Advice on Lingenfelter conversion please
02-14-2011, 12:50 PM
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Advice on Lingenfelter conversion please I have an 06 V with 3800 miles recently purchased. Just spoke to Tim at Lingenfelter about having them do the Maggie special
http://www.lingenfelter.com/engine-p...-m112-supercha
I really wanted the Edelbrock E-Force, but they advise against this. They are right now fitting one to a C-5 Vette and labor charges are already "significantly over original estimate." They have agreed to give me the latest Magnusson product done in powder coat black-I think it is a #119 which makes about 10% more RWHP than the older 112 for the same price. They will also install my UUC shifter and G Force axles for $400 additional labor. If I drive the car to them (Massachusetts to Fort Wayne Indiana) and leave it, they will try to arrange with one coming out by transport and would be 1/2 price shipping. ALSO, if they ship back to me I beat the 7% sales tax (over $700). I would actually love to drive it home, but the discount is just too juicy!
Salesman claims "Lingenfelter conversions add to retail value of the vehicle" Anyone know this claim to be true? They are also advising AGAINST modifying the original exhaust system, due to problems with hi-flow cats. "Not worth it for what you are gaining" I'm being told.
Has anyone done business with these folks? I know the reputation is very good and they individually fine tune the Maggie to specific vehicle, including chassis dyno and road testing. They warranty the entire engine for 3 yrs/36,000 miles. All said and done going to set me back about $11 K.
leo
http://www.lingenfelter.com/engine-p...-m112-supercha
I really wanted the Edelbrock E-Force, but they advise against this. They are right now fitting one to a C-5 Vette and labor charges are already "significantly over original estimate." They have agreed to give me the latest Magnusson product done in powder coat black-I think it is a #119 which makes about 10% more RWHP than the older 112 for the same price. They will also install my UUC shifter and G Force axles for $400 additional labor. If I drive the car to them (Massachusetts to Fort Wayne Indiana) and leave it, they will try to arrange with one coming out by transport and would be 1/2 price shipping. ALSO, if they ship back to me I beat the 7% sales tax (over $700). I would actually love to drive it home, but the discount is just too juicy!
Salesman claims "Lingenfelter conversions add to retail value of the vehicle" Anyone know this claim to be true? They are also advising AGAINST modifying the original exhaust system, due to problems with hi-flow cats. "Not worth it for what you are gaining" I'm being told.
Has anyone done business with these folks? I know the reputation is very good and they individually fine tune the Maggie to specific vehicle, including chassis dyno and road testing. They warranty the entire engine for 3 yrs/36,000 miles. All said and done going to set me back about $11 K.
leo
02-14-2011, 01:27 PM
#2
Wow. I'm still new to the s/c game but what exactly does the ~4k extra buy you over the $6500 price you can get pretty much everywhere else?
As for adding to the resale value - check ebay and compare what a lf modified car vs a stoc car are getting. That claim is totally false and sales BS.
As for adding to the resale value - check ebay and compare what a lf modified car vs a stoc car are getting. That claim is totally false and sales BS.
02-14-2011, 01:30 PM
#3
^ looks like the extra $$ is the name and the warranty is pretty nice, better read the fine print with the warranty though.
Personally I'd save the money and buy a maggie from hendrix for ~5500 and get a local shop to install it since it doesn't appear you want to do it yourself.
Personally I'd save the money and buy a maggie from hendrix for ~5500 and get a local shop to install it since it doesn't appear you want to do it yourself.
02-14-2011, 02:14 PM
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Like others have said, it would be less expensive to buy from another vendor and have a local shop install it. But, then you cant say you have a Lingenfelter CTS-V. The warranty and the fact that Lingenfelter is going to be good peace of mind. If the extra money doesn't bother you then I'd jump on it.
02-14-2011, 02:22 PM
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Anything Lingenfelter does can be had at around 1/3rd the price by just about any reputable shop...they certainly hold themselves in very high regards and charge through the nose for it. IMO they are still trying to bank off what they did with the Corvettes in the late 80's and early 90's (which in reality was nothing more than install a bunch of aftermarket parts they did not design).
BTW - the 3/36,000 mile warranty is not through Lingenfelter, it is an optional warranty package that is offered with any Magnuson supercharger kit as an option, that any swinging dick can purchase regardless of who installs it. They are probably marking that up 100% and passing it off as their own also.
That's probably why they will not do the cats. It may void a warranty that they are not going to honor, or be on the hook for as they could then be civilly liable since they voided the warranty by replacing the factory cats. It is well known that the cats are the major restriction in the OE exhaust system, and yield the largest results when changed as compared to all other exhaust components.
Ughh...nice to know these douche bags have not changed, I still remember when their "Custom" 383 LT-1 stroker tunes blew up more motors than Chuck Cow from post ignition...they never took care of any of those customers either.
Do yourself a favor...tell them to suck it and find a decent shop close by.
BTW - the 3/36,000 mile warranty is not through Lingenfelter, it is an optional warranty package that is offered with any Magnuson supercharger kit as an option, that any swinging dick can purchase regardless of who installs it. They are probably marking that up 100% and passing it off as their own also.
That's probably why they will not do the cats. It may void a warranty that they are not going to honor, or be on the hook for as they could then be civilly liable since they voided the warranty by replacing the factory cats. It is well known that the cats are the major restriction in the OE exhaust system, and yield the largest results when changed as compared to all other exhaust components.
Ughh...nice to know these douche bags have not changed, I still remember when their "Custom" 383 LT-1 stroker tunes blew up more motors than Chuck Cow from post ignition...they never took care of any of those customers either.
Do yourself a favor...tell them to suck it and find a decent shop close by.
02-14-2011, 02:26 PM
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I expect suppliers to stick to their original Bid
If I add something that's a different matter.
Personally I'd have East Coast Supercharging do the install
They have a Awesome track record, And the price's are right
Their every bit as expert as Lingenfelter
If I add something that's a different matter.
Personally I'd have East Coast Supercharging do the install
They have a Awesome track record, And the price's are right
Their every bit as expert as Lingenfelter
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02-14-2011, 04:30 PM
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They probably disourage the Edelbrock because their is no "KIT" for the V, and/or are not authorized vendors. So they can get the maggie for cheap and mark up the cost.
But atleast you'll get a Lingenfelter window decal and valve covers.
But atleast you'll get a Lingenfelter window decal and valve covers.
02-14-2011, 05:24 PM
#9
Yeah, John Lingenfelter (RIP) was really good with getting power out of cars and a well respected person in the industry [mostly GM's], but not sure how his 'shop' does these days, besides riding on his name. They may or may not be any good, compared to others, but I don't know.
The only time something will add alot of value in something like that would be if the car came like that at the dealer and was a licensed agreement to make a special model car (think like the original Firehawk by SLP) and had full documentation, etc. There are some exceptions, but it's still a regular V modified by a shop at the end of the day and nothing special, in comparison to a well done supercharger installation. Sure, it may add some, depending on the future buyer, but will still only add a % to what you paid.
It's nice they warranty their work and would expect any reputable shop to do the same, but does sound like an awful lot of extra unjustified expense, IMO.
[EDIT, PS - NEVER trust a salesman for good advice on a product they carry. There are some decent ones out there, but they are in the business of selling whatever it is they are and of course their product will always be the best, etc.]
The only time something will add alot of value in something like that would be if the car came like that at the dealer and was a licensed agreement to make a special model car (think like the original Firehawk by SLP) and had full documentation, etc. There are some exceptions, but it's still a regular V modified by a shop at the end of the day and nothing special, in comparison to a well done supercharger installation. Sure, it may add some, depending on the future buyer, but will still only add a % to what you paid.
It's nice they warranty their work and would expect any reputable shop to do the same, but does sound like an awful lot of extra unjustified expense, IMO.
[EDIT, PS - NEVER trust a salesman for good advice on a product they carry. There are some decent ones out there, but they are in the business of selling whatever it is they are and of course their product will always be the best, etc.]
02-14-2011, 10:29 PM
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Wow. I'm still new to the s/c game but what exactly does the ~4k extra buy you over the $6500 price you can get pretty much everywhere else?
As for adding to the resale value - check ebay and compare what a lf modified car vs a stoc car are getting. That claim is totally false and sales BS.
As for adding to the resale value - check ebay and compare what a lf modified car vs a stoc car are getting. That claim is totally false and sales BS.
02-14-2011, 10:41 PM
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Yeah, John Lingenfelter (RIP) was really good with getting power out of cars and a well respected person in the industry [mostly GM's], but not sure how his 'shop' does these days, besides riding on his name. They may or may not be any good, compared to others, but I don't know.
The only time something will add alot of value in something like that would be if the car came like that at the dealer and was a licensed agreement to make a special model car (think like the original Firehawk by SLP) and had full documentation, etc. There are some exceptions, but it's still a regular V modified by a shop at the end of the day and nothing special, in comparison to a well done supercharger installation. Sure, it may add some, depending on the future buyer, but will still only add a % to what you paid.
It's nice they warranty their work and would expect any reputable shop to do the same, but does sound like an awful lot of extra unjustified expense, IMO.
[EDIT, PS - NEVER trust a salesman for good advice on a product they carry. There are some decent ones out there, but they are in the business of selling whatever it is they are and of course their product will always be the best, etc.]
The only time something will add alot of value in something like that would be if the car came like that at the dealer and was a licensed agreement to make a special model car (think like the original Firehawk by SLP) and had full documentation, etc. There are some exceptions, but it's still a regular V modified by a shop at the end of the day and nothing special, in comparison to a well done supercharger installation. Sure, it may add some, depending on the future buyer, but will still only add a % to what you paid.
It's nice they warranty their work and would expect any reputable shop to do the same, but does sound like an awful lot of extra unjustified expense, IMO.
[EDIT, PS - NEVER trust a salesman for good advice on a product they carry. There are some decent ones out there, but they are in the business of selling whatever it is they are and of course their product will always be the best, etc.]
People want huge money for Mallet CTS-Vs, at least the several I've encountered on Ebay. I think there was an 04 with 50K miles the guy wanted like 40K for the thing and it disappeared after only one listing, assume it sold.
Anyone know what the story is on Magnuson 1200 VS 1900 model? Lingenfelter only using 1900 on LS2 motor and one shop told me today "you can only get that one from them." That true? If so, it lends some plausibility to the big markup.
Thanks for the response, helps slow me down a little (just a little, though)
02-15-2011, 06:58 AM
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As far as them adding value, that might be somewhat true. I think if I were in the market for a car already blown, I'd be pretty hesitant to buy one where the blower was installed by the owner or an unknown local shop. Having a known place do it can't hurt. But it costs more.
Honestly, in my opinion, the only company that really adds strong resale value for their aftermarket work is Callaway. And if you've seen any of their aftermarket stuff, it would make sense. They have a very high quality standard, though they are not always the *****-out fastest/highest horsepower offering.
I would guess that if you want a TVS blower on your car, Lingenfelter may be the way to go, if for no other reason than they have done it before. The extra cost may or may not ever come back to you at sale time.
Last edited by aurora40; 02-15-2011 at 07:09 AM.
02-15-2011, 11:00 AM
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I don't believe Magnuson makes a kit for the CTS-V that includes a TVS 1900 blower. Only Lingenfelter offers this as a ready-to-go kit (that I've seen). The MP112 is what most people use, and is an older generation supercharger than the TVS.
As far as them adding value, that might be somewhat true. I think if I were in the market for a car already blown, I'd be pretty hesitant to buy one where the blower was installed by the owner or an unknown local shop. Having a known place do it can't hurt. But it costs more.
Honestly, in my opinion, the only company that really adds strong resale value for their aftermarket work is Callaway. And if you've seen any of their aftermarket stuff, it would make sense. They have a very high quality standard, though they are not always the *****-out fastest/highest horsepower offering.
I would guess that if you want a TVS blower on your car, Lingenfelter may be the way to go, if for no other reason than they have done it before. The extra cost may or may not ever come back to you at sale time.
As far as them adding value, that might be somewhat true. I think if I were in the market for a car already blown, I'd be pretty hesitant to buy one where the blower was installed by the owner or an unknown local shop. Having a known place do it can't hurt. But it costs more.
Honestly, in my opinion, the only company that really adds strong resale value for their aftermarket work is Callaway. And if you've seen any of their aftermarket stuff, it would make sense. They have a very high quality standard, though they are not always the *****-out fastest/highest horsepower offering.
I would guess that if you want a TVS blower on your car, Lingenfelter may be the way to go, if for no other reason than they have done it before. The extra cost may or may not ever come back to you at sale time.
02-15-2011, 11:58 AM
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i looked into doing a LPE TVS1900 package as well. After talking with serval local shops close to my area (DFW), i was told the $11,000 that package is advertised as costing is mainly more the name. My shop here is DFW said they can do the exact samething (minus the Lingenfelter FRCs) for around $8,000 to $8,500. And then told me if I really wanted the FRCs, they would get me some metal covers. If you shop around, you will find that with LPE, you are paying for the name. Just like most tuning companies that are out there, they will bloat there prices because of the letters that comes with with the build. HPE and D3 are the the same way. IMO, the only difference between D3 and HPE/LPE is that D3 is a Cadillac Speciality shope. Where as HPE/LPE are engine platform shops.
And you didnt buy something that has (or near) the same things as a V2. V2 was a much more planned platform and has a lot better interior. The fastest V1s i have ever heard about are running in the mid to low 11s with built rears and 800+ hp at the wheels. With the V2, do an pulley, intake, tune, and DRs and you will have a low 11 high 10 car that gives the V1 400 pounds of weight. If you have ever sat in or been near a V2, it make almost every V1 look like a pile a dog **** (IMO).
The more I look at the V1, the more I have realized that it will never be able to do what I wanted it to do. Which is why I will be ditching the V1 in the future and picking myself up something that is really fast. Like a C6Z06...
Edit: But its your money...if it makes you happy, send it any way you please.
And you didnt buy something that has (or near) the same things as a V2. V2 was a much more planned platform and has a lot better interior. The fastest V1s i have ever heard about are running in the mid to low 11s with built rears and 800+ hp at the wheels. With the V2, do an pulley, intake, tune, and DRs and you will have a low 11 high 10 car that gives the V1 400 pounds of weight. If you have ever sat in or been near a V2, it make almost every V1 look like a pile a dog **** (IMO).
The more I look at the V1, the more I have realized that it will never be able to do what I wanted it to do. Which is why I will be ditching the V1 in the future and picking myself up something that is really fast. Like a C6Z06...
Edit: But its your money...if it makes you happy, send it any way you please.
02-15-2011, 12:09 PM
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^ all it takes is money.
I drove a V2 recently and LOVED it. Everything about it is nicer. BUT I still love my car and will most likely keep this car as the "project". I want to get a V2 for a dd but the wife says we need to get a bigger house first
lol
I drove a V2 recently and LOVED it. Everything about it is nicer. BUT I still love my car and will most likely keep this car as the "project". I want to get a V2 for a dd but the wife says we need to get a bigger house first
lol
02-15-2011, 12:12 PM
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^ all it takes is money. you are correct sir. With the right amount of $$, you will have a fast ******* cadillac (or car/truck). but is a V1 really worth it to dump that kind of money in? maybe, but not to me.
I drove a V2 recently and LOVED it. Everything about it is nicer. BUT I still love my car and will most likely keep this car as the "project". I want to get a V2 for a dd but the wife says we need to get a bigger house first lol
I drove a V2 recently and LOVED it. Everything about it is nicer. BUT I still love my car and will most likely keep this car as the "project". I want to get a V2 for a dd but the wife says we need to get a bigger house first
lol
02-15-2011, 03:28 PM
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Buy the rebuilt MP112 listed on the other site for 3500 and have your local shop install it. Take the extra cash and use it for other mods. There is no way the 119 is that kind of extra cash. By the time you spend 11k on the LPE mods you could have bought a used V2 for a couple grand more.