Ford drops to #4
12-22-2006, 04:11 PM
#61
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Originally Posted by NO-OPTION-2002
Right or wrong, 2 of my training courses this year were solely focused upon increasing market share. Specifically in the womens and minorities sectors.
I'm a parts guy, and even we had to take these courses to be certified for 2007.
I'm a parts guy, and even we had to take these courses to be certified for 2007.
Sure, but their marketshare is already on the rise.
As for the women's sector, it seems to me that the G6 can take care of that single handedly. Just about every girl I know would give up half their wardrobe to own one. That says alot.
12-22-2006, 10:04 PM
#62
Originally Posted by Blakbird24
Sure, but their marketshare is already on the rise.
As for the women's sector, it seems to me that the G6 can take care of that single handedly. Just about every girl I know would give up half their wardrobe to own one. That says alot.
As for the women's sector, it seems to me that the G6 can take care of that single handedly. Just about every girl I know would give up half their wardrobe to own one. That says alot.
show me where their market share is on the rise. its not. its shrinking. there you go again just making things up.
ive provided adequate proof disclaiming most of your statements but you refuse to accept it.
12-22-2006, 10:14 PM
#63
Originally Posted by Blakbird24
Proof? Where did you hide it? I'm still waiting for some.
Marketshare loss is not even a factor right now. Their primary concern is trimming down the company and making an efficient operation. THEN they will take a serious look at how to improve sales!
Alright here's proof that you don't know what you are talking about. You just said "increase sales at a profit" THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT I'VE BEEN SAYING THIS WHOLE DAMN TIME!!!!!!!!!!! They need to profit from their vehicles first before they can worry about increasing sales.
There, you said it yourself!!! Now drop it!!!
No, they are 5 BEST SELLING vehicles.
Silverado
Impala
Cobalt
G6
Tahoe
Whether it's enough or not is irrelevant. My point was simply that sales is not their number one problem. It's hard to argue that this doesn't prove that.
Marketshare loss is not even a factor right now. Their primary concern is trimming down the company and making an efficient operation. THEN they will take a serious look at how to improve sales!
Alright here's proof that you don't know what you are talking about. You just said "increase sales at a profit" THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT I'VE BEEN SAYING THIS WHOLE DAMN TIME!!!!!!!!!!! They need to profit from their vehicles first before they can worry about increasing sales.
There, you said it yourself!!! Now drop it!!!
No, they are 5 BEST SELLING vehicles.
Silverado
Impala
Cobalt
G6
Tahoe
Whether it's enough or not is irrelevant. My point was simply that sales is not their number one problem. It's hard to argue that this doesn't prove that.
there you go again. you said they have the five best selling vehicles on the planet. do you not comprehend your own posts? do you read my links or do you just keep going on and on making things up?
what youve been trying to prove and failing is that GM is not selling vehicles at a profit because of health costs and i disproved that. youre the one arguing with yourself over they need to make a profit. no ****. they need to BOTH increase sales and profits. do you understand now?
12-22-2006, 10:24 PM
#64
Originally Posted by NO-OPTION-2002
Right or wrong, 2 of my training courses this year were solely focused upon increasing market share. Specifically in the womens and minorities sectors.
I'm a parts guy, and even we had to take these courses to be certified for 2007.
I'm a parts guy, and even we had to take these courses to be certified for 2007.
dont bother he knows it all.
as of oct. of this yr. GMs marketshare was just over 25%. last yr. it was over 30% due to offering employee discounts to everyone.
http://www.gm.com/company/investor_i...tion/earnings/
12-23-2006, 01:41 PM
#65
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Once again, here's some more proof that you will soon say I failed to show...
http://www.gm.com/company/investor_i..._q4/index.html
http://www.howtobuyamerican.com/bamw...129-auto.shtml
That one's a long one so i'll give you the cheat: check the 12th paragraph.
You should consider your own ineptitude before questioning my comprehension.
I said exactly these words, no more, no less: "5 BEST SELLING VEHICLES". Notice the absence of the word "THE" in the beginning of that statement and the words "IN THE WORLD" at the end. Sure they are just a few words alone, but together, they make a huge difference.
But to that end, i'll do you one better and present that, in addition to having those five in the "Best Sellers" per-class list, they also have 5 vehicles in the best sellers IN THE WORLD list:
http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/list/...1/article.html
Failing? I've asked you several times to show me proof and you have yet to do so. Sure you've presented a few opinion articles that make a passing mention of the UAW, but if that's what you call proof then you can't expect to gain respect in a discussion such as this.
To satisfy me sir, you need to present real, objective, non-opinion based proof. I'm still waiting for even one shred from you.
Oh this is even better. Can't come up with something objective and useful? Try a personal jab. Yeah that's going to make you look real competent.
Originally Posted by ULTIMATEORANGESS
show me where their market share is on the rise. its not. its shrinking. there you go again just making things up.
http://www.howtobuyamerican.com/bamw...129-auto.shtml
That one's a long one so i'll give you the cheat: check the 12th paragraph.
Originally Posted by ULTIMATEORANGESS
there you go again. you said they have the five best selling vehicles on the planet. do you not comprehend your own posts? do you read my links or do you just keep going on and on making things up?
I said exactly these words, no more, no less: "5 BEST SELLING VEHICLES". Notice the absence of the word "THE" in the beginning of that statement and the words "IN THE WORLD" at the end. Sure they are just a few words alone, but together, they make a huge difference.
But to that end, i'll do you one better and present that, in addition to having those five in the "Best Sellers" per-class list, they also have 5 vehicles in the best sellers IN THE WORLD list:
http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/list/...1/article.html
Originally Posted by ULTIMATEORANGESS
what youve been trying to prove and failing is that GM is not selling vehicles at a profit because of health costs and i disproved that. youre the one arguing with yourself over they need to make a profit. no ****. they need to BOTH increase sales and profits. do you understand now?
To satisfy me sir, you need to present real, objective, non-opinion based proof. I'm still waiting for even one shred from you.
Originally Posted by ULTIMATEORANGESS
dont bother he knows it all.
12-23-2006, 02:41 PM
#66
Originally Posted by Blakbird24
Once again, here's some more proof that you will soon say I failed to show...
http://www.gm.com/company/investor_i..._q4/index.html
http://www.howtobuyamerican.com/bamw...129-auto.shtml
That one's a long one so i'll give you the cheat: check the 12th paragraph.
You should consider your own ineptitude before questioning my comprehension.
I said exactly these words, no more, no less: "5 BEST SELLING VEHICLES". Notice the absence of the word "THE" in the beginning of that statement and the words "IN THE WORLD" at the end. Sure they are just a few words alone, but together, they make a huge difference.
But to that end, i'll do you one better and present that, in addition to having those five in the "Best Sellers" per-class list, they also have 5 vehicles in the best sellers IN THE WORLD list:
http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/list/...1/article.html
Failing? I've asked you several times to show me proof and you have yet to do so. Sure you've presented a few opinion articles that make a passing mention of the UAW, but if that's what you call proof then you can't expect to gain respect in a discussion such as this.
To satisfy me sir, you need to present real, objective, non-opinion based proof. I'm still waiting for even one shred from you.
Oh this is even better. Can't come up with something objective and useful? Try a personal jab. Yeah that's going to make you look real competent.
http://www.gm.com/company/investor_i..._q4/index.html
http://www.howtobuyamerican.com/bamw...129-auto.shtml
That one's a long one so i'll give you the cheat: check the 12th paragraph.
You should consider your own ineptitude before questioning my comprehension.
I said exactly these words, no more, no less: "5 BEST SELLING VEHICLES". Notice the absence of the word "THE" in the beginning of that statement and the words "IN THE WORLD" at the end. Sure they are just a few words alone, but together, they make a huge difference.
But to that end, i'll do you one better and present that, in addition to having those five in the "Best Sellers" per-class list, they also have 5 vehicles in the best sellers IN THE WORLD list:
http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/list/...1/article.html
Failing? I've asked you several times to show me proof and you have yet to do so. Sure you've presented a few opinion articles that make a passing mention of the UAW, but if that's what you call proof then you can't expect to gain respect in a discussion such as this.
To satisfy me sir, you need to present real, objective, non-opinion based proof. I'm still waiting for even one shred from you.
Oh this is even better. Can't come up with something objective and useful? Try a personal jab. Yeah that's going to make you look real competent.
it was over 30% last yr and its been down as low as 25%. it went up a little due to a good november but its still down from last yr. i actually hope it goes up and stays there.that list you showed me was from 2005. i posted the 2006 best sellers list which had 3 GM vehicles but like the rest of my links you refuse to accept them. its hilarious you deny saying "GM has the 5 best selling vehicles on the planet"when you know damn well thats what you said. but i need to earn respect.
funny how youve posted nothing but yet youre claiming i havent. that one remark was just a joke but im not the incompetent one here.
please just prove to me that worker benefits are the only reason GM loses money on every car they sell. theres no other reason right?
12-23-2006, 02:52 PM
#67
if you read the top of that link for GMs 2001 earnings youd notice its been revised. earnings were over stated.
https://registration.ft.com/registra...3ba5a9905.html
https://registration.ft.com/registra...3ba5a9905.html
12-23-2006, 03:05 PM
#68
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Originally Posted by ULTIMATEORANGESS
GMs marketshare spikes occasonally but as i showed you its been declining for decades so you lose again. it was over 30% last yr and its been down as low as 25%. it went up a little due to a good november but its still down from last yr. i actually hope it goes up and stays there.
it was over 30% last yr and its been down as low as 25%. it went up a little due to a good november but its still down from last yr. i actually hope it goes up and stays there.
Originally Posted by ULTIMATEORANGESS
that list you showed me was from 2005. i posted the 2006 best sellers list which had 3 GM vehicles but like the rest of my links you refuse to accept them.
Second, I never specified that they were 2006 rankings. Obviously it would be ludicrous to use rankings from 2002 and claim them valid in this argument, but 2005 is the latest complete year available, so it's truly the only dependable data.
Again, putting words in my mouth. Getting desperate are we?
Originally Posted by ULTIMATEORANGESS
its hilarious you deny saying "GM has the 5 best selling vehicles on the planet"when you know damn well thats what you said. but i need to earn respect.
Please quote where I said "GM has the 5 best selling vehicles on the planet"
Until you can prove one shred of what you say, don't waste my time.
Originally Posted by ULTIMATEORANGESS
funny how youve posted nothing but yet youre claiming i havent. that one remark was just a joke but im not the incompetent one here.
Originally Posted by ULTIMATEORANGESS
please just prove to me that worker benefits are the only reason GM loses money on every car they sell. theres no other reason right?
First - I wouldn't argue that worker benefits ARE the ONLY reason GM loses money on every car they sell.
Second - Even if I did, you would just conveniently overlook it and claim I never posted any proof. That would only be the third time you've done it in this discussion.
12-23-2006, 03:20 PM
#69
GMs marketshare in june 2005.
http://www.findarticles.com/p/articl...7/ai_n13819141
about a yr later its at 25% despite it going up each quarter in 06. at least the first three quarters.
http://www.thegmsource.com/index.php...2_articleid=86
it seems when they offer discounts or incentives or whatever it goes up temporarily then it drops as they try to reduce or drop them.
http://www.findarticles.com/p/articl...7/ai_n13819141
about a yr later its at 25% despite it going up each quarter in 06. at least the first three quarters.
http://www.thegmsource.com/index.php...2_articleid=86
it seems when they offer discounts or incentives or whatever it goes up temporarily then it drops as they try to reduce or drop them.
12-23-2006, 03:21 PM
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Originally Posted by ULTIMATEORANGESS
GMs marketshare in june 2005.
http://www.findarticles.com/p/articl...7/ai_n13819141
about a yr later its at 25% despite it going up each quarter in 06. at least the first three quarters.
http://www.thegmsource.com/index.php...2_articleid=86
it seems when they offer discounts or incentives or whatever it goes up temporarily then it drops as they try to reduce or drop them.
http://www.findarticles.com/p/articl...7/ai_n13819141
about a yr later its at 25% despite it going up each quarter in 06. at least the first three quarters.
http://www.thegmsource.com/index.php...2_articleid=86
it seems when they offer discounts or incentives or whatever it goes up temporarily then it drops as they try to reduce or drop them.
See I think you just misunderstand my disagreement. Take a look at total 2006 Market share once 2006 is over, it will make more sense.
12-23-2006, 03:24 PM
#71
Originally Posted by Blakbird24
We are not getting anywhere with this. To go any further would just be going in circles. We seem to agree on almost all points, except for the primary cause of GM's problems. I have given the simplest, most obvious proof that GM's biggest problem is their compensatory liabilities. Despite this, you still disagree, so this leads me to believe that at this point we are just wasting each other's time.
GM's sales are up right now, they have 5 of the best selling vehicles on the planet. You assert still that sales is the problem, I disgree and assert that their real problem is their costs. I suppose we'll just have to leave it at that.
GM's sales are up right now, they have 5 of the best selling vehicles on the planet. You assert still that sales is the problem, I disgree and assert that their real problem is their costs. I suppose we'll just have to leave it at that.
can you read your last paragraph? five selling best vehicles...
stop wasting my time.
12-23-2006, 03:25 PM
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Originally Posted by ULTIMATEORANGESS
can you read your last paragraph? five selling best vehicles...
"...5 OF the best selling vehicles..."
Originally Posted by ULTIMATEORANGESS
stop wasting my time.
12-23-2006, 03:28 PM
#73
Originally Posted by Blakbird24
This is not what I was talking about. I simply said GM's marketshare is up over what it was last year. Now you're just putting words in my mouth to save your own ***.
First, 2006 is not over yet. I'll consider 2006 results when they are complete.
Second, I never specified that they were 2006 rankings. Obviously it would be ludicrous to use rankings from 2002 and claim them valid in this argument, but 2005 is the latest complete year available, so it's truly the only dependable data.
Again, putting words in my mouth. Getting desperate are we?
Well i'm glad you are entertained.
Please quote where I said "GM has the 5 best selling vehicles on the planet"
Until you can prove one shred of what you say, don't waste my time.
Have you actually been reading my posts or just clicking the QUOTE button? The latter would certainly explain alot. In fact, it might be a good escape plan for you since you could blame your ignorant ramblings on a simple oversight and not general incompetence.
Why?
First - I wouldn't argue that worker benefits ARE the ONLY reason GM loses money on every car they sell.
Second - Even if I did, you would just conveniently overlook it and claim I never posted any proof. That would only be the third time you've done it in this discussion.
First, 2006 is not over yet. I'll consider 2006 results when they are complete.
Second, I never specified that they were 2006 rankings. Obviously it would be ludicrous to use rankings from 2002 and claim them valid in this argument, but 2005 is the latest complete year available, so it's truly the only dependable data.
Again, putting words in my mouth. Getting desperate are we?
Well i'm glad you are entertained.
Please quote where I said "GM has the 5 best selling vehicles on the planet"
Until you can prove one shred of what you say, don't waste my time.
Have you actually been reading my posts or just clicking the QUOTE button? The latter would certainly explain alot. In fact, it might be a good escape plan for you since you could blame your ignorant ramblings on a simple oversight and not general incompetence.
Why?
First - I wouldn't argue that worker benefits ARE the ONLY reason GM loses money on every car they sell.
Second - Even if I did, you would just conveniently overlook it and claim I never posted any proof. That would only be the third time you've done it in this discussion.
nice try posting 2005 sales and then posting it as fact when you dont know what 2006 sales are yet.
yes,i overlook things just like you do.
12-23-2006, 03:30 PM
#74
Originally Posted by Blakbird24
Quote completely or not at all...what I actually said, and yes it's right there in the quote you posted...
"...5 OF the best selling vehicles..."
You're the one who keeps coming back!
"...5 OF the best selling vehicles..."
You're the one who keeps coming back!
i find this fun. i dont take it serious.
12-23-2006, 03:32 PM
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Originally Posted by ULTIMATEORANGESS
market share is not up. i just showed you.
Originally Posted by ULTIMATEORANGESS
nice try posting 2005 sales and then posting it as fact when you dont know what 2006 sales are yet.
12-23-2006, 03:33 PM
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Originally Posted by ULTIMATEORANGESS
give it up. i just showed you your statement.
Originally Posted by ULTIMATEORANGESS
i find this fun. i dont take it serious.
12-23-2006, 03:35 PM
#78
Originally Posted by Blakbird24
Yeah sure, you actually proved my point. You said yourself Market share has gone up each quarter in 2006, then use incomplete data to claim that it's down overall in 2006.
What exactly are you saying here? I already said 2006 is not yet complete and therefore cannot be used for reliable data, so 2005 is the most recent reliable year to base arguments on. So what's your point?
What exactly are you saying here? I already said 2006 is not yet complete and therefore cannot be used for reliable data, so 2005 is the most recent reliable year to base arguments on. So what's your point?
i said despite it going up it was still down from a yr ago. im comparing periods of time to show a pattern.why is this hard to get?
12-23-2006, 03:35 PM
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Originally Posted by ULTIMATEORANGESS
regardless of marketshare spiking ocasionally i proved a decline over a long period of time. no im not happy about it.
12-23-2006, 03:35 PM
#80
Originally Posted by Blakbird24
...and still managed to misquote it.
Well good. I would certainly hate to think that someone could put forth a truly serious effort and come up so short.
Well good. I would certainly hate to think that someone could put forth a truly serious effort and come up so short.
yes you certainly are.
i didnt misquote anything. did you see the three dots? just admit you said that and move on.