Someone School Me On Water/Meth
06-07-2013, 02:15 PM
#1
Someone School Me On Water/Meth I've been playing around with the idea of adding a water/meth kit to my Heads/Cam/Full Bolt On 2002 WS6. I understand the concept of how the sytems work in regards to allowing you to run more timing due to the cooler intake charges and increase in octane, but I'm not sure if this would be that beneficial on a NA car. I know a ton of FI guys use these kits, but not so much in NA applications. What would be the average HP/TQ gain by adding something like this and does anyone have any information on which kit/company I should look at?
06-07-2013, 05:54 PM
#2
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In theory, cooler is always better....but I'm not sure exactly how you'd set this up on an NA vehicle....maybe a WOT sensor? As I'm sure you're aware, the FI guys are typically dealing with major IATs. I'm guessing your car runs in the 90-130 range in traffic/hwy.....probably not a whole lot to be gained, I'd think....but then again, I've never tried what you're thinking of. I would be curious to see what kind of MBT increase you'd see, and whether or not it would be worth it. My initial thought is that you'd not gain a whole lot....but I could be wrong.
06-08-2013, 03:39 PM
#4
Well, if you are 11:1 or higher, and struggling with KR and reduced timing to keep it in check, water meth would solve the problem and add hp.
I have thought about it as well because we get only 92 E10 here, and I get random KR.
Will be worse in hot weather. Cooling the intake charge will just be an added benefit.
Because of no boost to contend with, you won't need a fancy high pressure system. I haven't researched the brands available though.
Of course you would have to retune for it, if you have tuning software, it won't be too hard.
Ron
I have thought about it as well because we get only 92 E10 here, and I get random KR.
Will be worse in hot weather. Cooling the intake charge will just be an added benefit.
Because of no boost to contend with, you won't need a fancy high pressure system. I haven't researched the brands available though.
Of course you would have to retune for it, if you have tuning software, it won't be too hard.
Ron
06-09-2013, 05:34 AM
#5
Im going to add meth on my car. I have read of people running 36* of timing. On my car 4* was worth 25hp/tq across the board. In the real world you should get even more due to the charge cooling...which isnt really accounted for on the dyno. Im currently running 30* but on hot days im getting significant KR at WOT so I'm going meth/water.
I am looking at the Snow Performance kit, they have a version that works off the GM MAF. You set a threshold, then a gain setting and an injector size. Ill be using the washer tank so ill even have an idiot light on the tank level. I am hoping to get another 25whp...but I may be too optimistic. I plan to have it done in a couple of weeks.
I am looking at the Snow Performance kit, they have a version that works off the GM MAF. You set a threshold, then a gain setting and an injector size. Ill be using the washer tank so ill even have an idiot light on the tank level. I am hoping to get another 25whp...but I may be too optimistic. I plan to have it done in a couple of weeks.
06-09-2013, 11:20 AM
#7
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06-10-2013, 12:59 PM
#8
Im going to add meth on my car. I have read of people running 36* of timing. On my car 4* was worth 25hp/tq across the board. In the real world you should get even more due to the charge cooling...which isnt really accounted for on the dyno. Im currently running 30* but on hot days im getting significant KR at WOT so I'm going meth/water.
I am looking at the Snow Performance kit, they have a version that works off the GM MAF. You set a threshold, then a gain setting and an injector size. Ill be using the washer tank so ill even have an idiot light on the tank level. I am hoping to get another 25whp...but I may be too optimistic. I plan to have it done in a couple of weeks.
I am looking at the Snow Performance kit, they have a version that works off the GM MAF. You set a threshold, then a gain setting and an injector size. Ill be using the washer tank so ill even have an idiot light on the tank level. I am hoping to get another 25whp...but I may be too optimistic. I plan to have it done in a couple of weeks.
06-10-2013, 08:26 PM
#9
I will definitely add to my dyno and build threads. This is going to happen. If I can get any more timing at all it will be a huge win. If I can keep my current timing and get charge cooling and no detonation in the heat its still a win.
Interesting, the only a advantage of e85 is timing right? Meth would seem a MUCH cheaper alternative.
Interesting, the only a advantage of e85 is timing right? Meth would seem a MUCH cheaper alternative.
06-11-2013, 10:07 AM
#10
I will definitely add to my dyno and build threads. This is going to happen. If I can get any more timing at all it will be a huge win. If I can keep my current timing and get charge cooling and no detonation in the heat its still a win.
Interesting, the only a advantage of e85 is timing right? Meth would seem a MUCH cheaper alternative.
Interesting, the only a advantage of e85 is timing right? Meth would seem a MUCH cheaper alternative.
Yeah, e85 is like cheap *** race gas. Allows you to add more timing, which is the same thing the water/meth kit would do.
06-11-2013, 11:39 PM
#14
TECH Apprentice
Agree that Alky Control is the best kit, and Julio gives the best service. As far as non boost applications, this is written by an extremely knowledgeable guy and a good read.
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c6-t...lications.html
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c6-t...lications.html
06-12-2013, 10:03 AM
#15
Agree that Alky Control is the best kit, and Julio gives the best service. As far as non boost applications, this is written by an extremely knowledgeable guy and a good read.
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c6-t...lications.html
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c6-t...lications.html
06-21-2013, 05:32 AM
#17
9 Second Club
Have a look on the Aquamist forum.
Their setup might be better for a n/a car, as with one of their high speed solenoids and much better nozzles, you would have far more accurate control over flow.
Quantities required if you're struggling with knock would be far lower with a n/a build.
With boost, it's pretty easy, just dump a load in, add more timing and you're almost guaranteed a power increase.
http://www.aquamist.co.uk/vbulletin/
Their setup might be better for a n/a car, as with one of their high speed solenoids and much better nozzles, you would have far more accurate control over flow.
Quantities required if you're struggling with knock would be far lower with a n/a build.
With boost, it's pretty easy, just dump a load in, add more timing and you're almost guaranteed a power increase.
http://www.aquamist.co.uk/vbulletin/
06-22-2013, 08:49 AM
#18
Sure you directed at OP, but Ill check out the aquamist as well.
One thing that is pretty cool with the 20150 is it has 2 nozzles. An itty bitty one that kicks in at low rpm and a second bigger one that joins in at higher rpm..
Interesting comment on "better nozzles" now ill go see what you mean.
One thing that is pretty cool with the 20150 is it has 2 nozzles. An itty bitty one that kicks in at low rpm and a second bigger one that joins in at higher rpm..
Interesting comment on "better nozzles" now ill go see what you mean.
