redrocketls1

want to run stock block and crank.. im looking for forged pistons and rods and i guess ill hone the block right? i want to spray more then a 150 shot on the stock motor, that is the reason for this idea.. prolly will eventually port the heads and add a cam as well..

just wondering if anyone had found basically stock replacement forged pistons and rods to keep the stock cube size, ran ported heads and a moderate cam and sprayed upwards of 200 or more...

if anyone has a idea for a complete setup pls let me know, or if anyone knows where i can find the pistons, rods, ect to pull this off without paying like 5000 for some shops kit let me know!

jrp

iTrader: (16)

plenty of shops can build you a budget forged 347 for under 3k sans core charge. FWIW i got mine for 2600 w/ no core:

347ci LS6 Shortblock
Diamond Pistons 6.6 domes w/ Diamond rings
Eagle #D 6.125 Rods
Stock treated crank
ARP Main Studs
Clevite bearings

Boostaholic

iTrader: (4)

Well for 4000 you could expect a fully forged stroker from a shop, I _believe_ HPE quoted me 3800 on the base 408 stroker.

The main cost of these kits is the crank, a eagle crank runs right around $900. But if you and some of your friends know enough to pull the short block out and install your own rods and pistons (It's not really hard) then you will be into this project about $2000.

Some things you have to consider are you will need new head gaskets, exhaust manifold gaskets, head bolts or studs, balancer bolt, oil, etc. Then you need the good stuff.

Plan on at least this much
$700 - rods
$600 - pistons
$70 - arp rod bolts

And it wouldn't hurt to get
$160 - arp main studs

Look at the prices on thunders web page, that will give you a pretty good ballpark for prices you can expect to find on this type of stuff, I have gotten other stuff cheaper elsewhere though.

redrocketls1

i was thinking more like the rods and pistons and use stock crank for around 1500.... ive seen diamond pistons and rods around 600$ for pistons or rods on ls1speed.com.. just dont know which ones to get or which ones work with stock block crank and bore.. i need pistons for spray.

Boostaholic

iTrader: (4)

Like I said, the 3800 base price on my 408 - $900 for a eagle crankshaft would have put me right around $2900, pretty hard to beat that price, esp when HPE warrantys their short blocks long as you don't have power adders.

Boostaholic

iTrader: (4)

The main question is, do you or your friends have the tools and knowledge to assemble a short block?

If the answer is yes, then you can save a lot of money going this route.

redrocketls1

term- thanks.. and my dad can put it back together no sweat.. i realize using the stock crank will save an *** of money.. but which pistons and rods do i want to run is the question i guess.. i myself dont know the difference when words like reliefs and vavles adn **** like that come into play.. i was wondering what would be a good piston/rod for a stockblock stockcrank setup that will be sprayed

redrocketls1

yea we can get it out, apart, and back together.. but choosing a piston/rod combo from ls1speed or thunderracing to use with stock crank prooving a lot harder then for a 355 or 383 sbc, to me anyways

Boostaholic

iTrader: (4)

How much money do you have to spend? The 600 diamond pistons should be fine, and you can get Lunati rods for about $750, which are considered by many people to be a very good rod, usually in higher end rotating assembly kits.

Make sure you get the ARP rod bolts, and don't forget the cost of getting your whole rotating assy balanced at your local machine shop.

jrp

iTrader: (16)

what was the final cost though, we all know you never end up paying base price for **** because added **** ends up adding to the cost. and he wants a power adder which makes the warrenty moot.

redrocket: diamond makes forged pistons for stock rods and manley makes 6.100 length rods. or you can hone and go with a 3.905 piston and and a longer rod length; 6.125.

Boostaholic

iTrader: (4)

Its not really moot, because if you assemble a short block yourself and mess it up, you pay for it, we are talking about the first few hours of a motors life here, which are when failure is most likley to happen.

But it sounds like he has some good help, so that should not be a problem.

redrocketls1

mmkay jrp... only thing i didn't get was done u have to hone the block no matter what aftermarket piston u run? i was told u did it so it would seat or grip... coulda been bs tho.. so i guess i need to get a 3.905 piston, 6.125 lenght rod.. have my guy at the machine shop hone it and balance it and then im good to go.. but one more question... im wanting to spray but im also going to add a cam. that combo above will still allow me to run a moderate lift cam in or around .560-.580 lift?

redrocketls1

neways thanks a lot to both of you! went from knowing nothing to bout getting it figured out!

redrocketls1

whats the difference b/t this piston
Flat top/3.905 bore/3.622 stroke/6.125 rod/1.315 comp. height/.927x2.500 wrist pin/-2cc valve relief and... this one...
Flat top/3.905 bore/3.622 stroke/6.098 rod/1.340 comp. height/.945x2.500 wrist pin/-2cc valve relief

is either of those right.. i want stock stroke remember

and which works wth this rod?
Lunati Pro-Mod Connecting Rods, 6.125" ROD LENGTH, .927 WRIST PIN, 2.100 CRANK PIN, .940 JRNL WIDTH (Includes ARP Connecting Rod Bolts

jrp

iTrader: (16)

piston 1 is for 6.125 rods, piston 2 is for stock rods. both using the stock 3.622 stroke. longer the rod length the smaller the piston compressed height gets. if you ran piston 1 with 6.125 rods the pistons would stick out of the deck far to high.

piston 1 works with that lunati rod you posted.

jrp

iTrader: (16)

it is moot because either way engine failure will come out of his pocket:

he builds the motor wrong
HPE builds the motor right and he sprays a 200 shot and failure occurs warrenty is void

Paulz2820

iTrader: (1)

Yah, but if HPE builds the motor wrong and he's only run the motor for an hour and it blows up before he uses nitrous then its HPE's problem.

Inspector12

iTrader: (29)

The cheapest forged bottom end it to buy a good set of pistons low friction coating on the skirts and a ceramic coating on the combustion side and use the stock rods have the fitted for full floating pins and use arp rod bolts and main studs and also have the rotating asyembly balanced. I was quoted from Polydyne coatings a set of Weisco pistons with the coatings for $545 + @$150 for rings and I am not sure what they charge to bush the rods for full floating pins and balancing. After that you will need @$200 for new bearings through out the motor. Don't for get new Head gaskets and a few other miss seals and gaskets items. Good luck with your decision!

redrocketls1

jrp- so i want to run piston too with a stock length forged rods get the block honed, and buy new bearings and gaskets ect.. my dad has rebuilt plenty of motors... from hemi's to bigblocks ect... im sure with a lil advice from someone if he has a question we can do it.. we have a lift and a stand... not worrying about it blowing up..
so if i run the stock rod length and the piston to match!, then that would basically be a stock forged assembly correct? what is the stock rod length so ill be able to pick out some stock forged rods.. im guessig i do want to run the forged rods since the whole purpose of this is to spray 200 or more with a cam and ported heads

jrp

iTrader: (16)

stock rod length is 6.098. most aftermarket companies just state theres as 6.100.

might want to look into something like this:

http://www.sdpc2000.com/catalog/2719...Piston-Kit.htm

then just buy the appropriate rod.