Ron@Vengeance

iTrader: (51)

Thanx again for going through such detail and helping me out man. I really do appreciate it. I have gotten the run around from pretty much everyone I have called so far. Ram and Rapid have been great but still havent fixed my problem. Kinda hard over the phone though.

Just a few things, I wasnt bleeding by myself. I had my roomate pump the clutch about 20 times, hold it to the floor, I would crack the bleeder valve, close it an repeat the process. I have good pedal pressure at this point. I push it down and about 2 inches down I can feel it ge harder, then thatswhere the clutch feels like it should engage. I start the car and it wont go into any gear. I turn the car off and I can shift through every gear. Thats what led me to think it was the master in the first place. Any other ideas??

2000 Camaro SS

Ok, Yes I do have an idea... How fast did he pump the peddle? As a general rule you should pump two times slooooowly then open the bleeder. MOST often anything over two slow pumps Can lead to getting air into the fluid thus having very crappie peddle response. What does the fluid look like? It should look clear as clear can be. Like the same color as out of the bottle. Is it a clear to milky clear in color? If so this would be the problem. What I would do it this go at it again two slow pumps hold presser down open the bleeder valve slow and burp it...close the valve look at the fluid res fill if needed...do it again. If it is even a little milky you need to run ALL new fluid into the system and get the fluid with air out. I had got air into my fluid also and had to run new fluid through the system. This is a ram clutch? It is a single clutch right. Just curious. After you do the above if necessary try now shortening the adjustable rod and see if it helps. I'm sooting in the wind with that. Let me know how it goes.

2000 Camaro SS

If all the parts are installed correctly (And I have no reason to believe they are not) the Only thing that will give these kind of results is air in the fluid or just in line. Yes the parts could be bad but I'm sure they are built with as much quality as should be. Remember the master cylinder in just a pump like a bicycle air pump. A rod with a seal on the end of it. First the seal has to get soft (I'm sure it is now) then you have to make a SEAL, when it does you start to get resistance. You have this now...now the only thing that will make the fluid weak and not work well will be little air bubbles in the fluid. See if you have big air gaps in line you have no peddle pressure and it goes to the floor. But you now have pressure, but you say it don't have enough to disengage the pressure plate. Little tiny air bubbles in the line, I believe are at fault. When you have thousands of tiny bubbles in the fluid, you can't compress the fluid..see air will not compress and if you cant compress the volume of fluid in line, you can't move the throw out bearing very far, if it don't move far enough the clutch will not disengage. I'm writing this to help you understand "Possibly" what is going on. If you already know this please forgive me.

Jamie99TA

iTrader: (1)

Wow, I really don't think it's a bleeding problem, especially after all the bleeding that you have done. I had my clutch/slave/master out of my car 3 times so far and it only took 5-10 minutes tops to bleed it using the same method you are doing. Either the slave cylinder took a dump or maybe the pilot bushing was damaged during the clutch install and it locked up. this would spin the input shaft of the tranny and wouldn't let you in gear even if the clutch was really disengaged. FYI, when the clutch pedal is to the floor, the clutch is disengaged and vice versa.

Ron@Vengeance

iTrader: (51)

Im with ya on th air situation. My fluid doesn look milky at all. Im gonna go try the two pumps and bleed and see what happnens. Im also going to drill a hole in the floorboard and give it a try from that direction. Im beinning to wonder if I hae a defective part or something.Who knows with my luck. Thanx again though, I apreciate it.

m1key99WS6

iTrader: (1)

Ron,

Can you get your buddies @ RP to help out? They had the same problem with my mcleod and new slave, and stock master, that you had. It wouldn't disengage or engage all the way. I overnighted the ADJ master from cartek (stock master with a tie rod end looking adjuster rod) it was still a little rough, but I adjusted the rod on the cartek master out about 1/2" and it works fine now. Whatever method they used to bleed it appears to work fine in my car. Just a thought.

2000 Camaro SS

Jamie "or maybe the pilot bushing was damaged during the clutch install and it locked up."

Interesting information I would have never thought of this. (Being filed away for future reference.)

BeaSSt please let us know how it gets fixed. Also did you mod the floor pan? if so did you get close to the bleeder valve?

<small>[ March 21, 2002, 07:03 AM: Message edited by: 2000 Camaro SS ]</small>

cablebandit

iTrader: (37)

Ron put it in gear and then start it. This will tell us if its an engagement problem. If the car starts and doesnt take off with the clutch pushed in then you know its disengaging and maybe the pilot shaft bearing IS damaged. Course if it still takes off with the clutch in, you got probs cause i think you got it bled by now.

Ron@Vengeance

iTrader: (51)

Jerry, if I start the car in gear it still takes off. It has done that since the problem occurred. Im gonna make one final attempt to bleed it today and if I cant get it the tranny is coming out. Thanx for chiming in guys.

Ron@Vengeance

iTrader: (51)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by cablebandit:
<strong>Ahhh so definite engagement problem. I really concentrated on the "feeling" of my pedal today. it feels "normal" (not any real resistance till almost halfway) then you can feel it get more resistance. Not that it really helps ya but just thought I'd give you something to compare to. You surely have it bled properly by now. Maybe the pp is bad. Mine took like 10 minutes total to bleed the 2nd time around. I also remember being able to actually HEAR the slave//pp when the pedal was being pushed down and i was under the car. It was faint but i could hear it</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Jerry, I can hear the slave being moved forward when Im under the car. That leaves me to believe I might have a bad PP. Everything seems to be leading in that direction Im headed out now to find out now.

cablebandit

iTrader: (37)

Ahhh so definite engagement problem. I really concentrated on the "feeling" of my pedal today. it feels "normal" (not any real resistance till almost halfway) then you can feel it get more resistance. Not that it really helps ya but just thought I'd give you something to compare to. You surely have it bled properly by now. Maybe the pp is bad. Mine took like 10 minutes total to bleed the 2nd time around. I also remember being able to actually HEAR the slave//pp when the pedal was being pushed down and i was under the car. It was faint but i could hear it

RockIt

Hey I wasnt sure if this was mentioned but I just went through this stuff yesterday on my car. Well we busted out the Helms and it send to pump the clutch fast for 30 seconds straight with the reservoir cap off. We did this and what do you know my the pedal got stiff and my clutch engages right off the floor now. We did it three times for good measure.

cablebandit

iTrader: (37)

Ron, think about what happened to start all this. If it were the mc rod length, the engagement point would have started getting higher and higher in respect to pedal travel. I think basically you had shifting problems and then boom it wouldnt go at all. So you gotta look at either the preesure plate or faulty hydraulics. Either way the tranny has to be pulled and I know that sux. I doubt its the pilot shaft bearing since the car moves when you try to start it in gear. I tried to call you on your cell but couldnt get you.

MAFs 00 Ws6

I am in the same boat..I had three people on the job and when I would crack the bleeder open fluid would come out for a second and then stop, so I would crack the bleeder back closed and then the pedal would not come back off the floor. Then after when we pumped the pedal air bubles would come up from the resiover....I am going to have the car towed to Izzo's to see what he can come up with..Good luck with yours and let us know what you find....All I can say is this blows big time....

MAFs 00 Ws6

any update????