I am new to this community, and I am looking at a 2000 Maple Red Metallic Trans Convertible M6. I have been looking at these cars for about a month now and learning a lot from this forum, but still VERY much a newbie on this topic

The car only has 65k miles on it. Its a nice clean car. Only real mods I know are K&N Filter, Borla Cat Back Exhaust and drilled rotors. Its a 17 year old car, so the body is not perfect. It has a door ding in rear passenger fender. The clear coat on the front and rear bumpers is delaminating and peeling off in a few places. And there are just a few other chips if you really examine the car up close. Passenger door has the crack but driver side does not. From 5-10 ft away and at first glance it's a really sharp looking car. He also had an aftermarket fiberglass ram air hood, but i don't know if it is repairable due to the corner damage.

What would you say the price range is on this one? From the highest no brainer price to a fair market value. If you need any other info, just let me know. And thanks in advance for all your help and any info you can pass along

 

The site production break down only shows 79 verts in 2000 built in that color. Figure about half of those M6's. Maybe 5-12 remaining? While most won't give much if any premium to this combination, I would. At least 10%. And you couldn't get this 1999-2002 color in a WS6. Though, in 2002 it appears 4 M6 Firehawks were built. They made additional MRM verts in the later years, though far fewer. Maybe a few dozen verts survive for all years.

I've generally consider a very clean 80K-90K mile M6 Firebird to be worth around $8K. This is a little better on mileage, and in a very scarce color. I also consider the convertibles to be worth more than a T-Top. In my mind, if the car is clean, runs well, is up to date on routine maintenance, then $6K-$9K is a rip. $9K-$11K probably a very good deal. $11K-$12K would be stronger money, but probably still fair. I'd assign a $2K premium for a M6 MRM over say an A4 in bright red. The price guides won't give any premium for color/transmission type. Have to think that most of these cars are very high in mileage and/or gone.

Really comes down to condition. While your average street racer isn't looking for an M6 vert in MRM, there are people that are looking. I see a nice 53K mile red 2000 WS6 A4 on autotrader.com for $14,500. Figure an M6 at $1K more. I would place the WS6 verts A4 in the $12,500-$13,500 range with 45K-65K miles. Your Trans Am being a scarce color and M6 could close the gap somewhat to an A4 WS6 vert. MRM M6 Vert is a nice "sleeper" car. Many people, even dealers, might undersell one. I only see 2 of them on autotrader, both over 110K miles.

If your local dealer has such a car, they'd probably have it listed at $11K-$14K. My local dealer recently had a 44K mile black 2000 Z28 M6 vert. Orig asking price was $12,500. It was probably buyable at $10,500-$11,500. My test drive on that showed the shifting pretty sloppy, even for a factory stick. The condition was nothing to be excited about. The AC didn't work. I lost interest quick.

 

Personally, I wouldn't give this one any significant premium for rarity; the color isn't sought after enough in my experience, and the mileage isn't low enough (and condition good enough) to offset that factor. I'd value it about the same as a more common color with all else being equal.

Convertibles are not as desirable as T/Hardtop cars among the 4th gen crowd, so while it would likely be worth more to the right buyer, finding that right buyer will prove a bit more difficult....so seller motivation will play a role in pricing here.

Not sure why the bumper paint has those issues at such a low mileage. The car looks pretty decent overall, but rougher than it should be for the miles IMO. It doesn't seem like it's had highly fussy owners based on some of the wear/issues that you've listed. At a quick glance, I see that the wipers are not dropping back down to full park position - could be an issue or maybe they were still turned on last time the car was running.

I can't see paying more than ~$10k or so based on what's visible and what you've listed regarding condition. Paying a premium for the rarity doesn't make sense on this example unless you're absolutely in love with the color and feel that it's worth more to you personally. It's not in top tier investment grade condition, so it might prove very difficult to pass that premium along if you ever plan to sell it. If you intend to keep it for the very long term then paying a bit more wouldn't be the end of the world, but I'd only recommend doing so if it's for your personal pleasure rather than a false sense of future collector value.

There are much nicer LS1 4th gens that pop up for sale in the $12-15k range, some with less than half this mileage. So for this one to be worth buying, to me, it would have to be something under that price range.

 

I just did an autotrader search of M6 Firebird verts at up to $15K/under 100K miles and basically find a single vehicle with 91K miles at $15,000. If you want under $10K, you have to go up to 115K miles or higher...and there aren't many of those either.

I was surprised in doing a search of Automatics vs. Manual Firebird verts at $15K/150K miles and found 19 A4's vs 2 M6's. Did the same search with 100K miles and it was 11-1. If it's a clean, mid-mileage M6 vert you're after, there's almost nothing under the $15K price point. No shortage of M6 verts to choose from at $20K-$30K. That MRM M6 vert at 65K miles may not be so easy to duplicate, regardless of color.

To compare to the Chevy verts. At $15K/150K mile limits the ratio of A4's to M6's was 55-9....much more available than the 19-2 for Pontiacs. Of those 9 Chevy's, there were 4 verts in the 30-50K/$12.5K-$15K range....or 4X as many vs. the Firebird. So if you want an affordable, lower mileage M6 vert, the Chevy gives 3X-5X as many choices. Current/completed/sold listings on Ebay don't show anything but lack of availability for Pontiac M6 verts in the under $15K range....or at least the sellers aren't letting go. If you consider coupes as well, there will be 5X as many cars to choose from....though the prices won't be all that much different.

 

If the OP has his heart set on an M6 Pontiac 'vert, then it seems you're right about the limited options in the ~$10k range. I guess I didn't necessarily get the impression that an M6 Trans Am convertible was the ultimate/only goal, I just assumed this was a car he found that was appealing - if the price was right.

But there are better deals to be had if you're open to a wider range of trim levels/roof options (not sure what the OP's position is on this.) Here's a couple of ~30k mile Formulas that were recently discussed, both apparently nicer cars for the money than the example posted by the OP if you're looking in the ~$13k+ asking price range (assuming the one posted by the OP is also in that general range):

https://ls1tech.com/forums/what-wort...ormula-m6.html

I guess if one really wants an M6 'vert Trans Am, then they'll have to pay. I just couldn't bring myself to pay nearly as much for a 65k mile car that needs panels repainted and some other minor damage to be addressed (plus who knows what else mechanical) as for a 30k mile car without such issues. The 'vert would just have to be a more attractive price for me to consider overlooking the issues. Then again, I have no personal requirement for a drop top, or even a Pontiac (the Chevy variants are usually much better deals, for those of us who appreciate both), so I'd rather see my money go towards better overall condition. No right or wrong answer there, just personal preference.

 

Thanks guys for all the info. So I have three reason for looking at a vert... my wife, my wife, and my wife. I think that might be the only way to make the car and decision to buy the car appeal to her. I've never owned a convertible myself, so I also thought I'd give it a shot.

So i agree with both of you. First, Firebrian.. in the few months of looking I have not seen many trans am manual, verts, with under 100K miles come on the market unless they are $15K-$30K. Then, I also agree with RPM, due to its current condition I don't see this having much collector value or investment value without putting a good amount of money into, which then increases that up front "investment"

Since the Camaros just don't do it for me, I am wanting a Trans Am. I am not too particular on the color, but i will say this one did appeal to me since its not a color you see everyday. So I am really just looking for something I can have for 2-3 years, enjoy it on weekends and nice weather, not be overly concerned whether I'm babying it enough, and not lose money (or very little) if I go to sell it.

From what I understand the current owner just bought the car from a dealer in Feb for $10K, and now he is selling it because something happened and he needs the money. He is just trying to get the same price for it. Also, he said now he feels bad about having it and not having a garage to put it in. Reselling a vehicle within a few months is kind of a red flag to me, so if I am going to move on this car, I will have a mechanic check it out very thoroughly.

I am leaning towards offering him $8K so it gives me some room to fix the paint issues and maybe get that Ram Air hood (or another) put on the car. I just don't know if he could stomaching losing that much on the car in a few months.

 

Judging from what is around, that guy shouldn't have any trouble getting $10K, or very nearly that. So I'd check it out pronto. The vehicle is priced in the right range that you should be able to get a couple years out of it without losing much money. I'd find out what the current owner (or the selling dealership) had done to it in the 2-3 months since they've had it. If the answer is "nothing," then maybe you should look elsewhere. All the fluids should have been refreshed/verified. No one is likely ever to fix those spider cracks in the paint. The car will be a survivor for years to come with the paint just as it is. It's not an important car to repaint or to hold for the long term. For that matter, 90-99% of all the remaining F bodies won't be worth holding longer term.

There's nothing wrong with having a few defects in the paint from 17 years of use. It happens. And you'll be far less apt to worry about the next scratch put into the paint. It won't be like that if you buy a more pristine 30K mile car with minimal to no paint defects. You'll be afraid to park the car anywhere for fear of getting a ding...or being caught in the rain, etc. There's an air of freedom in knowing that car is not that nice that you have to worry about every little thing. For one thing, you don't have to worry about your roof paint bubbling as the vast majority of other F bodies owner currently do....lol. As long as the engine, trans, and rear end seem solid and quiet, the risks with your car should be minimal.

Can't think of too many wives that are set on a manual transmission convertible. My wife has never gotten past 3rd gear in either of the two M6's I have owned. And I once tried to school her on my 4 speed 1968 GTX vert....for which she made it to 2nd gear. She did have a blast though, driving our 1969 red/white roadrunner automatic vert.

 

I would argue that this is true for any platform that's ever been built, even the "high dollar" collectibles. Sometimes you get lucky and buy/sell at the right point in the cycle or when a particular car ends up in a bubble market, but most times even the classics appreciate very slowly and you'll rarely find one these days that's still owned by someone who doesn't know what they have. Some folks have certainly made a killing on some very desirable old muscle cars that were bought for little to nothing and sold during peak market times for exponentially more, but for the vast majority of hobbyists this is a pipe dream. Once you factor in the various costs of ownership and the [often] slow rate of appreciation, you're almost always better off investing in something else over the long term - at least if you're doing it for the money. On the other hand, there's always cash to be made with a quick flip if you find a screaming deal and know the market, but the longer you keep it the more you're at risk of a market shift plus the mounting costs of ownership year after year.

Definitely. I've owned two different categories of toy/hobby cars in my life; "complicated fun" and "simple fun", as I call them. Complicated fun cars require great care and worry, I don't use them for anything but shows/events or occasional weekend pleasure cruises on planned routes in nothing less than perfect weather. Cars in this category rarely see more than 500 miles per year under my ownership. The purpose of these, for me, has little to do with value retention and everything to do with long term preservation of the car at a high level for my own personal enjoyment. Then there is simple fun, which is just that - simple, what most folks would call a "driver". The sort of car that you wouldn't drive in the winter or use up by commuting with every day rain or shine, but one that you're not afraid to jump in and take to work/run errands on nice days, not be afraid to leave in a parking lot for more than 30 seconds, take it to cruise nights even when the weather is a bit questionable, etc. Getting a door ding or a scratch on a car like this isn't going to ruin your day. Usually, I've driven such cars several thousand miles per year and I don't concern myself with preserving them to show quality standards - "nice" is good enough. Each category has its place and not everyone is suited to both. Personally, I like having at least one of each but I've been without the latter for three years now. Really starting to miss it.

Having said that, when it comes to initial purchase price I just couldn't bring myself to pay "complicated fun" money for an example that's in "simple fun" condition but happens to have different roof and cosmetic trim level treatments. However, at $10k this one seems like a fair candidate. Regarding some of the other ones that Firebrian found, I just can't believe there are folks who would pay ~$15k for a 91k mile base Trans Am convertible when ~30k mile Formulas with Hard/T-tops can be found listed for ~$2k less with the same trans type. Perhaps I have underestimated the value of complete open air driving to some.

 

I'll be the first to agree that $15K is "nuts" for a 2000 Trans Am M6 vert with 91,000 miles. It just so happens it's the only one I found listed at $15K/under 100K miles. Certainly the MRM vert nearby Phirebirdphil has some potential at $10K/65K miles.