*JC*

It's been a while since I've posted here so I hope this isn't inappropriate to do so per the rules.

I'm asking for you LS1'ers for your opinions on tires. Currently I have some 275/40/17 BFG G-force KD TA on all four corners of my 2002 WS6. They are of course showing their age now at 8 years old. No, the car don't get driven much, it's more of a weekend toy that sometimes don't get driven in a month or two. I would very much like to say, that those KD TA's have been the very best street tires I've ever had on a car. Yes, they're a bit noisy, they was from the day they was new. However, BFG's have a reputation to be a little bit noisy. I can't say I ever noticed that about them, the 3" intermediate pipe had enough drone, at highway speeds to drowned out everything but the stereo, LOL.

Sadly BFG discontinued that tire, or I'd be buying another set. They had awesome dry traction for a tire that's not an R-compound. They was even surprisingly good in the wet, so long as didn't get stupid. They still have plenty of tread left on them but it's time for them to go. The rubber has lost it's flexability and become hardened, and cracks are forming between the tread blocks.

Having now said all of that, I've been researching my options. To my horror there just isn't much out there on the market for the OEM wheels. I'm not looking for an all season tire, I'm looking for tires optimized heavily towards dry traction, wet traction is of no real concern of mine, as the car almost never sees rain. I also prefer to keep the car drivable, so no drag radials, it's not a race car. I like a tire that's more like an autocross tire without it actually being one.

I had looked into maybe getting the Firestone Indy's (discontinued)
I had even looked into maybe Nitto's but I hear they run narrow? and not as good as claimed traction wise? (I hear the same thing about Sumitomo's, narrow and poor traction)
I've even considered the BFG Sport Comp2 but it just doesn't fancy me.
Goodyears, no way no how, especially that ridiculous priced F1 GS-D3.
I kind of like the looks of the Yokohama S-drives, but the reviews aren't great.
One tire I stumbled upon that caught my interest was the one place I never really thought to look. I didn't know they had introduced a new street tire to market, that being the Mickey Thompson Street Comp. I do understand that Cooper Tires makes their stuff and yes, they do look similar to the Cooper Zeon RS3-S.

Anyhow I'm open to your suggestions, and hoping some of you could maybe offer up some ideas or experience. Eveything I see looks like some treaded airplane tire, LOL. Looks are of course only somewhat important to me. Dry traction means the most and that I can rotate them. I'd prefer to stay in the 200 UTQG range if at all possible? But mostly what I see out there is in the 300 UTQG stuff. A high mileage tire is useless to me as it only get old and dry out. But I'll certainly consider a 300 UTQG range tire considering that might be all that's available. I'd like to have a tire with some tread depth and most 200 UTQG and under tires just don't offer that much. A 6/32 is a tire that's just a little over half way to illegal highway use.

So, anything you can think of for a 17x9 rim (275/40/17) I'm all ears. Something that at least has a tread width of about 10", leans to dry traction, isn't a drag radial, isn't ridiculously overpriced and has a fair amount of tread depth 8/32, I'd like to hear about.

M4N14C

iTrader: (3)

I had those exact same BFG KDW tires on my car. They were ok though I didn't have anything to compare them to.... at the time.

When it was time to get new tires, I was looking for something similar to what you're looking for, except for me the #1 factor was grip. I like to go autocrossing and canyon carving and the old KDW's were ok in a straight line but pushed like a boat in the corners. Looked at almost every tire on the market and ended up going with the Toyo R888. They're dirt cheap, you could get a set of four in the size you want for $7xx shipped. They grip like hell and they're about just as good in the wet as my old KDW's. So far I have 2500 hard miles on them and they still look new. Now I know you might be wanting some more tread depth so here are some options you should take a look at:

- Nitto NT05
- Continental ExtremeContact DW
- BFGoodrich g-Force Sport COMP-2

RPM WS6

iTrader: (3)

KDW is not the same tire as the KD that the OP has mentioned having. Starting in the early 2000s, BFG released three different "trim levels" of the g-Force T/A model:

- KD (dry traction only, max performance tire)
- KDW (dry and wet traction, summer ultra high performance tire)
- KDWS (dry/wet/light snow traction, all season high performance tire)

- Later in the 2000s, BFG then updated certain sizes of the KDW line (including the 275/40/17 size) to the KDW2 - same key elements (dry and wet traction), but an entirely new tread design. That new tread design led to many more complaints of noise than the original KDW had received.

The KD version was actually an optional Y2Y upgrade on Camaro SS via SLP in 2002, possibly in 2001 as well but I don't recall.

In any event, the KDW (and KDW2) is (was) a great summer performance tire but not as good as the KD (which the OP seems to have), so your comparisons above won't quite match his experiences with the higher performance KD version. KD was nearly as sticky as a drag radial, but with much better overall road grip and handing, and better wear characteristics. In fact, it was probably the best dry weather all-around summer performance tire ever manufactured in the 275/40/17 size.

As for the KDW, I still have a set of those on my '98. They are from 2005 but only have about 3,000 miles on them; no dry rotting yet, but in the last couple of years they have lost a significant portion of their bite. It seems that the Sport Comp 2 is the only close replacement, but with a 340 tread wear (vs. 300 for the KDW) and a not-as-great tread design. I guess I will eventually go with these. Options are definitely limited in this size, and the Goodyear GS D3 (which used to be comparably priced to the KDW back in ~2003 when they were released) are vastly overpriced IMO (I've had at set of these too, and although they were ranked in the same "max performance" category as the KD, they are actually more comparable to the slightly lesser performance of the KDW - and not worth the current MSRP, IMO.)

*JC*

Thank you for your replies M4N14C & RPM WS6.

RPM WS6, is correct the tires I currently have are the KD's (UTQG 200) Please see attachment, not the KDW or the KDWS (UTQG 300). The KD was more akin to an autocross tire without actually being one, at a 200 UTQG rating. That tire was discontinued and therefore it's unavailable now. The KD was an awesome street tire, plenty of tread, unmatched grip by any competitor in it's segment. It even did well in the rain so long as you didn't get stupid. The KD could pull 1+g easily in the dry, nothing else could do that except a full on R-compound race tire.

However, like RPM WS6 has said, with age,and with heat cycles, it's showing it's age. It don't grip like it did 2 years ago, the rubber has become hard and cracks are appearing all around the tread blocks. And despite the tires having 6/32 tread left it's time for them to go after 8 years. Heat Cycles take their toll on perfomance tires more than mileage. Every time you go out for that short hop just a couple of miles down the road, is one heat cycle. Driving 5 miles each way for a week is worse than driving 300 miles for one trip on a perfomance tire. Think of it this way the 300 mile road trip is just one heat cycle, the seven, 5 mile road trips each way is 14 heat cycles.

M4N14C, you're not mistaken, grip is the number #1 factor for me too. This is a street car so I want it to corner well, not just go in a straight line. Rain or wet grip is of no importance to me, as the car hardly if ever sees any rain.

I was wanting to find a tire that was as close as possible to the grip I've come to expect from the KD's. However, I'm seeing there isn't much out there in the 200 UTQG ratings, most are in the 300 UTQG range. And I may very well have to settle upon one of those. Tires I'm considering:

Nitto 555 G2 (320 UTQG, tread depth 10/32, tread width Unknown)
Nitto 555 Extreme (300 UTQG, tread depth 10/32, tread width Unknown)
BFG G-Force Sport Comp 2 (340 UTQG, tread depth 9/32, tread width 9.9)
Yokohama S-Drive (300 UTQG, tread depth 10/32, tread width 9.8)
Mickey Thompson Steet Comp (300 UTQG, tread depth 10/32, tread width 9.9) This MT is basically a Cooper Zeon RS3-S.

Others:
Nitto NT-01 (100 UTQG, tread depth 6/32, tread width Unknown)
Falken Azeenis RT615K (200 UTQG, tread depth 8/32, tread width 9.7)
Toyo Proxes RA1 (100 UTQG, tread depth 8/32, tread width 10.4)
Toyo Proxes R1R (200 UTQG, tread depth 8/32, tread width 9.9)
Toyo Proxes R888 (100 UTQG, tread depth 6/32, tread width 10.4)

If I'm going to have to spend the dough that Goodyear is asking for some of their tires. Then I'll go with something far better and more race oriented. It'll be less expensive and I'll have a better dry traction tire in the dry. What I dislike about R-compound tires is they wear quickly and start off at about half the tread depth of a normal tire. My biggest concern with the Nitto's is I hear they all run narrow tread width, considerably so when compared to tires of a similar ratio?

RPM WS6

iTrader: (3)

Actually, just for the sake of reference, the all-season performance KDWS was a 400 tread wear. These were the longest lasting (tread wear), but least performing, tire in the g-Force T/A lineup. However they were the only ones to maintain good performance and street grip in very cold temperatures. I had a set of these as well, put about 30k miles on them and they still had plenty of tread left but began to dry rot, again, due to age.

KDW was in a different performance league. And KD a league beyond even that.

I know you don't want to hear this, but the overpriced Goodyear GS-D3s are likely going to be the closest in overall performance and street manners. Again, at 280 tread wear, their performance is closer to the KDW rather than the KD but, as you've indicated, options are limited.

As you've mentioned being concerned about some tires being too narrow, I can say from experience that the GS-D3 is a very wide tire within the range of a given size. I bought a set of these for some alternate wheels I had on one of my 4th gens several years ago, they actually ran visually wider than the KDW and either comparable to, or just slightly wider than, the KD.

I probably would get another set of GS-D3s if the price wasn't so completely out of line. BFG Sport COMP-2 is about half the price, and nearly as good of a tire from what I've heard. It also is reported to run on the wide end of the spectrum. I'm basically settled on this one for my purposes, but I'm coming from a KDW which doesn't quite have the grip you're used to from the KD. I don't think you'd necessarily be disappointed with the performance of GS-D3, I just don't know that you'd be happy enough with them (over the Sport COMP-2) to justify the huge additional cost.

*JC*

Thank you for the clarification on the KDWS UTQG rating. Numbers are important


You're right I don't want to hear that, As you say the price is "so completely out of line". Yea, I'm not going to plop down $300 bucks per rim, that's insane. I'd rather spend that kind of money on a true R-compound tire, even if it's slighltly less wider looking. Looks don't equal grip, rubber compound is a much bigger factor in that arena.

Yea, the KD did look wide but at normal road PSI only about 8.9" of tread actually came in contact with the pavement. I had a friend who had the F1 GS-D3 and they was just as wide looking if not slightly more so, than my KD's.

Best that I can tell (Nitto's excluded because there is no info to be found) The following tires are all about the same tread width:
MT Super Comp at 9.9"
BFG Sport 2 at 9.9"

The Proxes R888 & RA1 seem to be the widest at 10.4"
The Proxes R1R are slightly more narrow at 9.9"

I don't really know anything about Toyo's but many autocross drivers use them. They're also cheaper than the Goodyear plus they have a stickier compound.

The R888 is a 100 AA A tire with 6/32 depth and 10.4" tread width, $200 per tire
The RA1 is a 100 AA A tire with 8/32 depth and 10.4" tread width, $250 per tire
The R1R is a 200 AA A tire with 8/32 depth and 9.9 tread width, $200 per tire.

The R1R is proabably the only size I could run on the front. the KD's would rub/brush the inner fender when turned to the extreme, as in like parking lot. But then so did the OEM Goodyear Eagle F1 GS and this isn't something one encounters in regular driving at speed. So, I'm thinking 9.9" is about the limit tread width wise

The OEM Goodyear Eagle F1 GS was a 300 AA A tire 11/32 depth and 8.9 tread width.

I'm trully grateful that you understand my dilemma in me having to make a choice. It's one I'm going to have to live with for many years, so making the wisest one is of critical importance. Your help is much appreciated. I may very well have too settle on a 300 UTQG tire and I would've favored a Firestone Indy (Clearly not in the same class as my KD) but like my BFG's that tire too has been discontinued. So, there really isn't much to choose from in the 275/40/17 market.

BFG Sport Comp 2
MT Street Comp
Nitto 555 G2 (and I'm not sure that don't run narrow?)

Any other options?

RPM WS6

iTrader: (3)

This OEM tire was horrible IMO. They came on my '00 WS6 as well, and were just terrible for performance, even when brand new. I don't know why they didn't offer the 17" wheel models the same optional Eagle GS-C that could be ordered on the 16" trim levels. GS-C was a vastly better performance tire than the F1 GS, and was available in the 275/40 size back then.

I definitely understand, and I feel the same. My '98 is a true garage queen, I've put only ~6,000 miles on it in the last 12 years and only ~3,500 on the current set of tires from 2005. So I, too, am in the same boat regarding the long term implications of tire decisions and wanting to make sure I get the best fit for the duration. Who knows, I might not live long enough to even wear out another set of tires on this car.

In my case though, I live in a different climate than you. While I don't ever drive this car in the winter, it does see some road time in the early spring and late fall if the weather is nice enough. This means that the tires might see action in night time temps as low as 40-45 degrees on occasion. Tires like the old KD and even the GS-D3 don't work so well at those temps, in my personal experience. The KDW was a great compromise between *almost* KD level performance but still pretty forgiving of temps down into the mid 40s. I don't ever drive it rain either, so that factor wasn't part of my decision, just mostly the operational temp range. It seems that Sport COMP-2 is the best all-around option for me now, but I still feel like I'm giving something up over the KDW when they were new.

Truth be told I'm not actually planning to replace my KDW, I'm planning to get another set of wheels anyway, so the new tires will go on those. I really like the visual aspects of the KDW, so I'm going to keep those around for occasional show use. At 11 years old they just don't have the performance they used to, but they have lived a sheltered life and should be fine for low speed driving/local show use for many years to come - especially when kept in climate controlled storage.

M4N14C

iTrader: (3)

Good info, didn't know there were so many variants.

Actually, driving on the street isn't considered "heat cycling". You won't get anywhere near the temps required to properly heat cycle the tire. You'll need to take it to the track to really put some heat in the rubber and go through a proper heat cycle. I know plenty of guys who put over 10,000 street miles on their "R-comp" tire and they still grip as long as they have tread.



What are your offsets? I'm running a 315 tire up front with no rubbing at all at full lock.

JROC

IMO if I were to stay with a 275/40-17 the I would give the new Nitto 555 G2 tires a shot. They are suppose to be improved on the original 555's in most every way. I love 555's. They maybe old school but they have never disappointed me for a great all around performance street tire with very few compromises, and if the new 555 G2's are as improved over the originals as people are claiming then they must be great. You just have to understand what you're buying and not expect them to perform like a R-compound tire, and you can get good all around street performance, a tire to last over 30k, and one that handles the wet and cold as well as can be expected which is pretty good, and it's pretty quiet. I just wish I could get them in a 325/30-19.

RPM WS6

iTrader: (3)

I agree. There should be NO rubbing at all with a 275/40/17 on a stock 17x9", 50mm offset wheel (assuming the OP has stock WS6 wheels.) In fact, I've used that wheel and tire size on at least three different 4th gens with no rubbing of the wheel well liner, even at full lock, with a range of different brands of tires within that size. I've also never had rubbing with a 275/40 on a 17x9.5", 56mm offset (repro C4 sized wheels).

The only time I experienced the exact sort of rubbing that the OP has mentioned (full lock, parking lot type situations, minor scrubbing on the wheel well liner) with a 275/40 tire of any brand was with a 17x9.5" wheel at a 44mm offset.

*JC*

Just like to say up front "Thank you, to everyone" for your contribution, it's greatly appreciated. I had not been thinking of tires a few weeks ago and had no idea how limited my choices had become since 2009 when I put the KD's on. I spent a good penny for them back then, and I was never disappointed in their performance. However like anything else stuff gets old, and you have to keep up maintence, at 8 years and nearly 10,000 miles they're not what they once was. They've got lots tread left on them, but the weather on rubber here in Florida is cruel. A car setting out in the sunlight for an hour here is equalivant to 8 hours up north. The humidity and Ozone just attacks rubber here like crazy.

All this Tire research got me to thinking about other things. I went and had a close look at my Harley and sure enough they needed replacing as well. Luckily I knew what I needed there and got them in today.

Anyway, here I am looking and asking for opinions. I must admit I'm really clueless as to what to get? I know a blowout will cost me a great deal more than just replacing a tire. But there just isn't much out there on the market for a OEM Speedline WS6 17x9 wheel. I'm not looking to buy rims, I like the factory ones. Mostly the car gets out for cruise-in's, club meets and that's about it. I don't take to the race track or drag strip. So, I'm sure it seems rather silly sounding of me wanting dry traction tires. All I can say to answer that is, when I like to go, I want it to stick like glue on glue

But yes, I have noticed that the inner fender has been brushed a few times, when I've been cleaning the car up. It's nothing dramatic or damaged looking. I can give it a wipe and you'd never notice it was ever there. I'm guessing that happens whenever I've had to hard lock the wheel to get into a parking space. The tire does that lean with it's outer edge of the tire and slightly brushes the inner fender. I noticed that did that with the OEM Goodyears and it done it with the BFG KD's. It's really not that big a deal just something I've noticed over the years. The car isn't lowered or anything and it's suspension is up to specs.

As I've said earlier I've given some thought to the Nitto 555 G2, but the new pattern is really to improve it's wet performace over the older 555 pattern. Wet traction really means nothing to me, as this car seldom sees rain. I won't even take it out if I believe there's a chance of rain. And here in Florida it rains a lot, in the summer time come 3pm it's going to rain. My biggest concern with Nitto is I hear they run narrow, and I've seen some images that confirm this to be true. I guess that's why Nitto don't advertise their tread width in any literature? I'm certainly not opposed to Nitto's I'm just concerened they'd be too skinny and I want something more sticky than the 555's.

High mileage doesn't do me any good, for the one's I've got have only used 2/32 of the tread that they came with new. My problem is aging, and drying out. So, any tire with 8/32 will last me many years, some years I've not driven th car 600 miles, other years twice that much. It's not even a weekend car, it's very much just a toy

You ever see the temps that our asphalt reaches here in Florida on a hot summer day? Heck a tire setting in the Walmart parking lot is getting a heat cycle. But all jokes aside I do know what you mean. A R-compound tire has to get to it's scorching temp to have a true heat cycle. Nevertheless, every bit of driving does heat up a tire and like a ni-cad battery, it loses it's recharge capacity a little if not drained completely. So, even without giving the tire a full workout your starving it of some of it's grip, with ever road trip. I hope that makes some sense? That's all I meant

I'm not sure a Toyo RA1 or R888 will work on my OEM Speedline rims (Stock WS6 OEM rims) without rubbing on the front? Maybe someone here knows? Each have a large section width, the RA1 has 11.9" and the R888 has 11.0". Both have a tread width of almost 10.5". The OEM Goodyear F1-GS had a section width of 10.9" and the BFG KD's had the same section width. Only the Toyo R1R has something close at 10.8". When we get away from R-compound tires it becomes a lot more uniform between competitors. Most having a section width of 10.9".

If I elect to stay away from an R-compound tire and there is many reasons to do so. One being, it's not good to let R-compound tires set for weeks on end inflated. Therefore in the regular street tire market which is where I'd prefer to stay my options are limited.

Nitto G2 320 AA A
BFG Sport Comp 2 340 AA A
Yoko S-Drive 300 AA A
MT Street Comp 300 AA A
Toyo R1R 200 AA A
Nitto NT05 200 AA A (I'm not sure that's even still made)

RPM WS6

iTrader: (3)

Sounds like we use our F-bodies in very much the same way. What you wrote above is almost exactly how I would outline my usage as well. The only real difference is climate; I don't have to deal with anywhere near the degree of heat or humidity that you do, but I do have some pretty cool temps to be prepared for early and late in the driving season that aren't really a concern in FL. That climate difference is the main reason why I think the Sport COMP-2 would be a better fit for me than for you, but that's not to say that it would be a poor choice for your application.

I still find this condition odd for stock height, stock wheels and stock tire size. My WS6 had the same wheel and tire size (and offset), and also came on F1 GS tires. They did not rub/brush the wheel well liner at all, and that's something I would have noticed as I used to keep those wheel wells spotless for show purposes. There was also no rubbing when I switched to KDW on that car. Likewise, I had 17x9.5/56mm offset repro C4 ZR1 wheels on my '02 Z28 with no rubbing using a 275mm KDWS. And my '98 Z28 currently has factory sized 17x9/50mm offset (same as your Speedlines) SS/ZR1 wheels with the 275 KDW and also no rubbing (again, wheel wells kept clean for show purposes so I would notice.)

It's odd that you've seen this sort of rubbing even with the factory original tires. I wonder if your wheel well liners were not installed perfectly at the factory? There really should be no contact at all. Again, the only time I saw this exact sort of brushing was with a 17x9.5/44mm offset wheel with a 275/40 GS-D3 tire on my '98. But that was due to the 44mm offset on a 9.5" wheel, and even still it was a very slight brush that left nothing more than a scuff mark at full lock. Minor as that may be, it shouldn't be happening with a completely stock setup, although yours seems to be the exception. In other words, even if others report no such issues with the tires you've listed as potential candidates above, you should take that with a grain of salt as your particular car seems to be a special case.

*JC*

Evidently we do and that's not to say it don't get cold down here. Throw in the natural occurring humidity that seeps from the ground and a cold 34F night and it can be down right frigid feeling. Our Summers are brutal because of the humidity, we don't reach temps that you see in desert regions but a 95F day can be blistering with our humidity. The Club I'm with has an animal rescue place for it's choosen charity. The lady there has some info on the dangers of heat in regard to animals. Interestingly enough this correlates and is useful in other areas. Our high UV exposure during the summer combined with the normal summer temperature is staggering. An ordinary asphalt highway can reach tempetures of 140+ degrees for hours. It only takes 160F to fry an egg.



I don't really know how to explain it better than that what I've said already? It's not like happens all the time or anything. Maybe it's just when a number of conditions happen to fall into the right place, like being on a downward slope or something, that causes the car body to contort a little or the A-arm to be pushed up with more weight on it? What I can say for certain is it has to be when the wheel is locked hard over (as in the attachment photo), it's a very gentle brush mark that can easily go unnoticed. There has been plenty of times I've cleaned the wheel wells and never seen it. So, whatever it is that's happening is very rare because most of the time I never see it and I keep my inner fender well, well maintained.

What concerns me the most about Nitto is their narrowness. I just don't know if that's true of all Nitto's or just track tires i.e. drag radials & autocross tires? Otherwise I was thinking of going with the MT Street Comps for something a little different than what others are running to add some conversation when I take it to shows & cruise-in's, but I hear the Cooper Zeon RS3-S has seen it's share of issues, with beads blowing out and that's who makes the MT Street Comps. I'm not opposed to going with a Toyo or Yokahama and if need be another BFG. What I'm not going to do is fork out $300 a rim for some overpriced tire by Goodyear, that's going to set mostly and age. I'm open to suggestions which is why I'm asking

JROC

The narrowness you are talking about is more of a Japanese tire (Nitto, Toyo, Bridgestone, Falken, etc, etc) vs European/American tire (Michelin, GY, M/T, Pirelli, etc) thing than it is Nitto's are just narrow running tires. I had this explained to me by a guy who used to own a performance shop years ago, and he said that why Japanese tires tended to run a little smaller than American/European tires is because they use different points on the tire to measure from. I can't remember what it was exactly but maybe something like Japanese tires are measured by the overall wide of the tire at it's widest point whereas American/European tires might measure across the wideth of the tread to classify it's size. Again I don't remember exactly what it was but it was something like that. And Dave who told me this was a pretty smart dude who I generally trusted what he told me so I guess he knew what he was talking about.

If you mount a Nitto 275/40-17 on your car you're not going to notice a difference in it's width compared to a GY or other tire in that size. Maybe if you compared them side by side and use a measuring tape you might find a slight difference between them, but that's any tires you compare to others. Nitto 295/45-18's look just as wide and bulge just as much on my Lightning as any GY or Toyo tire I've seen in that size.

The tire that really gave Nitto its rep for having tires that run small is the 555R which is the DR version of the 555. More specifically it was the 555R in a 315/35-17. Mustang and Fbody guys where taking that tire and mounting them up on their factory 17x9" wheels and not getting fitment issues. Sure they would bulge noticeably but not as bad as a BFG DR with 295/305 widths. So yes a 555R runs on the narrower side of things, but a BFG DR also runs on the wider side of things.

When comparing Nitto's to the old BFG G-Force KD's I must say I like the Nitto's much better. I ran a couple KD sets on my old 99 Roush Stage 2. The BFG KD where BFG's top dry performance street tire that they released in the 90's. They were pretty good at the time but IMHO their performance was outclassed pretty quickly in the 2000's by most other serious competitors. For example a Nitto NT05 is a better handling dry tire, it's far better in the rain, and has the same crappy lifespan of the BFG KD's and most any other 200 treadwear rated tire out there. And I'm not even a huge NT05 fanboy. I mean they handle well and are surprisingly good in the rain, but they don't last, and they can't plant power for ****.

I've used several sets of 200 treadwear rated tires from BFG's/Faulken/Nitto and I've gotten off of that bandwagon. Those tires with that treadwear rating claim to fame (regardless of manufacture) is their dry handling capabilities for a street tire. In reality they're only decent at that and they compromise everywhere else IMO. A R-compound tire will eat them alive in a turn and most 300 treadwear rated tires gives you 90% of their handling, as well as lasting over twice as many miles, oddly enough planting a lot more power for whatever reason, being better wet and cold traction tires, being less expensive, quieter, and just easier tires to live with day to day.

Anyways I'm getting off topic I feel. I'm not saying that you need to buy Nitto's, but I'm saying that if their reputation for running small is keeping you from trying them it shouldn't. They are excellent tires that are a great value and they do very few things poorly for a street tire. Their running small is greatly exaggerated (other than the 555R'S) and their sizing is in the same league as any other Japanese tire which is probably a little smaller than Michelins/GY's/BFG's/Pirelli's or any other major American/European tires classified as the same size. I think this is more noticed on your bigger tires though. Like if your putting new tires on the back of your C6Z you might say that your old Michelins seemed to be a little wider than new Nitto INVO's, but that doesn't necessarily mean that you're going to get a lesser performing tire either.

To be honest I'm likely going to try the Cooper Zeon RS3-S when I get tires for my C6Z wheels as I'm not rich and the prices for these somewhat bastard sized tires can get pretty crazy. (I learned that when I bought my Lightning)

RPM WS6

iTrader: (3)

I don't agree on this point. The KD was a fairly new product in the early 2000s and continued to be a strong competitor for as long as fresh versions were still available. The KD was nearly as sticky as a drag radial on the street, while offering vastly better handling characteristics and MUCH better wear/lifespan and high speed stability than the stickiest of DRs at the time. That, IMO, was their biggest benefit.

In my personal experience, the Nitto DRs of the day (100 treadwear) were just barely stickier than even the KDW (300 treadwear) on the street without a major burnout to preheat them. The KD (200 treadwear) was sticker than Nitto DRs on the street and just about as sticky as the old BFG DRs (I think those were a 0/no rating treadwear?) The KD (and, to a lesser degree, KDW) greatly out performed both of those DRs in the handling department while still offering comparable dry lanuch grip on a non-prepped street surface where a major preheat wasn't an option, in my experience.

On this point I generally agree. Unless you're looking for essentially a drag radial that can handle, I don't see much purpose for a 200 treadwear tire. Though yes, this is still a compromise as it's not a true race tire. As you mentioned, 300 range gives you nearly as much dry grip and with some other benefits that may or may not be important depending on location and purpose. That's why tires in the ~300 range have become my primary focus now for street performance.

*JC*

All extremely good info and I thank you for your input, JROC, it's much appreciated.

Agreed a tire is a compromise and that's why an ordinary street tire is more of a swiss army knife. It can do many things but it can't do any of them specifically well. A mud tire is great for offroading it's not worth a darn on the drag strip and vice versa. I don't mind sacrificing some wet grip to have better dry grip, it's a trade off. As I've said this car doesn't get driven in the rain. but it's no race car either. My interest in dry traction is merely for selfish reasons because I want it to grip when it's dry. Tire wear is hardly of any importance to me either. I've only worn off 2/32 of an 8/32 tire in 8 years. The tire will dry out long before I wear the tread out. So, even a 200 UTQG tire last me a long time. I could probably go to a 100 UTQG tire and still have tread left in 6 or 8 years?

I've very much given the Nitto NT-01 consideration. I'm not looking for traction from a dig, if that were so I'd be putting a DR on the rear. I'd much rather it grip going around corners. The KD's did extremely well at that despite a true R-compound tire having a clear advantage over them. They held on to the top of the food chain in their segment even when others tried to imitate their performance. Road temperture and the wrong PSI can make even the best tire lose to a lesser performer. Why the one's I have now have become so hard and dried out they'd lose to grandma's bald snow tires in the grip

Straight forward talk, I like that. Nitto is certianly not off my list despite the claims about hearing of them running small. Compostion of a tire has more importance than width. My least favorite tirein the Nitto's is the Nitto 555 G2, climbing up the scale to one's that I feel would do better in the dry, being the Nitto NT-05 and even more so the NT-01.

You say you're considering the Cooper Zeon RS3-S, then I'm sure you are aware the Mickey Thompson Street Comp is nearly the same. MT tires are manufactured by Cooper. Sufice to say there is proably some slight degree in differences between the two, despite the name on the sidewall and cosmetic tread pattern? Mickey Thompson isn't going to have it's name put on a tire that doesn't perform to their expectations. So, there is every reason to believe the rubber mixture has a slight recipe change, than it's Cooper RS3-S cousin. The MT Street Comp was another tire I was strongly considering. It's got a reasonable price and slightly cheaper than the Cooper RS3-S, by about $20 bucks per tire.

So, far I've made no final decision but you and the others have given me valuable insight in helping me get a better grasp, on what's out there and what might work the best for me. Dry grip is the most important, looks come second. I like the Nitto's appearance except maybe the NT-05. I also like the Mickey Street Comps despite them being more wet friendly. The Yoko S-Drives have a nice tread pattern but a few test show them coming in last compared to other tires, that they shouldn't be getting beaten by. Bad traction compound I suppose? The Goodyears, nice looking and grippy but way too expensive. The BFG Sport Comp 2, it's okay looking but it don't inspire me to turn the wheel. I even like the looks of some of the Toyo's except maybe that R888 which reminds me of a farm tractor tire, LOL. But hey what grips is what grips right In the end is all about what will work on my stock WS6 wheels, what gives me the best dry traction, looks nice and gives me the best bang for the buck. So, any and all of them are still on the table for my consideration. I'm enjoying the postive responses each of you have shared, it's good to see there are people like yourselves who'll take the time to give an honest opinion

Wow, had to pause to take an interesting phone call. A former Club President's job never ends. LOL. I just got a call from the Board of the Boca Raton Concours d’Elegance about a future exclusive event. in which they've asked me to assist them in locating potential 67 Firebird owners who might wish to participate in their show. This is really a big deal and a true opportunity for a 67 Firebird owner, they don't just let any old car in. I'll have more details in the next few days. So. if you know of anyone with a pristine stock 67 firebird looking to bring it to Florida in early February 2017 tell them to PM me.

*JC*

Here's an attachment with some tire conctact patch comparisions. Obviously it's not just how much rubber comes in contact with the pavement but also the compound used in the rubber. In theory the lower the UTQG the sticker the tire.