AZ2ENVY

iTrader: (2)

Im pretty sure I know what the COPO is . Way to take it out of context

JL ws-6

iTrader: (50)

The solid axle needs to be available in a streetable version not just a copo factory race car like the drag pack challenger's and cobra jet cars.

Have it at least be a box that you can check off on the ZL1 car, or if they make the Z28 car that would be fine to put it in that.

Just something, other then the independant mess... sure the ride is nice and all but the car enthusiast want's a chassis that's set up so it can be beefed up and hammered on at the strip, on the street, etc. Irs does not fit that bill... there's a reason that the mustang's did away with it after the 03/04 cobra.

6898camaross

Technically C.O.P.O's back in the day were absolutely street legal

Iownboth

I was addressing JL ws-6, not you. He seemed to be under the impression that you'd be able to get a straight-axle in a new Camaro simply by running an order through the central office.

And then I poked a bit of fun at your post ("If that were to be the "Engineer's response", what a lame-o response it would be") because I felt your insinuated notion of the COPO being some sort of "answer" to the cry for straight-axle Camaros was pie-in-the-sky. If your COPO reference was purely tongue-in-cheek, then I missed the sarcasm, and I apologize.

But I did not suggest that YOU didn't know what the COPO is, so I didn't miss that context whatsoever.

I mean look at it from where I sat, somebody says "I wish I could get my Camaro with a solid axle", and the answer is COPO? "Oh, sweet! Let me go home and start rolling up the change on top of my dresser.. Oops... Wait a minute, I'm going to need a truck and trailer to tow the thing, so I might have to raid the kids' piggy banks too... "

The point of my post was to both inform JL ws-6 that his savior was not the COPO, and poke a bit of fun at the notion that somehow the COPO was an answer to anything outside of well-heeled drag racing circles.

No offense intended..

Iownboth

Certainly... And that was then... What does it have to do with this discussion?

JL ws-6

iTrader: (50)

And you did notice I dame back and said it needs to be available in one that you can drive away right?

Iownboth

Yes, that's been my point, that the COPO is not a solution to what you're looking for, at any price.. Currently and into the short-term future, you can no more get a straight-axle street Camaro from the factory than a Ford fan can get an IRS-equipped Mustang.

JL ws-6

iTrader: (50)

Not a good thing IMO.

gocartone

iTrader: (4)

Next gen Mustang is coming with IRS. IDK what the big deal is with IRS, if they can cut the weight down and build them as strong as the solid axle cars there isn't anything wrong with them.

Iownboth

I don't have a problem with IRS whatsoever, my drag racing days are behind me, but I understand why some folks dislike it and would prefer the old-school axle.

JL ws-6

iTrader: (50)

IRS, for exactly the reason that you just stated (drag racing) will never work as well as a solid axle, there are too many weak points in it, and no matter what you do the tires camber at some point of the suspension movement and that disturbs the tires from planting correctly. And, all of the IRS systems are next to impossible to get a 15 inch rim on without changing out 1/2 the parts (big cost just for rim fitment).

I'm sure someone will come in here and start listing off all the 1.2x 60 foots that have been done with IRS but don't waste your time, you throw enough money at anything and it can go fast, but from a budget and pratical standpoint trying to make IRS a viable or better option is a a huge money pit.

Iownboth

All true, but the Mustang is the "last man standing" with a factory solid axle on the mass-production models. And once they cross-over in 2015, that's likely that, and most of the drag racers will just build-up older stuff, which is what most of 'em have been doing all along anyhow.

Getting back to the original intent of the post, the Camaro engineer pontificating that Ford has pulled out all its stops, I dunno about that....

I just had a 2.3 TVS blower installed on my 2011 Tuesday, along with a higher-flow elbow, Ford Racing dual 65mm CJ Throttle body, and an appropriate dyno-tune to accommodate. Given that it's my daily driver, we tuned it safely, no stupid timing or too-lean a/f ratios. Just a nice safe street tune that'll last me down the road.

660 rwhp and 641 lb/ft. That's out of my 5.4, and that equates to WELL beyond 700hp at the crank.

Yes, I'm not an idiot, and I realize that from the factory both the ZL1 and the GT500 have to pass arduous durability tests, are held to extremely safe-end parameters, and the biggest problem with high-boost is high-heat... I probably couldn't go road-racing (reliably) with my 2.5" pulley.

But even still, with yet-better cooling of the supercharger and some higher-quality plumbing on the intake and exhaust sides, I'd be shocked if Ford couldn't put down 700hp sae out of that 5.8.

I don't buy the notion that "Ford's played all its cards". I would fear that if Chevy DID counter the 2013 GT500 with a stouter ZL1, that Ford likely has another few bullets in their gun that would create this same current fiasco all over again.

Blame the Corvette, Chevy had to retain their architecture in order to retain the compact low-profile package that can fit under that sports-car's hood without using goofy hood scoops.

thunderstruck507

iTrader: (18)

I prefer that architecture for the same reasons. I love how much room is left in the engine bay to work.

I could not stand to hot rod a mod motor for this exact reason. Just looking under the hood makes me want to blow my brains out.

Also my biggest complaint about the 4th gens having their **** halfway under the damn windshield.

baalic

iTrader: (8)

Hmm, at the end of the day, drag racing isn't thd reason I personally buy my cars. I like them to be fast but theres always someone faster. I would choose a road racing setup with lots of power over a car that did wheelies and was impractical for daily driving as most drag cars are.

That being said I really like the styling of the Stangs and Camaros especially the ZL-1!! But not enough to convince me to buy eaither over a base c6 with magnetic ride.

Hp isn't everything, at the end of the day its still a camaro or still a mustang znd most people could care less if ylu have the v6 or the 1000 hp version.

For me, I'd go zl1/mustang because I actually like tbe looks better, but I'm getting a c6 "maybe z" for my next car...

baalic

iTrader: (8)

Sorry for typos c6> zl1>gt 500

Iownboth

I don't know about your "most people could care less" comment regarding the pony cars.... I've NEVER gotten as much attention and interest as I've gotten in my GT500, hands-down. I have a feeling that the ZL1 will gain alot of questions and comments at gas stations and stoplights as well..

I've had a Corvette before as a daily driver, and that wasn't a car that got me much attention whatsoever (which I don't complain about, I don't really enjoy "attention", which is why my Shelby is stripe-less). I get more "nice car" comments by a 10-1 ratio with the GT500, from a broad demographic.

Unfortunately, Corvettes carry a stigma that people automatically apply to the driver (the satin jacket singles-bar thing), even if you're a true gearhead and not a poser. And that's really unfortunate, because they're such great cars. But if you want NEGATIVE attention (especially from the ladies) drive a 'Vette... I don't see owning another one, unless Chevy totally does a 180-degree change in direction with the styling.

gocartone

iTrader: (4)

Haha, blame all the 50+ guys driving them with their Corvette jackets and I'm better than you attitudes for the negative attention they get. Speaking of which, you would be shocked at how many (almost every Corvette I meet on the road) give me the wave or flash their lights thinking I'm driving one haha.

Anyways, it's hard to argue that a solid axle would be a better in cars like these where 99% of the owners are never going to put drag radials on and head off to the track. To make it an option is just too damn expensive too considering the whole rear of the car would have to be changes from one to the other. I would rather have IRS in a car over a solid axle with all things being equal (breaking point/weight), the minor advantage at the drag strip just isn't worth it.

baalic

iTrader: (8)

Good thing im married and negative attention from girls is good!! Lol. Me wanting a vette has everything to do with driving the pony cars all my adult life then driving a vette. The vette is just me. I fell in love with the c6 "not so much the c5". So for me its all about preference.

And im only 27 not 50 lol fwiw.

Iownboth

I bought a new 1993 C4 6-speed when I was 26. Didn't think I could afford it, but Chevy had big-$$ cash-back incentives, so I stupidly dove-in anyhow, and somehow I chewed through the payment book.

My car was a factory-freak, ran 13.41 @ 107.2 paper-filter-bone-stock the first night out at the track, with only 1,700 miles and the factory oil still in the crank-case.

I loved the car, but all it took was one Corvette show to teach me that I was "not one of them". And old female acquaintances, including my wife, still rib me about having driven a Corvette and being one of "those guys".

I wound up selling it when I ordered a '97 S351 supercharged Saleen. Thought I was going to be king dingaling forever with that car (506 hp sae, epa-certified)... Had no idea that the horsepower wars would continue marching forward.

My mom had a 6-speed C5. I really didn't care for that car, steering was slow and numb, and the LS1 lacked torque. It was no faster than my oddly-quick LT1 '93. One of my employees has a 6-speed C6, and BOY did they fix the shortcomings of the C5. Much better/faster car.

gocartone

iTrader: (4)

Meh, the rich ******* stereotype is MUCH better than the head-banging, trailer park living, mullet rocking stereotype that is the Camaro and Mustang.