What would I make with a maggie 112?
12-30-2010, 09:46 PM
#25
TECH Enthusiast
iTrader: (2)
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Scottsdale, Az
Posts: 585
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Which is gonna be the other problem you might run into. Throwing a maggie and bottle on a stock motor is starting to push it's limit's. I'd be real hesitant to be running close to 600rwhp on a stock motor. Especially if it's your DD. Would it last a while, probably. But you could start with the big cube built motor first and make 500rwhp. Then if you're feeling froggy down the road throw some FI on it since it's already built.
12-30-2010, 10:37 PM
#26
Which is gonna be the other problem you might run into. Throwing a maggie and bottle on a stock motor is starting to push it's limit's. I'd be real hesitant to be running close to 600rwhp on a stock motor. Especially if it's your DD. Would it last a while, probably. But you could start with the big cube built motor first and make 500rwhp. Then if you're feeling froggy down the road throw some FI on it since it's already built.
12-31-2010, 03:17 AM
#27
TECH Enthusiast
iTrader: (2)
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Scottsdale, Az
Posts: 585
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
What size shot are you running now? What about doing work to your stock heads and getting a FAST? Should put you around 450rwhp NA and then the 100-150 shot just for good measure. If you're only using the bottle once a month you only should have to fill 3-4 times a year. The headwork and FAST setup will set you back about 2k. And if you're really feeling it switch to a direct port system, which is pretty easy with a FAST.
12-31-2010, 04:45 AM
#28
What size shot are you running now? What about doing work to your stock heads and getting a FAST? Should put you around 450rwhp NA and then the 100-150 shot just for good measure. If you're only using the bottle once a month you only should have to fill 3-4 times a year. The headwork and FAST setup will set you back about 2k. And if you're really feeling it switch to a direct port system, which is pretty easy with a FAST.
Ported heads=1300-1700
boost a pump=300
2500+tune for about 40rwhp/15rwtq just isnt gonna cut it. Ive thought about it but it just isnt gonna make me happy. Sounds like a 112 isnt either. Oh well, isnt it hard to have a little money to play with and not know how to spend it lol. Or its still not enough to do what you want.
12-31-2010, 09:48 AM
#29
TECH Fanatic
For street driving and simplicity, it's tough to beat a MP-112, IMHO. Driveability is exactly like stock, it feels like a big block, and it's reversible.
However, if you're looking at peak numbers because you're going to take it to the strip, then another route might be better. The fact that you don't like filling a bottle up (I agree 100%) makes nitrous seem like a wrong decision, so maybe a 408 with good breathing heads and a peaky cam is the way to go.
Having said that, have you ever driven a maggied V? If not, is there anyone near you who'd let you get behind the wheel of theirs? It might be convincing one way or the other to have that first-hand experience. It sure as heck convinced me as to what to do. I would never go back.
Oh, and fwiw, here's my dyno graph just for comparison purposes. This is with the stock FW which might have affected it on a DynoJet, but I don't think affects it on a Mustang as shown below. Note the rather low boost levels as mentioned by Twitch, above ... never even gets to 6 psi. An overdriven 8" crank pulley would improve that.
However, if you're looking at peak numbers because you're going to take it to the strip, then another route might be better. The fact that you don't like filling a bottle up (I agree 100%) makes nitrous seem like a wrong decision, so maybe a 408 with good breathing heads and a peaky cam is the way to go.
Having said that, have you ever driven a maggied V? If not, is there anyone near you who'd let you get behind the wheel of theirs? It might be convincing one way or the other to have that first-hand experience. It sure as heck convinced me as to what to do. I would never go back.
Oh, and fwiw, here's my dyno graph just for comparison purposes. This is with the stock FW which might have affected it on a DynoJet, but I don't think affects it on a Mustang as shown below. Note the rather low boost levels as mentioned by Twitch, above ... never even gets to 6 psi. An overdriven 8" crank pulley would improve that.
12-31-2010, 10:45 AM
#30
Ive been wondering that as well, just put me in the passenger seat is all i really need. Im not all about peak since i dont plan on running it anymore. I know how much i like the torque with nitrous. I like that part with the maggie. But I also worry that with the cam i have i wont see much boost at all do to the amount of overlap in the cam.
So anyone within an hr of me in Harford county MD who would take me for a ride in a maggied V? Ill return the favor and give you a ride in a cammed/sprayed V.
So anyone within an hr of me in Harford county MD who would take me for a ride in a maggied V? Ill return the favor and give you a ride in a cammed/sprayed V.
12-31-2010, 11:20 AM
#31
On The Tree
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Hot Springs, Arkansas
Posts: 199
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Another thing to think about is with the headers, your boost will be lower than on an otherwise stock V. Now I'm assuming the cam will flow more air. So your boost will be even lower. You'll be flowing more air and HP through the motor, it just wont show up as high boost.
Tony
Tony
So, in my hypothetical...which setup would make more: 100% stock motor with a maggie OR a stock motor, with only headers, with a maggie?
LAW
12-31-2010, 11:56 AM
#32
Guys, I am an ignorant newb when it comes to blowers, but in regards to the quote above, on a Maggie'd V would the headers actually hurt the results (if all other factors were the same). I know headers help flow more air, but if they would lower the boost I would think that would negatively affect the power output.
So, in my hypothetical...which setup would make more: 100% stock motor with a maggie OR a stock motor, with only headers, with a maggie?
LAW
So, in my hypothetical...which setup would make more: 100% stock motor with a maggie OR a stock motor, with only headers, with a maggie?
LAW
12-31-2010, 12:51 PM
#33
Guys, I am an ignorant newb when it comes to blowers, but in regards to the quote above, on a Maggie'd V would the headers actually hurt the results (if all other factors were the same). I know headers help flow more air, but if they would lower the boost I would think that would negatively affect the power output.
So, in my hypothetical...which setup would make more: 100% stock motor with a maggie OR a stock motor, with only headers, with a maggie?
LAW
So, in my hypothetical...which setup would make more: 100% stock motor with a maggie OR a stock motor, with only headers, with a maggie?
LAW
i would think a Maggie with headers would yield more power, even if the boost drops a tad... (pending you dont limit the mechanics of the blower)
A classic example is Bobs monster Procharged CTS-V.
With 14.4lbs of boost made 809 rwhp....
changing the intake manifold...(LS2 manifold to Fast 92mm)
Boost dropped to 12.4lbs but the car then made 864.
Reference
12-31-2010, 08:20 PM
#34
Launching!
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 268
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
More pressure can mean more heat.
More heated air is less density.
Pressure does not equate to horsepower.
Density of the air and the volume of air moved,
like what's said above . . efficiency.
Our maggied cars become 'beast' in 30* weather, because of density.
A big 3.3 whipple or even a 2.3 TVS will do better than a 1.8 maggie(112) because,
the air density is usually greated because it does not heat up as quickly.
Size matters if bigger is cooler. Heat soaked is a different story.
More heated air is less density.
Pressure does not equate to horsepower.
Density of the air and the volume of air moved,
like what's said above . . efficiency.
Our maggied cars become 'beast' in 30* weather, because of density.
A big 3.3 whipple or even a 2.3 TVS will do better than a 1.8 maggie(112) because,
the air density is usually greated because it does not heat up as quickly.
Size matters if bigger is cooler. Heat soaked is a different story.
01-01-2011, 11:12 AM
#35
TECH Fanatic
Not sure how a higher-overlap cam would affect things. All else being equal (lift, duration, lobe profile, etc), compared to a stock V cam that would be interesting experiment. Could be that you end up blowing or shortcircuiting too much A/F mix right on out the exhaust ports without capturing it in the cylinders to make power. Or, it may be that you scavenge the cylinders of exhaust gases just a wee bit better. Somewhere there there's a best compromise.
What we need is an engine dyno where we can dream up all these senarios and instantly find out what's what. Ri-i-i-ght.
What we need is an engine dyno where we can dream up all these senarios and instantly find out what's what. Ri-i-i-ght.
01-01-2011, 12:31 PM
#36
Not sure how a higher-overlap cam would affect things. All else being equal (lift, duration, lobe profile, etc), compared to a stock V cam that would be interesting experiment. Could be that you end up blowing or shortcircuiting too much A/F mix right on out the exhaust ports without capturing it in the cylinders to make power. Or, it may be that you scavenge the cylinders of exhaust gases just a wee bit better. Somewhere there there's a best compromise.
What we need is an engine dyno where we can dream up all these senarios and instantly find out what's what. Ri-i-i-ght.
What we need is an engine dyno where we can dream up all these senarios and instantly find out what's what. Ri-i-i-ght.
01-01-2011, 02:02 PM
#37
An Incorrect cam choice would waste boost, sure.
The proper cam would allow boost air, with a large separation for full compression and a longer higher exhaust to allow all forced air out, longest time possible. = hellofa setup.
Bob at brute can probably tell you more on good blower cam characteristics.
The proper cam would allow boost air, with a large separation for full compression and a longer higher exhaust to allow all forced air out, longest time possible. = hellofa setup.
Bob at brute can probably tell you more on good blower cam characteristics.
01-01-2011, 03:08 PM
#38
Yea I had no intentions to go boosted when i chose the cam and was just hoping this c am wouldnt really kill it for me but its not looking promising. Well see ill keep everyone updated, i could always throw a maggie on it see how it runs and then if its real bad drop the coin on a blower cam.
01-01-2011, 06:12 PM
#39
TECH Fanatic
I made 487 whp with a 112 and 1 7/8" Kooks headers through the stock exhaust with a tune. I wouldn't worry about your cam for the moment...I started a thread in the GEN 3 engine board on here not too long ago and one of the cams recommended to me was not too far off from what you have, although it was advised to install it with 4* advance.
I am also looking into getting the 112 ported, seems the Ford guys pick up quite a bit with lower IAT's with these things ported.
Good luck with whatever you choose!
I am also looking into getting the 112 ported, seems the Ford guys pick up quite a bit with lower IAT's with these things ported.
Good luck with whatever you choose!
01-01-2011, 06:22 PM
#40
Launching!
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: eastern, PA
Posts: 243
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
If I could toss a blower on for <$3,000, it's be almost impossible to resist.
Seems as though it's going to be easily 5K+ by the time all is said and done, and that's a chunk of cash I can put towards a V2.
To add to the price problem, it's going to give you a Big Block torque curve that'll basically make 1st gear useless(assuming your car is stock like mine) as wheelhop will destroy the driveline. Unless I want to dump more money into that problem.
Better for me to keep this car stock(ish). This sucks - I must be getting old...
Do the V2's have wheelhop issues like the V1's?
Seems as though it's going to be easily 5K+ by the time all is said and done, and that's a chunk of cash I can put towards a V2.
To add to the price problem, it's going to give you a Big Block torque curve that'll basically make 1st gear useless(assuming your car is stock like mine) as wheelhop will destroy the driveline. Unless I want to dump more money into that problem.
Better for me to keep this car stock(ish). This sucks - I must be getting old...
Do the V2's have wheelhop issues like the V1's?