Converter efficiency from a roll?
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 125
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Converter efficiency from a roll? Ok guys, I'm still looking to put a stall in my car currently I have an m6 rear end with 3.42's in it along with full bolt ons. I.e headers, catback, lid ported tb, etc. I've been reading a lot on here and some people seem to say that by putting the converter in my car I'm essentially going to lose mph up top down the 1/4 and it will be slower say from a 30 roll than the stock stalled car.
So my question is how will this be better than a stock stall? I know the shift extension will be higher but will my car essentially be slower form 50-100 or 65-120 than it used to be? Just seems like its kinda going backwards lol. I undertand where a stall has a place in the 1/4 because when you launch it more than makes up for any losses but on the street I wont be able to launch like that, in order to get any real traction i'd probably have to hammer it around 50 and going by from what I've read he car will be slower?
My end goal is to be able to go up against my buddies m6 car and no get y *** handed to me from a roll anymore currently we have about the same mods and he destroys me from 50. I'm just wondering if it would be better to go to an m6 for the occasional street race or will the a4 with a 3600 (efficient stall)get the job done from a roll on the street?
Thanks for the help
So my question is how will this be better than a stock stall? I know the shift extension will be higher but will my car essentially be slower form 50-100 or 65-120 than it used to be? Just seems like its kinda going backwards lol. I undertand where a stall has a place in the 1/4 because when you launch it more than makes up for any losses but on the street I wont be able to launch like that, in order to get any real traction i'd probably have to hammer it around 50 and going by from what I've read he car will be slower?
My end goal is to be able to go up against my buddies m6 car and no get y *** handed to me from a roll anymore currently we have about the same mods and he destroys me from 50. I'm just wondering if it would be better to go to an m6 for the occasional street race or will the a4 with a 3600 (efficient stall)get the job done from a roll on the street?
Thanks for the help
There is a wide range of delivered efficiency in converters
and the only ones I've ever seen advertise a number is
Yank. But even there you have the question of peak #
vs a knowledge of how it behaves across the range of
RPM at your particular motor torque profile and so on.
And last I looked, the data was only there for older
models.
You will not necessarily lose MPH. A converter that has
a stall speed higher than your motor wants, would do
that. An inefficient design would do that. I've owned
converters that were 97% efficient by 5000RPM. That
costs no MPH, it's on a par with stock. But this is not
anything but an anecdote.
A converter that positions your RPM straddling peak HP,
and operates efficiently there, will maximize MPH. This
is likely not the hardest hitting, or the highest stall speed
you can find; it's somewhat opposed to high STR and it
gets worse with higher stall speed.
Your best bet is to get your mind right, and then take
the applications advice of manufacturers who can speak
to the details of their product.
Now you getting ***-pounded from a roll may have as
much to do with A4 shiftpoint tuning, as anything. A
converter makes up for a bad (like stock) job there, to
some extent, but you want it all to work together.
and the only ones I've ever seen advertise a number is
Yank. But even there you have the question of peak #
vs a knowledge of how it behaves across the range of
RPM at your particular motor torque profile and so on.
And last I looked, the data was only there for older
models.
You will not necessarily lose MPH. A converter that has
a stall speed higher than your motor wants, would do
that. An inefficient design would do that. I've owned
converters that were 97% efficient by 5000RPM. That
costs no MPH, it's on a par with stock. But this is not
anything but an anecdote.
A converter that positions your RPM straddling peak HP,
and operates efficiently there, will maximize MPH. This
is likely not the hardest hitting, or the highest stall speed
you can find; it's somewhat opposed to high STR and it
gets worse with higher stall speed.
Your best bet is to get your mind right, and then take
the applications advice of manufacturers who can speak
to the details of their product.
Now you getting ***-pounded from a roll may have as
much to do with A4 shiftpoint tuning, as anything. A
converter makes up for a bad (like stock) job there, to
some extent, but you want it all to work together.
Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 125
Likes: 0
thanks guys, i've been looking at fti stalls since theyre only about an hr away from y house maybe going with something in the 3600 range. i know its kind of a puss question to ask but how did ur mpg's change in the city with a 3600 stall gas prices seem like theyre doing their own thing lately
I went through the same thought process as you before my stall. All the questions I had about efficiency and all that roll racing stuff.
I wanted the pt4000 for its efficiency up top for roll racing but was afraid of a 4k stall because iv never owned a stalled auto. So I went with the ss3600. Yank claims its 97% efficient and I dont doubt it. It made my car faster all around. Maybe not a whole lot from a roll but definatly at least some. I gained an honest 2mph in the 1/4 which is a very good sign of the converter being efficient I would say. Even my tuner said I would most likey lose a couple mph but he was wrong.
I am very curious what the pt4000 would have been like. This ss3600 is so easy to drive its not an issue. I love this stall though bigtime.
I wanted the pt4000 for its efficiency up top for roll racing but was afraid of a 4k stall because iv never owned a stalled auto. So I went with the ss3600. Yank claims its 97% efficient and I dont doubt it. It made my car faster all around. Maybe not a whole lot from a roll but definatly at least some. I gained an honest 2mph in the 1/4 which is a very good sign of the converter being efficient I would say. Even my tuner said I would most likey lose a couple mph but he was wrong.
I am very curious what the pt4000 would have been like. This ss3600 is so easy to drive its not an issue. I love this stall though bigtime.
thanks guys, i've been looking at fti stalls since theyre only about an hr away from y house maybe going with something in the 3600 range. i know its kind of a puss question to ask but how did ur mpg's change in the city with a 3600 stall gas prices seem like theyre doing their own thing lately
Jimmy, Great way to put it. Thank you!! You can only advertise a guess on effeiency because weight, gear, tire diameter,vehicle frontal area, bore stroke ratio all effect this. This is why a converter must be built to your combination.
Greg
Greg
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FTI Converter build sheet
FTI COMPETITION CONVERTERS AND TRANSMISSIONS
"IT'S NOT CHEATING, IT'S THE COMPETITIVE EDGE."
1-866-726-8358
info@ftiperformance.com
FTIPerformance.com
FTI Converter build sheet
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Thread Starter
On The Tree
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 125
Likes: 0
I just got around to installing my fti 3800 and kooks true dual exhaust. The converter is awsome to say the least...drives damn near like stock stock until you nail it! Its a very efficient converter imo, call greg and speak with him! whoever told you that stall converters slow your car down from a roll is severly misinformed!!
I went through the same thought process as you before my stall. All the questions I had about efficiency and all that roll racing stuff.
I wanted the pt4000 for its efficiency up top for roll racing but was afraid of a 4k stall because iv never owned a stalled auto. So I went with the ss3600. Yank claims its 97% efficient and I dont doubt it. It made my car faster all around. Maybe not a whole lot from a roll but definatly at least some. I gained an honest 2mph in the 1/4 which is a very good sign of the converter being efficient I would say. Even my tuner said I would most likey lose a couple mph but he was wrong.
I am very curious what the pt4000 would have been like. This ss3600 is so easy to drive its not an issue. I love this stall though bigtime.
I wanted the pt4000 for its efficiency up top for roll racing but was afraid of a 4k stall because iv never owned a stalled auto. So I went with the ss3600. Yank claims its 97% efficient and I dont doubt it. It made my car faster all around. Maybe not a whole lot from a roll but definatly at least some. I gained an honest 2mph in the 1/4 which is a very good sign of the converter being efficient I would say. Even my tuner said I would most likey lose a couple mph but he was wrong.
I am very curious what the pt4000 would have been like. This ss3600 is so easy to drive its not an issue. I love this stall though bigtime.
Oh and greg looking over some things and talking with people about stalls all I hear about you are good things. My car is a full weight dd with fulll bolt ons and 3.42's out back and I was looking at your sls0086 3600 stall with a 1.86 str. How would that converter be for a daily?
btw what are you all doing for tires? Like I said i live in fl and drive 10k a year so having dr's isnt really a good option for me right now the car sits on 295 BFG KDWIIs and they grip pretty well with lca relocation brackets and tubular lca's but I know the stall will change that how are qa1's on the street? I hear hey do a pretty good job at getting traction from a stop due to the weight transfer.
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Verdad Gallardo Thanks man do you have any videos of it driving around? It's not even really one person lol it seems on here quite a few people in threads will say it makes your car slower from a roll. But in reality if your shift extensions are at a higher rpm then in theory its putting more power to the ground at a given time and it should increase mph.
I keep hearing the 3600 is a great size so thats probably what I'll be going with. And ya it seems like people say they will lose mph but all the stalled cars I see look like they gain mph and et so I dont see how it would be slower from a roll.
Oh and greg looking over some things and talking with people about stalls all I hear about you are good things. My car is a full weight dd with fulll bolt ons and 3.42's out back and I was looking at your sls0086 3600 stall with a 1.86 str. How would that converter be for a daily?
btw what are you all doing for tires? Like I said i live in fl and drive 10k a year so having dr's isnt really a good option for me right now the car sits on 295 BFG KDWIIs and they grip pretty well with lca relocation brackets and tubular lca's but I know the stall will change that how are qa1's on the street? I hear hey do a pretty good job at getting traction from a stop due to the weight transfer.
I keep hearing the 3600 is a great size so thats probably what I'll be going with. And ya it seems like people say they will lose mph but all the stalled cars I see look like they gain mph and et so I dont see how it would be slower from a roll.
Oh and greg looking over some things and talking with people about stalls all I hear about you are good things. My car is a full weight dd with fulll bolt ons and 3.42's out back and I was looking at your sls0086 3600 stall with a 1.86 str. How would that converter be for a daily?
btw what are you all doing for tires? Like I said i live in fl and drive 10k a year so having dr's isnt really a good option for me right now the car sits on 295 BFG KDWIIs and they grip pretty well with lca relocation brackets and tubular lca's but I know the stall will change that how are qa1's on the street? I hear hey do a pretty good job at getting traction from a stop due to the weight transfer.
"All Motor 9 Second club member"
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From: On the Bumper!
I think swapping from the M6 to an auto has several advantages and the proper stall converter will make all the diference in the world. The 3600 is a good daily driver target for most LS1s and it works great, but you will always want more. My wifes DD has a Circle D 4000 stall. She loves it. The car has 3.73 gears so that helps it feel tighter for DD, but boy does it pull hard from a roll. Your 3.42s will help as well so a 3800-4000 will work great for you. You will kill the M6 cars at the track and the roll races will be dependent on the other drivers skills IMO.
Just be sure to provide your converter builder with all the details of your car and the cars intended use. G/L
Just be sure to provide your converter builder with all the details of your car and the cars intended use. G/L
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 24,241
Likes: 89
From: Turnin' Wrenches Infractions: 005
You're car won't be slower anywhere. Sometimes a car may lose a mph or two in the 1/4 but I would not consider that car slower by any means. Some even gain mph with an aftermarket stall.
I think swapping from the M6 to an auto has several advantages and the proper stall converter will make all the diference in the world. The 3600 is a good daily driver target for most LS1s and it works great, but you will always want more. My wifes DD has a Circle D 4000 stall. She loves it. The car has 3.73 gears so that helps it feel tighter for DD, but boy does it pull hard from a roll. Your 3.42s will help as well so a 3800-4000 will work great for you. You will kill the M6 cars at the track and the roll races will be dependent on the other drivers skills IMO.
Just be sure to provide your converter builder with all the details of your car and the cars intended use. G/L
Just be sure to provide your converter builder with all the details of your car and the cars intended use. G/L
Stall Ok guys, I'm still looking to put a stall in my car currently I have an m6 rear end with 3.42's in it along with full bolt ons. I.e headers, catback, lid ported tb, etc. I've been reading a lot on here and some people seem to say that by putting the converter in my car I'm essentially going to lose mph up top down the 1/4 and it will be slower say from a 30 roll than the stock stalled car.
So my question is how will this be better than a stock stall? I know the shift extension will be higher but will my car essentially be slower form 50-100 or 65-120 than it used to be? Just seems like its kinda going backwards lol. I undertand where a stall has a place in the 1/4 because when you launch it more than makes up for any losses but on the street I wont be able to launch like that, in order to get any real traction i'd probably have to hammer it around 50 and going by from what I've read he car will be slower?
My end goal is to be able to go up against my buddies m6 car and no get y *** handed to me from a roll anymore currently we have about the same mods and he destroys me from 50. I'm just wondering if it would be better to go to an m6 for the occasional street race or will the a4 with a 3600 (efficient stall)get the job done from a roll on the street?
Thanks for the help
So my question is how will this be better than a stock stall? I know the shift extension will be higher but will my car essentially be slower form 50-100 or 65-120 than it used to be? Just seems like its kinda going backwards lol. I undertand where a stall has a place in the 1/4 because when you launch it more than makes up for any losses but on the street I wont be able to launch like that, in order to get any real traction i'd probably have to hammer it around 50 and going by from what I've read he car will be slower?
My end goal is to be able to go up against my buddies m6 car and no get y *** handed to me from a roll anymore currently we have about the same mods and he destroys me from 50. I'm just wondering if it would be better to go to an m6 for the occasional street race or will the a4 with a 3600 (efficient stall)get the job done from a roll on the street?
Thanks for the help
I think you just changed my mind from the 3600 to 4000 question.Your wife likes the 4000 that is awesome.I am set on the yank ss 4000 know.How much of a difference would the str be on a circle d and yank converter?Yeah want to keep decent street manners.Thanks that is what i was looking for.
SS3600 2.5
SS4000 2.6
Not sure about Circle D or FTI.
I daily drive my SS4000 and I love it.
call Dave explain your needs ,
I think he will build 4k with differant STR as per your needs as he did for me
I ran ST 3600 for 8-9 years now at SS 4k and would never go back lower
. I like Yank, Johnny
I think he will build 4k with differant STR as per your needs as he did for me
I ran ST 3600 for 8-9 years now at SS 4k and would never go back lower
. I like Yank, Johnny
My ST 3600 was custom built to 2.3, I am not sure( think 4k is 2.3 also) what Dave custom built into the SS4000 as he and I did a long conversation before the build as I plan to hit it with a little "soup"
it is nnnooooo way loose , after first install I was amased and pleased, it was tighter than the ST 3600 /2.3 STR, will roll out at less than 11-1200 rpm it also holes the shift ext with in 5-700 rpms
again it is not loose
Johnny
it is nnnooooo way loose , after first install I was amased and pleased, it was tighter than the ST 3600 /2.3 STR, will roll out at less than 11-1200 rpm it also holes the shift ext with in 5-700 rpms
again it is not loose
Johnny
Ended up getting one from greg at fti.3600 with 1.78str Wanted a good roll car.Can't wait to put it in.Should be very efficient.Don't do drags to much.Props to fti great costumer service.Ordered mon. And got here today.Wow