lsfanatic

Hello all, I have been thinking about putting nitrous (wet kit) on my 2000 C5 coupe, M6. It has a LQ9 or LQ4 (not sure which, lets say LQ9 just for safety with the higher CR) 6.0L in it currently that is all stock (whole separate story). I have a few questions about running some spray.

#1.) What size shot can the stock motor handle? In terms of pistons, ring gaps, head gaskets?

#2.) What plug do I need to switch too?

#3.) How much of a shot can I run on a stock fuel system (return-less style)?

#4.) I am looking at either single nozzle or plate, which is better? (I personally like the plate, but don't want to spend unnecessary money)

#5.) I know for anything over like a 50 shot you need tuning to retard timing. How does this work? It would seem to me that the PCM would need two timing maps, one for nitrous and one without. Unless MSD makes some sort of in-line box.

Thanks for any helps, I am sure there are some gurus on here that will be able to answer my questions.

03EBZ06

I have seen people run repeatedly 300+ hp shots on a stock blocks. Ha, I would not. As far as I'm concerned, I'd keep a stock block around 150hp.
I ran 125 shot with stock timing and good fuel, but would suggest EFI Live's COS5 for nitrous fuel/spark tuning. Its the best out there.

As for nozzle or plate, they are going to make about the same power.
I like the physical setup of the plate better. I like DP best though because you shoot it straight in to the cylinder vs clouding up the intake like an atomic bomb.

We tested my fuel system and right about 600rwhp, it was game over. So, lets say 550rwhp. You can throw in a 7 series plug and will work fine for what you want to do and it will run fine on motor too.

The most import thing in your car is the REAR END and CLUTCH. They are weak as F from the factory.

Today, I got a pressure transducer in the mail. It allows me to log nitrous fuel and nitrous pressure during a pass. This would not be a bad idea if you want to monitor fuel status.

lsfanatic

Thanks for the response! This would mostly be more of street setup, only racing at the track every once and a while. I always thought the rear end wasn't too bad in the C5? How would it hold up for mostly "from a roll" type stuff?

Is the EFI live setup something that you can setup to automatically come on with the nitrous arming switch?

I kind of assumed I would need a WOT switch, fuel pressure safety cutoff, and a window switch to run spray safely.

03EBZ06

I think you are ok from a roll.

With EFI Live, you can run two tunes. One is stock or whatever your regular tune is, then that tune is modified for spark and fuel, once the COS5 is triggered on by grounding pin 56 of the pcm.

Once the tune is active, spark changes become effective immediately and may be scaled by RPM. Fuel is activated by RPM and MAP values and is also scaled by RPM as a multiplier.

You can setup the custom operating system 5 (COS5) to come on just by flipping on your nitrous arming switch. The way to do this easily is to
use the arming switch to trigger on a relay. The relay would simply pass a ground value to the pin 56. I have run this for about 8 years and its very easy to use.

HCI2000SS

iTrader: (2)

I'm just curious....how do you not know what motor it has?

kainedogg

iTrader: (23)

What he said

lsfanatic

I bought the car used, guy said he had swapped an LS2 into the car. I realized it had 317 heads, and then got a magnet out and found it was an iron block. As far as I know there is no way to tell the difference other then the pistons and I don't have a bore scope to check.

AJatNitrousOutlet

Now as far as number one, it will all come down to one thing, the tune. You can spray as much as 450+hp worth of nitrous, in these LS motors. You will get all kinds of answers on this, but for a 6.0 I would not hesitate to run a 200hp shot of nitrous if the tune is spot on.

If this is just a street car where you will not be data logging the car every day and making the necessary adjustments when running a larger size shot of nitrous. I would just stick with a 200 shot and below, that way you are safe until you gain some more knowledge, then you can creep up on the tune.

For number two, We recommend never running a projected style plug, and the reason why, is it could cause a misfire. This happens because the ground strap practically becomes a glow plug, because it cannot dissipate all the extra heat when you are on the spray. The way you counter this, is by going with a non-projected tip plug which in turn helps shorten the path for all the heat being absorbed by the ground strap.

Now for number three, this is going to be the determining factor in how much you can spray since you are going to be pulling from the rail. You have two options, you can run a dedicated fuel system to supply the nitrous system with the fuel. The benifit to this is you will only use the fuel in the dediated when the system is activated. And it will allow you to run race gas (c16) and over time it will be more cost effictive vs. putting a spash in the min tank each time if you are on a bigger jet.

Or you can upgrade the fuel pump with a racetronix/hotwire set-up which will get you there as well. The draw back is you are now limited to one tank, so if you are on a bigger size jet (shot) you will want some race gas to help prevent against denotation, but you will have to keep doing this over and over. And when you are not spraying you are just wasting money because there is not need for race gas. This is why a dedicated is nice.

Number four, it really comes down to how much you are looking to spray and what your budget allows. I like the plates since they flow more than a nozzle will and they offer a lot cleaner look. We have a lot of customer on 99+jet that have had great success with our EFI plates.

And finally number five, for the timing, that general rule of thumb is just that. But to give you a better answer, I would need to know the compression, cam specs, intake manifold you are running, fuel ect. ect. as this will all play in effect on what would be a good starting point for timing.

But as far as what to do as far as retarding the timing, I would recommend the LNC-2000 (Lingenfelter) as it will only retard the timing when the nitrous system is activated. That way you do not have to jump back and forth from nitrous and all motor tunes.

If you have anymore question, let us know and we will get them answered.

lsfanatic

Thanks for the response AJ!

I have been digging around on the nitrous outlet website (great website BTW), let me see what you guys think of my proposed idea.

I like the single stage, hardline plate kit they have for the C5 w/ a 10lb bottle. (http://www.nitrousoutlet.com/efi-wet...te-system.html) The solenoid locations look clean and I like the simplicity of it. I think the highest I want to go is a 150hp shot for now. One question I have is how does it work with the FRCs? It looks like they would either need to be notched or the they would fit over and cover the solenoids for a more stealth package.

Also I think I would run the Lingenfelter window switch (http://www.lingenfelter.com/mm5/merc...E#.VfyPV99Viko) unless MSD of someone else makes a better one? Not really sure what the best FPSS out there is so I would like suggestions for that (I feel like that isn't 100% necessary, but keeps the junk from leaning out).

I am thinking for now I am going to forgo the separate fuel tank and system for the wet side, mostly for cost purposes. I love the way some of the aluminum tanks available for the vette look but its hard to justify the cost I think for the shot I want to run.

I am still undecided about tuning, the lingenfelter box seems nice because I can just hook it up and mess with all the timing easily. However using EFILive COS5 seems like it would be a much cleaner setup with less to go wrong. I don't really know the difference cost wise, what would a tuner charge to set the PCM up for the COS5 and tune it on the dyno?

For a 150 shot, am I okay on the stock fuel pump? I feel like I should be but at the same time it seems a bit foolish.

Last question is how long will a 10lb bottle last with the 150 shot? Not really sure how that is normally measured but just curious if I should bump up to a 15lb bottle. The only issue I see with that is mounting, I want to mount the bottle sideways in the center trunk compartment. I have seen 10lb installed in there, does any one know if a 15lb will fit?

Thanks for any and all suggestions guys!

PS: One more thing, should I get a purge kit? I know it keeps the nitrous delivery consistent for drag racing but is a necessity on more street style setups?

Jason Haines @ LPE

If it is a stock take-out engine you can find the VIN stamp on the block and from that you can figure out the engine. 8 digit of the VIN will tell you the engine type. 10th digit will tell you the model year.

lsfanatic

Jason, that is on the back of the driver's side of the motor correct? I was having a hard time seeing it even with a mirror.

03EBZ06

For smaller shots, you are ok on the rail. 150 is a smaller shot. If you put a rail safety pressure switch on, then its going to shut down when fuel pressure drops. NOS makes one that is adjustable from 50 to 70psi. I'm sure NO and NXExpress also have similar. As stated, with a fuel pump upgrade, Racetronix, you should be good to go. I use a remote, but I did it at the time because I had a stock fuel pump. Remember, the FP switch is going to shut down the nitrous if pressure drops. Thats a good safety net.

I have setup a basic stock vette file for EFI Live and COS5. I can give you a link to download COS5 for a C5Z, maybe minor changes for the C5. The tuner would simply flash the file. IMO, EFI Live is just another part I bought for my car, that helps me tweak all the others ones I have. I say, forget the remote tank, and buy the EFI Live tuning setup and do it yourself. There is no magic to it.

I have a 15lb bottle in that same compartment and it fits fine.
I would go 15lb bottle. I used to run a 150 shot on a 10 lb bottle years ago and I must have got at least 5+ runs off that thing.

BTW, here is what you tune in COS5 for nitrous:

lsfanatic

Thanks for all the tuning information 03EBZ06. If you could give me that link that would be great. I am still on the fence between HPtuners or EFILive but with that setup it seems like EFIlive would be the best.

lsfanatic

BTW how do you guys look at the block serial number with the engine in the car? I have tried several times with a inspection mirror and can't get it low enough.

Would going in from the bottom work? I would like to figure out if I have a lq4 or 9 for sure. Thanks

ProServ

Sorry to hijack this thread but this tool might help:

Android borescope/endoscope.

I bought one for home and one for work. The app isn't Android Playstore approved so you have allow un-approved aps to be installed (easy security setting change) but this this is amazing for the price. Take pictures down in the block, inside the intake etc. Adjustable LED brightness.

I think I paid $28 and now they are $8 to $10 cheaper than that.

I am not in any way related to/involved with this company - just a happy customer sharing what I think is a really cool bargain of a tool. I was hoping to resell them myself but just not enough margin (and they keep lowering the price it seems).

Get one and then show it to someone that just paid $750 to $900 for a SnapOn one. 8-)

03EBZ06

check pm.

lsfanatic

Thank I got it and saved it for future use Thanks again.