RONIN LSX

iTrader: (44)

I need to replace my burned out fog light and while searching, I found these CREE bulbs. Is this a better option over regular oem replacements or LEDs?

Phoenix'97

Personally, I would be afraid of these lights being TOO BRIGHT, almost like having a car in the opposite direction shining it's LED high beams in your face and blinding the hell out of you. I have seen some pick-ups with insanely bright auxiliary lights and these look like them. If they pass for high beam intensity you could get pulled over by police who will issue you a ticket to remove them and to prove it at the police station. Upgrading to LEDs is automatically a better bet than using incandescent bulbs but it is entirely possible to buy LEDs that lack the output of the incandescent you are replacing, so you have to be careful of that as well.


For me, I have gone through a dedicated LED online store in the past that makes socket style replacement bulbs and I would likely go through them when my time comes to start upgrading the exterior lights to LED. They do sell Cree type bulbs but nothing intended to be massive light output that it borderlines on illegal in the eyes of the law, like having spot light strength on a car for headlights and fog lights. The decision is up to you and if you are willing to try these bulbs for the price being asked for. Going with the absolute brightest bulb may not be a good idea either, so you have to be careful.

RONIN LSX

iTrader: (44)

Thanks for the info Bro!

How many watts would you suggest? Any brand suggestions?

VIP1

The design/layout is a bigger problem than the wattage. Those with the multi-led facing all around are not good fog lights and headlights. They ruin the beam and just shed out an unfocused pool of light. Bulbs with multiple LEDs spread around are good for turn signals and taillights since you just need to light up the housing evenly, but for headlights and fog lights, you want the LEDs in a tight row emulating the original Halogen Bulb's Filament. They are still hit-or-miss. It depends on the accuracy/quality of the bulb and the housing itself. Usually miss about as much as putting in HID (putting HID in Halogen reflectors is bad due to bad beam pattern). The end result for drop-in LED is often either an altered beam pattern or less usable light (due to not using the optics of the housing properly). Either way, it is whiter and people don't realize that everything may actually be dimmer.

If you really want to go the Drop-In LED headlight or fog light route. Stick with the style that has a thin strip of LEDs placed to match the original Halogen Filament. Even then, they sometimes need adjustment to get the best beam they can. This style is the one that has had the most success in using the optics of the housing to most likely produce a good beam pattern. Some get pretty close to the original beam pattern but of course brighter.

Its very housing dependent. Some housing look acceptable, some don't.

Here are three examples:







As shown in the pics, the different bulbs have the LEDS arranged to emulate the filament of the bulb they are intended to replace, whether that be vertical or horizontal.

There are many other companies that have copied this style or made similar ones typically with various different heatsinks and packaging. Some have good alignment, some don't. Some have good heat management and LED driving, some don't.

Check threads in the LED section on HID Planet for comparisons.
(www.hidplanet.com)

I don't have personal experience with them. However, there are a few brands that people have liked on HID Planet. I don't remember which off the top of my head. There are some comparison threads there. The pics above are just for example of the design I'm talking about. Some companies out there really overstate the lumen output of their bulbs so take the rating with a grain of salt.

The bulbs above are for single-filament application like the 9005/9006 Headlights in the Camaro and the 880/881 fog lights in the Camaro and Firebird. However, some cars use dual filament bulbs like an H4. (like some Jeeps and older civics). There are Drop-In LEDs for them too. Here is one example:

Phoenix'97

Sorry that it took awhile for me to get back. I was pouring over that LED specialty shop that I have gone to before for LEDs when I had a forest green 1997 base Firebird with the 6-cylinder back in 2004. Unfortunately they make it obvious on their site that their LED bulbs are for looks only and lack the intensity of incandescent 880s. Their true replacement for the incandescent fog lights on our cars is HID bulbs in the pure white range.

DON'T FOCUS ON WATTS! Focus on Lumen value! Pretty much I am finding 880 LED bulbs that have lumen values of above 100 which is horrible compared to incandescent bulbs going as high as 700 lumen (in low beam) to be of any practical use. They do sell bulbs that require custom work that shine as high as 2000 or 4000 lumen but you are talking beyond high beam levels (1000 - 1700) and more like spot lights, that is just too damn bright to have on any street car!

I found these on Amazon. A regular head light in low beam is rated at around 700 Lumen. These fog lights should be street legal (in appearance) and not blind oncoming traffic without being too dim to serve no function! They also have 360 LED light output to make use of your fog light housing reflector which is what you want!

RONIN LSX

iTrader: (44)

Thanks guys, I have a lot of reading to do, lol

pdxmotorhead

Avoid bulbs much over a 4500 to 5000 color temp as well, in fog the common 6000K led/cree bulbs are blinding to YOU.

BTW CREE is the type of LED used in the bulb matrix.

Its all about Lumens and Color Temp. Watts is a conversion not a actual measurement for light bulbs.

RONIN LSX

iTrader: (44)

Thanks for the info bro! What colour temp do suggest?

pdxmotorhead

I try and find the 5000K bulbs,, I get most off Amazon, or I've used Superbright LED's web page,,
Like was said above, make sure the layout of the LED module matches how the element or elements line up in the bulb
You also want to look for modules that allow you to rotate the bulb to optimize the bulb to the lens and reflector especially for two element bulbs like headlights. Then make sure you align them well, the intensity of the powerful LED's means that if they arent aligned your punishing oncoming traffic.

micbegz28

iTrader: (5)

I had LEDs in the factory 98-02 Camaro "projector" fogs and they were terrible. LEDs are not meant to work in a certain projector lenses i guess? I ended up getting some LED offroad/fog light and mounting them to the factory bracket and they work great.

Not sure what you drive, but on the LS camaro they sit far back enough in the bumper that the bumper itself acts like a light shield so no light gets into the eyes of the oncoming traffic.

Phoenix'97

The LS Camaro had "projector" fog lights?! I have a hard time believing that LEDs in general won't work for any light housing on our cars! You will run into problems of LEDs being less bright in appearance (lumen output) but again, you have to be very careful in which ones you buy! LEDs are supposed to use less wattage, NOT MORE WATTAGE, so I would be highly suspicious of any brand with very high wattage usage which could mean that those LEDs will burn out sooner than they should and we don't even have a listed lumen value which adds to the suspicion! You also need LEDs that emit light in all directions! Otherwise you are only using the LED itself to emit the light and not using your reflector to emit more of that emitted light! So, please tell me how LEDs for our fog lights won't work as well? I am willing to bet you bought bogus low lumen "APPEARANCE ONLY/NON FUNCTIONAL" leds for your stock fog lights and they sucked, obviously! This is why I warned the original poster to focus on the lumen rating of the product!

Now, with regards to this custom set-up you have posted, I don't think the original poster wants to go this far with his car, I sure as hell know I don't want to! Servicing these "OFF-ROAD" fog lights must be a royal pain if they stop working and honestly, I would rather pull back the bottom of the front bumper cover and just replace the LED bulbs from the factory fog light housing! Why make matters more complicated by this custom and non-street legal set-up you have. Furthermore you state, "...but on the LS camaro they sit far back enough in the bumper that the bumper itself acts like a light shield so no light gets into the eyes of the oncoming traffic.", I am willing to call B.S. on that! If the lumen value is at or above 1000 you pretty much have high beams and it don't matter what protrusions on the bumper you have! If you are going uphill, downhill opposing traffic will be blinded by your fog lights, and vice versa! If you are hitting bumps in the road, you will be blinding on-coming traffic! People often flash their high beams at me thinking my car has it's high beams on when I am bouncing on a bad road but that is the temporary angle of my headlights being raised to mimic high beams and thus, I am blinding opposing-side traffic! You didn't think about that, did you?!

Off-road fog lights are just that, off-road ONLY and not for street use! The original poster is best to stick with the Amazon brand Cree LED bulbs rated at 700 lumen for easier installation and serviceability in the event they may fail before their one-year warranty! What warranty does your off-road fog lights have?

micbegz28

iTrader: (5)

-The brand of LED fogs i tried in to factory LS housings are the same brand ive been running in my jeep and ram for over a year, and they are great in those 2 applications, so i dont think they are appearance only units. From what ive read on other forums(mainly the ram forums) LEDs do not work as well in projectors as HIDs. Maybe thats incorrect?

-You dont have to believe anything ive said, but i think me not ever getting high beamed is enough for me to believe they dont bother on coming traffic.

-Dont know what the warranty is, if they go out they go out lol They can get swapped with 2 10mm bolts and just turning the wheel to full lock lol

Sorry for offending you with my lights lol

Phoenix'97

The new LED flashlights come with projector lenses and telescope function to narrow the beam and focus the light on a smaller area. However, I can not stress enough that lumen value plays a big roll in how well the fog lights are going to work but going high beam level bright is not such a wonderful idea either. Another scenario, when it is very rainy out and your headlights/fog lights reflect off the water covered road, high beams will blind opposing traffic, I have experienced this first hand from people using too bright of "off-road" bulbs or fog lights. Even during the winter, high beams reflect off of the snowflakes and amplify light output making it further dangerous to oncoming traffic! I learned this stuff in trucking school and it totally changed my perspective on driving safety.

Even on a nice clear night, I had a nice pick-up truck equipped with aftermarket auxiliary lights and they were blinding me for as far as he was following me. I had to flip my rear-view mirror to the night-time angle yet my door mirrors were still reflecting those damn lights back into my eyes. There were no state troopers on the expressway when this happened, unfortunately, but the choices this guy made for his pickup truck were totally unsafe and inconsiderate of drivers in lower sitting cars, like mine, who have bright as hell LEDs aimed right through our rear windows. This is more than just about "offending" people, it is about being considerate of other motorists sharing the same public roads as you do who are blinded by illegal "off-road" bulbs that behave like high beams despite looking "cool" on your cars or trucks.

One last thing, do you need to remove the bumper cover every time you change out these fog lights?! It looks like you have to and that, to me, makes them horrible as a replacement in terms of ease of servicing. I don't thing the original poster will want to have to go to such an extreme anytime the fog lights go out and assuming they don't get him pulled over some day!

micbegz28

iTrader: (5)

Nah i can take them off without taking anything off. Just need to turn the wheel. On a normal car that doesnt have a tubular front end and no splash shields you would have too. And no need to worry about rain or any precipitation, the cars never been off slicks lol