
Since ALL seat & guide machines pilot off the guide in the first place, this doesn't make good sense to me for getting precision placement while replacing the guides. If the guides are a little off, then everything else you cut on the head will be off as well.
Is anyone one here very experienced at this?
or understand what exactly I'm getting at?
I was thinking that although a bridgeport would be much slower with all the set-up time, it may do a much better job of getting things centered right on.
As far as investing my money goes, I've been leaning towards getting a brand new milling machine for $3500 (Grizzly), as opposed to getting a 15 - 20 year old Winona machine with a substandard cradle for the same $3500 (locally reconditioned).
The Serdi or Sunnen option looks nice, but I hesitate to drop that kind of money for just starting out my own operation.
All opinions welcome,
Thanks, Dan
There are the Winona /Peterson style with the floater tables,
The Serdi /Sunnen style with the floater head (which I know is much better than the floater table style),
Or the option of bolting a cradle (head fixture) to the table of a bridgeport style milling machine, which doesn't float anything.
I know that the floater head style is much much faster to kick the work out with, but that's not my main concern. What I worry about most is the precision in which the head is lined up to drill the guide bores.
Since ALL seat & guide machines pilot off the guide in the first place, this doesn't make good sense to me for getting precision placement while replacing the guides. If the guides are a little off, then everything else you cut on the head will be off as well.
Is anyone one here very experienced at this?
or understand what exactly I'm getting at?
I was thinking that although a bridgeport would be much slower with all the set-up time, it may do a much better job of getting things centered right on.
As far as investing my money goes, I've been leaning towards getting a brand new milling machine for $3500 (Grizzly), as opposed to getting a 15 - 20 year old Winona machine with a substandard cradle for the same $3500 (locally reconditioned).
The Serdi or Sunnen option looks nice, but I hesitate to drop that kind of money for just starting out my own operation.
All opinions welcome,
Thanks, Dan
Last edited by white2001s10; 01-07-2006 at 02:38 PM.
11-21-2005, 02:45 PM
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I've been looking at these
http://www.precisionmeasure.com/fixt2.htm
http://www.castheads.com/rollover_machining_fixture.php
but do not personally know anyone experienced in using them.
All the guys around here go the traditional route to kick out the work faster... you know the time is money thing.
http://www.precisionmeasure.com/fixt2.htm
http://www.castheads.com/rollover_machining_fixture.php
but do not personally know anyone experienced in using them.
All the guys around here go the traditional route to kick out the work faster... you know the time is money thing.
11-24-2005, 11:34 PM
#3
I have heard that many Nascar shops use the Serdi machines. If thats true or not I do not know. I do know that one of the best engine builders in this area uses a serdi machine. Not to pump out work faster cause turn around time is not that fast.
11-25-2005, 08:38 PM
#5
Originally Posted by white2001s10
I've been looking at these
http://www.precisionmeasure.com/fixt2.htm
http://www.castheads.com/rollover_machining_fixture.php
but do not personally know anyone experienced in using them.
All the guys around here go the traditional route to kick out the work faster... you know the time is money thing.
http://www.precisionmeasure.com/fixt2.htm
http://www.castheads.com/rollover_machining_fixture.php
but do not personally know anyone experienced in using them.
All the guys around here go the traditional route to kick out the work faster... you know the time is money thing.
11-26-2005, 05:57 PM
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serdi 60
been using it for around five years and it's sweet. It's one of there base models but the matainace and upkeep is real easy compared to the other models.
as far a mills i'd lean towards a Peterson if your going to buy one used. all the componets are easy to change out and most of the parts can be overnighted. But if you can get a new mill I'd get the TNS. It's extremly fast setup and it's not near the price of a new perterson or sunnen
been using it for around five years and it's sweet. It's one of there base models but the matainace and upkeep is real easy compared to the other models.
as far a mills i'd lean towards a Peterson if your going to buy one used. all the componets are easy to change out and most of the parts can be overnighted. But if you can get a new mill I'd get the TNS. It's extremly fast setup and it's not near the price of a new perterson or sunnen
11-29-2005, 08:18 PM
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Originally Posted by DynoDR
I have a bridgeport with the rollover table for seat and guide work and the cutter head to resurface. It does just fine, gets used everday and I have had it for about 14 years now. It can also have air-float and air clamping added to the table if you want to. PM if you want any more info.
One problem I discovered is that the $3500 mill from Grizzly is chinese made and will not turn slower than about 250 RPM.
Their biggest model is around $8500 and will turn 90 RPM, but the chinese made part makes the quality a little questionable. This $8500 model is big enough that I may be able to fix a block on the table for boring & decking which is a plus, and adding CNC is possible.
Yes I am interested in any useful accessory I could add to a mill of this type.
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12-17-2005, 02:54 PM
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Buy a birmingham mill.This is a bridgeport type machine.It will perform real well.I use this for heads with a roll over fixture.It also has many more uses,such as machining pistons,stoker clearancing blocks,ect...
12-30-2005, 01:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Terry@RacetechSpeed
Buy a birmingham mill.This is a bridgeport type machine.It will perform real well.I use this for heads with a roll over fixture.It also has many more uses,such as machining pistons,stoker clearancing blocks,ect...
Thanks again for the help.
