Engine running warmer since new heads went on
04-26-2012, 08:29 AM
#1
Engine running warmer since new heads went on So far it hasn't been a huge issue but with summer coming up, I would like to get it fixed before it becomes one.
Before the 799s were put on the car would run consistent 194-198* (pcm not a dummy gauge) no matter what temp outside or how it was being driven.
Ever since then it has come up and is regularly at 200-205* even when it was in the 20-30* outside. While it might not come up any even once it gets hot outside, I am curious if it might be a good move to install a lower temp thermostat.
Would the added compression be to blame? Do the 799/243 heads just run slightly warmer due to design? They are 799 milled .010" with FelPro stock thickness gaskets (non MLS).
Before the 799s were put on the car would run consistent 194-198* (pcm not a dummy gauge) no matter what temp outside or how it was being driven.
Ever since then it has come up and is regularly at 200-205* even when it was in the 20-30* outside. While it might not come up any even once it gets hot outside, I am curious if it might be a good move to install a lower temp thermostat.
Would the added compression be to blame? Do the 799/243 heads just run slightly warmer due to design? They are 799 milled .010" with FelPro stock thickness gaskets (non MLS).
04-26-2012, 08:35 AM
#2
Are you running ls1 style crossover tubes, or ls6 style with the rear block offs? If running the block offs, switch to the old style rear crossover tube and see if that brings tour temp down any.
I'm still running my original heads, ported and milled the hell out of them and my temp runs real quick up to 194-196, but never and higher.
Might also check your fan turn on temp....maybe drop it down 10 degrees?
I'm still running my original heads, ported and milled the hell out of them and my temp runs real quick up to 194-196, but never and higher.
Might also check your fan turn on temp....maybe drop it down 10 degrees?
04-26-2012, 09:06 AM
#3
I am running the block offs. Not room for anything to go under the Fast intake, the block offs were also on the car before the new heads.
Fans are not PCM controlled, they are Ford Windstar fans. Consists of a smaller fan and a larger one. The small one is on a thermo switch I drilled/tapped into the top of the water pump and comes on at 180* if the thermostat is open. The large fan is on a manual switch and I use it in traffic or when I'm beating on the car.
In the past the large fan never helped anything, I mostly turned it on for cool down at the track and when beating on the car because it's the one behind the trans cooler. It also blows cool air over the intake tube so IATs drop around 10* with it on. Lately, I've been running it more often for peace of mind and it will bring the engine temps down to 199* or so.
Like I said there is nothing really of major concern now, just worried it might get worse once we see 100* days. Might have to wait and see how it does.
Fans are not PCM controlled, they are Ford Windstar fans. Consists of a smaller fan and a larger one. The small one is on a thermo switch I drilled/tapped into the top of the water pump and comes on at 180* if the thermostat is open. The large fan is on a manual switch and I use it in traffic or when I'm beating on the car.
In the past the large fan never helped anything, I mostly turned it on for cool down at the track and when beating on the car because it's the one behind the trans cooler. It also blows cool air over the intake tube so IATs drop around 10* with it on. Lately, I've been running it more often for peace of mind and it will bring the engine temps down to 199* or so.
Like I said there is nothing really of major concern now, just worried it might get worse once we see 100* days. Might have to wait and see how it does.
04-26-2012, 09:23 AM
#4
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Have you tried purchasing water wetter it will generally help by bringing the temps down as well. Its an additive you add to your antifreeze. I used to run that in an IROC i had that seemed to run warmer and that really helped dropping the temp down a lot. http://www.jegs.com/i/Red+Line+Oil/816/80204/10002/-1
There is a link to it to check it out.
There is a link to it to check it out.
04-26-2012, 09:51 AM
#6
Have you tried purchasing water wetter it will generally help by bringing the temps down as well. Its an additive you add to your antifreeze. I used to run that in an IROC i had that seemed to run warmer and that really helped dropping the temp down a lot. http://www.jegs.com/i/Red+Line+Oil/816/80204/10002/-1
There is a link to it to check it out.
There is a link to it to check it out.
Yes, same everything except cam, lifters, and heads. New gaskets (same type and brand), same coolant, and ARP head bolts instead of GM.
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04-26-2012, 11:20 AM
#8
i would think the added compression would create more heat but not so much that it adds that much heat to the engine.... i have twin puller flexalite fans one comes on at 170 and one at 185.... my car NEVER goes above the 2nd notch on a 4th gen trans am guages and im at 11.5:1 compression
04-27-2012, 11:00 PM
#9
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Did you happen to give your radiator a good cleaning when it was out for your H/C? I also put in an EPS 222/226 cam over the winter (and 241 -> 243 heads), and noticed the same thing. However some driving changes have an effect on coolant temp. Cruising in 6th was 199-201, shift to 5th and maintain the same speed, the temp drops to 196 within 30 seconds.
The other one was after a highway drive, come to a stop and idle. The temp shortly climbs to 207, both cooling fans wailing on high. If I rev to 3000 rpm (still parked), the temp quickly drops to 195. Grab the lower radiator hose, and it's pretty much cold. I think the radiator's way more efficient after the cleaning, so the thermostat is closed more now providing less flow through the radiator.
I suspect when the air temp hits 100, the PCM will read cooler.
The other one was after a highway drive, come to a stop and idle. The temp shortly climbs to 207, both cooling fans wailing on high. If I rev to 3000 rpm (still parked), the temp quickly drops to 195. Grab the lower radiator hose, and it's pretty much cold. I think the radiator's way more efficient after the cleaning, so the thermostat is closed more now providing less flow through the radiator.
I suspect when the air temp hits 100, the PCM will read cooler.
04-28-2012, 03:47 PM
#10
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When I was cam only my car would run around 190-195 religiously. After I put my PRC 215s on (60cc), my temps were in the 210-215 mark and on hot days as high as 225. After some spirited driving my in dash gauge started to climb past 210 and check gauges came on. After that I said no more and put a LT1 radiator in and it hasn't been over 195 since. That was all with a 160 T-stat.
04-30-2012, 07:36 AM
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The stock GM MLS gaskets have a tab to the left-center on the bottom, and I verified mine are on the right way. Thunderstruck said he has Felpros, and Google doesn't show that tab or a unique marker to verify orientation once reassembled.
OP, I would feel you radiator hoses. My lower was cold, and the upper was maybe 90 degrees (I could easily hang-on). Not enough flow to keep the hoses hot in the cooler weather we're having. So the hot coolant just ends up recirculating through the block.
If it were steam, I'd think 230-240 would be the range, and it would jump around as the engine revs.
OP, I would feel you radiator hoses. My lower was cold, and the upper was maybe 90 degrees (I could easily hang-on). Not enough flow to keep the hoses hot in the cooler weather we're having. So the hot coolant just ends up recirculating through the block.
If it were steam, I'd think 230-240 would be the range, and it would jump around as the engine revs.
04-30-2012, 08:43 AM
#15
Thanks guys, the more I think about it I think I'm just being over cautious and ****.
That is possible, with the new tune the car really wants a lot of idle timing. I might need to do more work trying to adjust it to idle well with less timing at idle/low rpm.
I've thought about that but the work was done back in October and the car has been driven over 2k miles since then and I would expect them to have made their way out, but I could be wrong.
I watched it real close the other day while doing some log runs and it was cooling off fine on the highway, just likes to come up an extra few degrees in town.
That is possible, with the new tune the car really wants a lot of idle timing. I might need to do more work trying to adjust it to idle well with less timing at idle/low rpm.
I've thought about that but the work was done back in October and the car has been driven over 2k miles since then and I would expect them to have made their way out, but I could be wrong.
I watched it real close the other day while doing some log runs and it was cooling off fine on the highway, just likes to come up an extra few degrees in town.
