Generation IV Internal Engine - So there's really no on in here that can help an LS4 guy?

I made a post about 2 weeks back asking for the max bore possible on the stock sleeves in an LS4, the FWD 5.3L V8. Id appreciate any help I can get! And I mean c'mon enough already with not counting the LS4 cars as real GM muscle, if you were going to have a FWD car wouldn't you want it to have the latest small block Chevy?

I would say possibly .010-.015 max from hone.
Is the motor damaged? Or just looking for more hp?
Remote mount turbo is what i would go for if i owned one of those cars and looking for more hp.

Well actually no, id save my pennies and get the RWD v8. Not the wrong wheel drive truck v8 :p

No idea on max bore though. If you're going that far you might as well just get a short block

no damage, always in the pursuit of more power!

There is a turbo kit that promises 505 fwhp, up from 303 at the flywheel...but its 5 grand and thats WAY too much power for a wrong wheel drive street car.

I also looked into an STS universal kit, but again no thanks...

I have an engine shop that owes me a free build...so my plan was to bore out to LS1/6 spec and essentially have an LS6 (LS4's have 243 heads) throw a cam at it and be done with 450 hp easy...but then I come to find that the LS4 cannot be bored out the same as the truck 5.3's, which based on your knowledge is confirmed...looks like I'll be resleeving

I don't wanna have a custom crank made to get extra inches, just wanna bore...what's the biggest I can go as far as bore and displacment? can I go as big as 4.125 to give me 387ci? (resleeved) will that require new rods too?

big thanks to NemeSS for being first to help the less respected of the current SBC community :)

Well actually no, id save my pennies and get the RWD v8. Not the wrong wheel drive truck v8 :p

No idea on max bore though. If you're going that far you might as well just get a short block

the LS4's have a shortened crank and block, plus a super low profile accessory drive...so replacing it with a different LS based engine is out of the cards period, simply just won't fit its too wide, er well long...whatever

there's nowhere to buy an already built short block from either, has to be my engine unless I wanna buy a core which I don't, but that's not an issue because my trans is about to shatter anyways, and it's getting a newer model 6T75 all beefed up regardless of how far I go beyond a cam with this engine...really want more cubes

I highly doubt the sleeves are thick enough to bore .119 to ls1 specs. I would put money on a .010 max hone.

It's pointless to bore a sleeved motor, there is not enough material to make any gains. If you want more displacement, you will need to resleeve it.

How much power do you plan to make? Im around 450 (crank) 370fwhp with cam, ported heads/intake, 10.5 cr and headers. You can use the tfs 5.3 head and cam package with a ls6 intake and headers. There was a member who made 495 crank hp with the tfs heads 222* tfs cam with the mods listed above. This was dyno'd with open headers and electric water pump only. (max effort run)

If the shop owes you a build then have them sonic test the bores to see how far you can go. GM sells .5mm over sized pistons. Trw sells pistons that are much bigger.

My cars power is very hard to control without the anti score kicking in and killing power.

You could always use a 6.0l block with the ls4 crank and accessories. You would need to use an adapter plate on the bellhousing. I would have the bellhousing milled down and weld on the adapter plate.

If the shop owes you a build then have them sonic test the bores to see how far you can go. GM sells 5mm over sized pistons. Trw sells pistons that are much bigger.

I don't think 5 mm is possible, but .5mm or .020" should not be a problem. I think the sleeves in a 5.3 are thicker than 5.7 though, possibly even the same od as 5.7. have not confirmed this, but I do see schwanke sells a short block based on L33 aluminum block with 5.7L piston size.

I am wondering if that is a maximum bore point to fit the stock 3.898s or can you go to the 3.903 or 3.910 with these sleeves. with a sonic test to make sure they're centered of course, cause a cast in sleeve could definitely be shifted. I would like to know if the 5.3 aluminum castings use the same molds as 5.7s. If so, a 4.2 sleeve is an option.

He's gonna spend way more on a built sleeved ls4 regardless if shop owes him. Than 5000$.
Build a remote mount diy turbo system. No need for sts. Source all the parts yourself. Save cash by installing fabricating by self.
Upgrade fuel system, tune. More Hp than will ever be able to use.
The h/c guy mentioned his car hard to control with so much power. Turbo will make more.

Why don't you sell the car and buy a used G8?

How much power do you plan to make? Im around 450 (crank) 370fwhp with cam, ported heads/intake, 10.5 cr and headers. You can use the tfs 5.3 head and cam package with a ls6 intake and headers. There was a member who made 495 crank hp with the tfs heads 222* tfs cam with the mods listed above. This was dyno'd with open headers and electric water pump only. (max effort run)

If the shop owes you a build then have them sonic test the bores to see how far you can go. GM sells .5mm over sized pistons. Trw sells pistons that are much bigger.

My cars power is very hard to control without the anti score kicking in and killing power.

I know your just about the fastest N/A LS4 on here, and if you say your car is hard to control making 450, which is totally believable, then I think I'm just gonna go with a similar build to yours and I'll be pretty happy with the gain for the $...thanks for the insight

You could always use a 6.0l block with the ls4 crank and accessories. You would need to use an adapter plate on the bellhousing. I would have the bellhousing milled down and weld on the adapter plate.

really? I wouldn't even have to mess with the adapting anything because I'm planning on going with the 6T75 trans anyway...but I thought the LS4 block was shortened as well to accomodate the shorter crank so I don't see how this would work...I hope I'm wrong on that then I'd have 364ci and make 500 horse with ease!

all I want is to be able to take a stock RWD LS or Hemi powered car on the highway...I already kill 4.6 mustangs

He's gonna spend way more on a built sleeved ls4 regardless if shop owes him. Than 5000$.
Build a remote mount diy turbo system. No need for sts. Source all the parts yourself. Save cash by installing fabricating by self.
Upgrade fuel system, tune. More Hp than will ever be able to use.
The h/c guy mentioned his car hard to control with so much power. Turbo will make more.

I don't have the time to deal with something like that anymore, I don't wanna mess with a turbo on this car, just simply not what I want

Why don't you sell the car and buy a used G8?

If I had a dollar for everytime someone said that to me I could go buy a G8 and pay cash.

but believe it or not I own this car because I like it...imagine that...plus I already have other RWD cars to play with and pontiacs are ugly :jest:

Say I resleeved the motor...what's the biggest bore I can go? Could I do 4.125 like an LS7 to give me 387ci with the stock crank. Does that much of an overbore require different rods? Would stock LS7 pistons work?

Or if I wanted to swap out the block, could I use an LS3 then put the LS4 rotating assembly in it? Or is the LS2 my only option?

Most aluminum 4.8/5.3s and irons can be bored to 3.900 actually. The other larger bore blocks (5.7/6.0/6.2/7.0) can't be bored that much over but most 4.8/5.3s can. We have done about 30 in the last several years all with no problems. They have a way thicker liner or another words are like a 5.7 with a way thicker sleeve that is only bored out to 3.780. If you have the heads off you can see this pretty easily. All the Aluminum 4.8/5.3 blocks we have seen are like this. We have one here now and it's like this as well.

I know someone with a bland ass impala aint calling a G8 ugly :lol:

My impala is far from bland...and all pontiacs are ugly except pre 1971 GTOs...if your not in here to commend on the question then GTFO so sick of the haters on here

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y60/fyrfytr998/Oh_lawd.jpg

The ls4 block is not shorter. I wouldnt bother with sleeving. Do a rear mount turbo, or stab in a cam with a LS6 intake.
You can PM me for details to aviod negitive comments. You gotta take back the ugly Pontiac comment though... Lol

This car should trap 114-115 this year, and Im hoping for 1.8 60ft times (fingers crossed!) 3865 lb race weight and all motor!
Shifts are set at 6800 with 3.69 gears and 3500 stall.

and pontiacs are ugly :jest:

:laser: :kali: :bigun2: :soapbox:

Save your money and build one of these when you can get your hands on one:

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2012-chevrolet-caprice-ppv-police-car-review-review

Honestly what is the attraction to making 400+ at the front wheels? It's not going to be usable power.

- Ugly Pontiac owner

For the same reason the imports do. Its still fun, and when on the freeway, traction isnt an issue. I run a 12.71 last year with a 1.98 60 ft. Without slicks or sticky tires. not looking for a highfive or anything.:-)

Nothing wrong with fwd. They make great daily drivers and are easy to drive in the elements.
Also before somebody cries about torque steer, its not all that bad in these cars, thanks to the engineers.

A G8 is a nice car, and I would get one if I could afford it. I do however like being different..

For the same reason the imports do. Its still fun, and when on the freeway, traction isnt an issue. I run a 12.71 last year with a 1.98 60 ft. Without slicks or sticky tires. not looking for a highfive or anything.:-)

Nothing wrong with fwd. They make great daily drivers and are easy to drive in the elements.
Also before somebody cries about torque steer, its not all that bad in these cars, thanks to the engineers.

A G8 is a nice car, and I would get one if I could afford it. I do however like being different..

No doubt your numbers are impressive for a front wheel drive car, or most cars for that matter. Your sig photo does show pretty big tires in the front, though. Hell, I think the impala was featured in the Drive film, although dubbed with a manual trans.

It's just a lot easier to start with a (new) Caprice or G8 before the mods start and so much easier to overcome fwd limitations.

Save your money and build one of these when you can get your hands on one:

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2012-chevrolet-caprice-ppv-police-car-review-review

NOW THATS MORE LIKE IT! haha pontiacs aren't ugly I just don't wanna hear "why don't you get a G8" anymore, I mean c'mon like I don't realize that GM makes RWD sedans...and I'm a Super Sport nut and pontiac's don't come as SS's, but i did think about a 1st gen CTS-V right after I got the Impala :) but I love having something different

that Caprice PPV is going to be offered to the public as a 2013 or 2014, but It will most likely be dubbed a Chevelle and I may have to sell my C5 and swing into a new Chevelle to match my '66, damn vette's faling apart

For the same reason the imports do. Its still fun, and when on the freeway, traction isnt an issue. I run a 12.71 last year with a 1.98 60 ft. Without slicks or sticky tires. not looking for a highfive or anything.:-)

Nothing wrong with fwd. They make great daily drivers and are easy to drive in the elements.
Also before somebody cries about torque steer, its not all that bad in these cars, thanks to the engineers.

I couldn't agree more, those are some nice numbers...turbo cars aren't runnin much faster for the most part, I want the same shit that you've got.

and torque steer isn't an issue at all with my tublar control arms and stiff suspension, I just wish the driveshafts were equal legnth

what kind of diff can I run and still have the car usable in the rain and snow?...I was thinking an electronic selectable locker


This car should trap 114-115 this year, and Im hoping for 1.8 60ft times (fingers crossed!) 3865 lb race weight and all motor!
Shifts are set at 6800 with 3.69 gears and 3500 stall.

you're revving up to 6800? damn man, did you do anything to the bottom end? so I assume you chose a cam that yielded a bit less low end power in trade for a high rpm screamer? what are the stock gears? and how do you like having the high stall converter? for FWD I assumed you didn't need to mess with that because of traction issues off the line, but based on your numbers I'm obviouslly wrong

thank you everyone for the productive comments so i can stop doing this :bang:

For the same reason the imports do. Its still fun, and when on the freeway, traction isnt an issue. I run a 12.71 last year with a 1.98 60 ft. Without slicks or sticky tires. not looking for a highfive or anything.:-)

Nothing wrong with fwd. They make great daily drivers and are easy to drive in the elements.
Also before somebody cries about torque steer, its not all that bad in these cars, thanks to the engineers.

A G8 is a nice car, and I would get one if I could afford it. I do however like being different..

True...until you race them...and then the only thing wrong is physics. :D

hey guy what kinda fucking avatar picture is that? i mean really?

The bottom end is stock. The ls4 uses the updated ls2 style rod bolts, and uses lighter pistons then the bigger bore motors, so there is no real reason to mess with it. I did install a ported and blue printed ls6 oil pump. The stock ls4 pump flows 30% more so i ditched it to keep the pan from getting sucked dry, and to free up a little more hp up top. I also installed a katech c-5r timing chain. The chain is a work of art. (I almost installed it around my neck lmoa). These two upgrades are on my current engine, along with ported heads.
The stock ls2 chain was pretty streached so i scraped it. Plus I have heard to many breakage stories.

On the street I have the shift points set for 6200. At the track I tap shift at 6800.
I shifted at 6800 due to the stupid stock gearing (2.93) so I would pass through the lights in 2nd doing 6800

I have not been to the track new engine or with my new trans. The trans was completely updated with TEP parts. 3.69 gears with a 3500 Stall (stock is close to 3000 btw)

The bottom end is stock. The ls4 uses the updated ls2 style rod bolts, and uses lighter pistons then the bigger bore motors, so there is no real reason to mess with it. I did install a ported and blue printed ls6 oil pump. The stock ls4 pump flows 30% more so i ditched it to keep the pan from getting sucked dry, and to free up a little more hp up top. I also installed a katech c-5r timing chain. The chain is a work of art. (I almost installed it around my neck lmoa). These two upgrades are on my current engine, along with ported heads.
The stock ls2 chain was pretty streached so i scraped it. Plus I have heard to many breakage stories.

On the street I have the shift points set for 6200. At the track I tap shift at 6800.
I shifted at 6800 due to the stupid stock gearing (2.93) so I would pass through the lights in 2nd doing 6800

I have not been to the track new engine or with my new trans. The trans was completely updated with TEP parts. 3.69 gears with a 3500 Stall (stock is close to 3000 btw)

sweet, with the 6 speed I'll end up somewhere in 3rd going through the lights but it would be nice to rev that high reguardless, but the tach in the Impala only goes up to 6k so tapshit isn't gonna happen for me...I need a new converter anyway as mine's about to :bomb:, but i think im gonna wait on the gear until i can figure out what the right thing to do as far as a diff is, i assume your just running the stock diff? i know quaife make a specific for FWD LSD diff that was codeveloped with Ford for the Focus RS, but it's pricey IIRC...and that Focus RS isn't exactly meant for the snow, making yet another ford worthless :)

now that we've moved on from the pontiac comment, is it okay if I talk shit about ford on here? hahahaha :lol:

you're revving up to 6800? damn man, did you do anything to the bottom end? so I assume you chose a cam that yielded a bit less low end power in trade for a high rpm screamer? what are the stock gears? and how do you like having the high stall converter? for FWD I assumed you didn't need to mess with that because of traction issues off the line, but based on your numbers I'm obviouslly wrong

I have not been to the track with my new engine and trans. The new engine has a LS6 oil pump and a C5-R Katech timing chain. The rest of the bottom end is all stock. Our engine use the LS2 rod bolts and they are plenty stock for our smaller/lighter piston engine. Plus the LS2 has 10.9-11.1 CR vs our 10.1. I had the heads re-worked so I am around 10.5 now:devil:

The trans has been beefed up with TEP parts. Stock gearing is 2.93
As mentioned earlier, I am now using 3.69's with a 3500 stall. The stock converter is around 3000 stall. The gears have made a huge difference. No more staying in 2nd gear all day long anymore. When I was drag racing last year, I would pass through the lights in 2nd gear@6800rpm

The only problem I have now is with trans tuning. The anti-score keeps me from frying the tires past 1/3 throttle, and if I lift off then the trans upshifts. I am in the process of getting it tuned now.

No doubt your numbers are impressive for a front wheel drive car, or most cars for that matter. Your sig photo does show pretty big tires in the front, though. Hell, I think the impala was featured in the Drive film, although dubbed with a manual trans.

It's just a lot easier to start with a (new) Caprice or G8 before the mods start and so much easier to overcome fwd limitations.

I use 285/35/18 for track use. The tires are NT555r's and are nothing special.

I just watched Driver, and was hopping for some real good chase senes.:barf:
My G/F got pissed cause I lost interest after I heard the Impala shift a dozen times. :ripped: