SnIpEz

iTrader: (4)

Hey guys, so I know that the factory clear coat can never be imitated and that if someone had an aftermarket paint job the clear coat won't be as good, but I do know some will last quite awhile nonetheless. My question(s) is(are) this:

If I was doing a color change from factory red to all black, complete, door jams and everything, which company would be best to get the closest to factory look of black as possible? The two brands that I see stick out the most are DuPont and House of Kolors. Which one would you go with and why?

I've also heard these companies make clear coats, is that true? Who would have the better clear? Is it bad to mix and match if one has a better paint and the other a better clear? Which one would be the closest to factory durability?

Any other input aside from what Ive asked if also appreciated

Thanks!

HAte

factory clear the best quality? ehh thats debatable.

many company's produce all different "qualitys" of clear and good ones at that too. theres not ONE BESTTT one

as for mix matching "the best" paint and "the best" clear you really shouldnt mix different manufactures.. and the same thing with clear as base coat, no one company has "the best". its anyones opinion who makes the best

alexus6798

iTrader: (24)

there are plenty of companies that can paint like factory, but you're going to pay. You get what you pay for, no way around it..

SnIpEz

iTrader: (4)

Nah I'm almost certain the factory clear is the best option, it's able to go through a different curing process than shops are legally allowed to do. I remember asking this awhile back and that was the unanimous answer. The part about mixing the clears definitely makes sense to me.


Alexus, there's a guy in San Antonio on here who has serviced tons of members cars on here who will paint with DuPont and do full prep and a complete changeover for ~2k. He charges less so he can get more business and show there are still honest shops. His work is fantastic, I've been drooling over it for awhile now.

Opher

The factory stuff is no better than what you can buy over the counter. Where do you think the factory gets its materials??

Think of it this way. Chemically there are only a couple ways to make a urethane, to make an epoxy, to make a polyester based product. Its that simple. There is no magical clear coat on the market.

Yes, some clears have more UV protection, higher solids, better products. However at the end of the day they are still a urethane based product.

As far as the myth that the factory can cure them differently. Yes. They can bake the finish. A body shop can bake the finish or let it air dry. It really doesnt make a difference.

All the baking does is get the car in and out quicker, this helps in a collision shop if you are trying to paint 5 cars a day. Air dry is what it is. However if you read the cans of any 2k urethane clear, or the "P" sheets they all say to let the clear cure for a full 90 days, bake or air dry before you apply wax. This is because it does take a full 90 days for the product to cure completely. So all of these people that tell you baking is far superior are full of ****.

Yes the baking will help the clear lay a bit flatter than an air dry setup, but thats about it.

Materials are like women, every painter has their own line that they like.

You do not want to mix paint lines. Stay with one, this will avoid a lot of potential problems later down the road.

I personally do not like Dupont or PPG. I've used almost every line out there HOK, Sikkens, Glasurit, RM, Standox, Omni, Nason, Transtar, Kirker, Matrix, Spie Hecker,etc.

On all the restorations that I do I use Glasurit or Transtar. Any polyester base coat typically covers very well.

Kirker paints are an excellent choice for the DIY, or someone who really is on a budget. The cost of these paints is very very reasonable for what you get, they cover well, are user friendly. I have sprayed several "driver" quality cars using this product and it works well.

As for the guy who is doing color changes for 2k, make sure you are comparing apples to apples. Charging less to get more business is not really a good indication. Materials are not cheap anymore, even the cheap stuff is expensive. To do a color change correctly is very very labor intensive. I dont know of anyone that works for free. I would assume you wouldnt work for free. So just make sure you understand what you are getting from a shop like that. Go around and get several estimates for what you want and compare. I will bet you find varying differences between each one.

A typical color change through my shop is roughly 7-8k and this based on a car needing minimal bodywork (door dings) The cost of materials on job like this is $1000-$1500.
And if its red, it can sometimes be more. For instance last year we did a 68 Camaro RS/SS 396 car for a client. The cost for just a gallon of red base coat was $660. That was just the color, no clears, primers,reducers,etc. That was for RM/Diamont

It's just like everything else. You typically get what you pay for. Unless you have someone who is doing it on the side, or is just is crazy enough to love it that much to work for free, its going to be costly if you go through a legit shop.

Best advice for what you want to do, do your homework, research, and most importany plan, and plan for the un expected.

Good Luck

sheikss

iTrader: (11)

Yea, my hoods factory clear sucked and started to flake off. I repainted the hood and the same **** happened. Needless to say the hood will stay looking like ****. Eventually the clear will be completely gone and I will tell people I wanted it to be flat black.

keith102371

iTrader: (20)

been in the body shop business 20 yrs and u definetly get what u pay for, at our shop for 2000 u might a sand and spray on a small car with no body work or minimal detrimming. and Opher is right about the factory clear

trans_am7935

iTrader: (15)

sure there are shinier clear coats, and more glossy, but non as durrable as the GM dealer can make, i know that they use a chemical heat treating process after it is sprayed, but other than that, i don't know

Opher

The dealers use what every other body shop out there uses. From my experience, typically dealer work is some of the most hacked work I have seen. That chemical heat treating process is just a fancy way of saying "bake booth"

bowtiebuilder

iTrader: (18)

There is no special curing method in the factory. They bake it just like any big collision shop would. And saying the factory makes the best clear is a ridiculous statement. Unless your paying a friends buddy that knows a guy that did it one time in his moms garage. The factory doesn't sand/buff anything. A shop can. I will put my paint against any factory job any time. The power of the buffer cant be beat.
As for paint lines, I have always used sikkins with no problems at all. I've even used the inexpensive sikkins lines for everyday cars to keep costs down. (U-tech and lesonal). They have been great to me as well. No problems at all.

99monguse

I would think a GOOD bodyshop should be able to do a much better paint job then the factory. They can put on way more paint and way more clear. I'm thinking about having my black 99 SS repainted because the rear spoiler from SLP looks like ***, they did a horrible job painting it. I want a lot more clear coat because I am constantly polishing my car, for one its black and I like it to be swirl free as much as possible. I only use very fine polishes and very light cutting foam pads, so not to remove much material.

Opher

The more clear you add to the car the less durable it becomes. There is a fine line of not enough material and too much material. Thats why all the "trailer queens" are trailer queens. If you were to take those cars out and drive them daily, they would be rock chipped up so fast its not funny. Just some food for thought before you go tell the bodyshop to put 7 coats of clear on the car, wet sand and buff it flat and then wonder why it chipped up really fast.