MuhThugga

Huh. I just realized your name isn't G Asthma.

Oh well. I'm still going to read it as G Asthma.

clm69z28

Hey G,

I made a comment on a thread, nothing else. What's totally worthless is your drivel. Obviously something in my post got under your paper thin skin. Maybe you flunked philosophy in school? Or, maybe you didn't even have an education. My skin is plenty thick; what makes me feel good is baiting trolls like you to make some asinine retort. I don't give a flying f.... what you say, have at it. Come on, I'm just can't wait for your next worthless comment. Waste some more of your day thinking something up... come on, keep thinking...it'll come to you. You obviously have alot of practice at it- 16,000 posts and climbing.

G Atsma

You're making a much bigger deal out of it than I am. It was meant as a friendly jab, nothing more. Get over yourself....

columnshift

Not starting a new thread since one exists already...

Might thermal barrier coatings help avoid detonation? Like buying more time before you blow a hole in the top of your piston... especially in a sustained higher load situation?

Che70velle

iTrader: (6)

Yes. Coated chambers, valve faces, and piston tops in testing have shown that almost 2 compression points could be added…without any ignition timing alterations…without detonation. Power numbers pick up as well. Why? The byproduct of combustion is heat (watts) and heat (contained correctly) makes power. Great example…take two identically built engines, one with aluminum heads, and the other with cast iron heads, and the engine with cast iron heads will make more power.
The key to thermal coatings is data and application.

columnshift

I'm not all that knowledgeable at all other than scanning this thread shows some of what i'd heard in the past - some think that it keeps heat in the chamber possibly worsening things, others say that it improves things because instead of heat soaking into metal it flows out the exhaust... I suppose there's no definitive answer. I'm confused how iron heads would make more power because usually it's been a rule aluminum heads move heat away letting you run more CR...

Could you recommend some more in depth books/articles/etc on TBC's in general if I want to learn?

Che70velle

iTrader: (6)

It’s simple really. The more heat you have in the chamber, the more power the engine is capable of making. Why do forced induction builds make more heat? Bigger boom equals more heat. (watts…BTU’s) What coatings do is allow more heat to stay in chamber and not get absorbed into coolant system, valve stems, wrist pins, etc. Yes the heat goes out the exhaust, and the top teams have learned how to use the hotter exhaust air…which moves faster…to their advantage via scavenging. You guys would be amazed at what modern day NASCAR guys were doing, before this latest rules change and teams being forced to run the “crate engines”.
I don’t know of any source for reading about thermal coatings, although there is likely something out there. I’m fortunate enough to have friends still in the industry, so I ask questions.

columnshift

Right right, I get that part... but it's always a tug of war where more heat is also more risk of detonation. Have you seen tests that really show two full points more compression without other changes across the board? Or is it more specific engines?

I remember reading years ago about coatings - but not many people seeming to use them, and some public attitudes being "everyone would be using it if it really worked that good including manufacturers" confusing me. Is it like a big little secret of insiders?

Che70velle

iTrader: (6)

Yes, and this was once considered classified info, but today the info is out there if you look hard enough. Don’t be confused with keyboard warriors in disbelief because they haven’t seen it before, and posting to the masses that it can’t be true, because it’s not common. It truly isn’t common. It’s crazy expensive to utilize this technology correctly. Completely useless for anything street worthy, considering the actual amount of coin it will cost.
You mentioned a risk of detonation with more heat. That’s true with conventional build techniques. The type of engines that utilize this tech are scrutinized in every manner possible for induction efficiency, chamber shape, piston design, including materials used, cooling efficiency from the coolant side to utilizing oil jets internally, and operate on fuels that aid in promoting the best possible combustion process at the very highest cylinder pressure possible, for that fuel. $75k type endurance stuff…
For the typical street or even race build you’d see here on tech, high chamber temps are possible without detonation if the build is properly done. High compression is possible (my 434 is 12.42:1 and runs strictly on 93 pump with no additives, and I used no coatings on this one) if quench is optimized, chamber efficiency is maximized, and tuning is spot on.