Driveshaft Shop

we offer a Forum discount, shoot me a PM and ill get the info for you.

steves ls6

If I knew this sooner I would have ordered it from you directly. Speed INC ordered an Aluminum one for me in the past couple weeks.

jkel1124

iTrader: (3)

Ordered one the other day and they said 4 weeks before they could ship out. Had to cancel the order because I need one now.

Driveshaft Shop

sorry about that, We are having issues with GKN Germany getting us the CV we use. we have a 150.00 per month blanket. there 450 behind already.

kra86

bump. anyone use these?

Looking at getting one. Frank still here?

Driveshaft Shop

yes im still here, any questions they work very well in this application

kra86

My only concerns really are the angles of the transmission aligning properly with the rear differential. My car is stock. I don't plan on doing anything silly.

No alignment problems from any previous customers, correct?

Driveshaft Shop

in that car there is virtually no angles at all, just dont use a Poly trans mount and all will be good.

Naf

iTrader: (1)

No plans for a two pc cf ds? I would like a higher critical speed.

Driveshaft Shop

the single Carbon is good for over 10,000 RPM how fast did you want to go. thats about 240-260Mph in a Camaro

Naf

iTrader: (1)

That could be plenty

Right now i am running 3.42 diff with 325/25r20 tires. At 1900rpm in 6th i am doin about 80mph.

SLOW SEDAN

iTrader: (13)

Indeed they do! I didn't see it mentioned that the DSS CF 1 piece is in the fastest manual CTS V1 on the planet and the fastest manual CTSV overall. Literally beats the crap out of the DSS driveshaft and axles without a problem. Car has gone bottom 9's@155+ without drivetrain issues.



You're exceeding the 250MPH rating of the 1 piece?

kra86

As in the Creative Steel transmission mount is not advised to install with this driveshaft. Is that the earlier cases I see in this large thread (I utilized a lot of weekend time reading almost all the posts in this one thread)?

Or was the case of the aftermarket shifter? Speaking of which, I do wish to change the shifter to the Hurst version modified by Brian R on here as well. Will that interfere or only changing to any versions of the PolyU transmission mount going to cause a problem?

Thank you for your time, I appreciate all feedback and quick replies from the community and the DSS rep, Frank.

Driveshaft Shop

@ 80Mph with a 26" tall tire and the 3:42 gear it would be spinning about 3535Rpm

Driveshaft Shop

see if this makes sense of what the issue is (creative also has a fix for the rear angle)

Harmonics
You see the rubber bushings in a car are there to remove harmonics from the cabin, harmonics are caused by the engine firing in pulses and the firing turns the crank, but not smooth like an electric motor, it speeds up every time the spark plug ignites the fuel, this is why the engine has a harmonic damper on the front to kind of smooth this action. when you change from rubber to solid or poly mounts it will sometimes re-introduce the harmonic back in the cabin (the reason rubber is used is to make it quiet)i have been asking under scrutiny why a stock 2 piece will not do this as much as a single one and its simple. the center of the driveshaft that is supported but a by a real soft rubber hanger. its hiding this,shaft is still moving around but the rubber is soaking it up. put a solid rubber there and it would change this tremendously. its kind of masking but its still there, when you put a single shaft in there is nothing hiding the center moving around so its transferred to the ends (think of a tuning fork, hit one side and the other moves not because its out of balance but because a sound it being transmitted thru it) Hope this make sense

material and Harmonics
you are standing in front of (3) 48" long pieces of tube, all about 3.5" in diameter but one is steel, the next aluminum and the 3rd Carbon Fiber. You then pick up the steel on with your thumb and your index finger and strike the middle of the tube with a long screwdriver. The steel shaft will ring like a bell and continue until the harmonic being produced by the strike exhausts itself. You do the same with the Aluminum next, you will get a bit of ring but not as loud and will not hold for near as long. You then pick up the Carbon Fiber and strike it the same way as the others, it make a clack and stops almost immediately.

This affect is the same thing that happens when the motor if firing and pulsing the power from the explosions in each cylinder(this is what a Harminc damper trys to stop on the engine) This pulse along with the frequency coming out of the trans and the diff all collide in the hollow tube of a driveshaft, the material will either broadcast it or will not allot it to go any further. Think of a Tuning fork, hit one side and the other moves. Its not out of balance its being excited by the frequency being sent to it, the driveshaft does the same thing so balance is not to blame its harmonic, on the 2005+ mustang Ford had such a problem with this on the car they did a 2 piece driveshaft with (1) u-joint, a hanger bearing (2) CV's and a 9lb damper in the back shaft (talk about a
flywheel affect) this shaft weighs 46lbs and was used to stop the issue. other things like solid or poly mounts will make this even worse but thats a story for another day......


Carbon
Carbon is lighter but its not the real prominent thing it does. The carbon shaft would make the car more consistent with the 60ft times. and help lower them you see when the shaft starts to twist the each of the materials will wrap up. Steel/chromoly 5-7 degrees aluminum is about 20 degrees and Carbon 30 degrees, what the difference is the Carbon releases slowly and does not shock the tires, most see between .1 to .3 gain in the 60's.

Guibo/hanger issue with stock shaft
The stock shaft will have to start by putting the torque into the front Guibo and it
gives, then it moves down to the hanger that is very soft and will move up about .750" then back to the
rear guibo and compress that one, so by the time the torque goes thru the shaft its dampened allot to
the point of feeling soft or disconnected, by putting the single shaft in the car will be allot more responsive to
pedal/torque input. It will have a more athletic feel and be quicker due to the lack of the soft parts being
removed.

Dear DSS, I have some questions regarding your drive shafts.

1/ How do carbon fiber drive shafts cope with radiant heat from the exhaust system? Should a product such as this be used on the relevant section of the exhaust pipe?
the bonding of carbon will start to have issues at 300 degrees, if the exhaust is close wrapping it or shielding it will bring the number below this.



2/ How do cf shafts cope with stone chips and abrasions caused by gravel and other road debris?
our Carbon shafts actually have a outer layer of Fiberglass, this is done to ensure the surface of the carbon to be protected, its about .125 thick and
is very good at saving the shaft, if something were do dig thru it the shaft would be bad but also keep in mind if something were to do this to aluminum it would also ruin the shaft.


3/ Do cf drive shafts have a shelf life? That is, should they be replaced after a certain amount of time?
Heat is the only thing that will shorten the life, all shafts will have a fatigue cycle, Carbon is as high if not higher then Steel/Aluminum


4/ What is the advantage of a carbon fiber shaft over an aluminum shaft?
The biggest this is its ability to absorb harmonics and its torsion properties. you see all shafts will twist before a vehicle moves, steel about 7 degrees aluminum about 20 and carbon about 30. the difference is the others will come back like a spring and put reverse torque or time compounded stress on the shaft and the rest of the drivetrain. Carbon releases its energy over time and will help with either 60ft times in a drag car, coming out of a corner with a Drift,road race/rally or time attack car and it will also protect the drive train from harmful shock. The harmonic advantage is the fact that it will not amplify drivetrain drone or motor/trans harmonics like the other materials.

kra86

Thank you for that well articulated explanation. All ideals are taken in well by this user.

A few times i have been sitting in traffic and the thought of 300 degree exhaust ruining the bonding materials makes me cringe. If a simple exhaust wrap will quell all worries, I could see myself purchasing one. Even if I were to sit in 20-30 minutes of traffic on a 95 degree plus day? Just did that on my way to work in the V, today.

Not big on drag racing, but I get your points. I also drive the car in normal traffic sometimes. I like to carve corners a bit more. All the other points clearly depict carbon fiber as the most advantageous material as long as heat does not ruin the shaft by melting out the bonding material, I am all for the carbon fiber parts when applicable.

ls1247

iTrader: (2)

Frank, how long should your CF 1 piece actually be in this application?

I've had 2 of your V1 driveshafts and one was short which required extending the CVs to bolt up (it vibbed from day 1, thanks for the refund btw) and the other so tight you could barely get it in the car, almost completely compressing the CVs to go in. The tight one has this "tuning fork" hum you referred to in your last post and I'm curious if shortening it would help.

however, I was told that your cf shafts have to be shortened at least 5 inches in order to get past the adhesives used to bond the ends into place....looks like I'm stuck with that one!

How much preload should a CV have in this application? I don't recall ever installing an axle that required compressing or extending the CVs to make length.

jmilz28

iTrader: (13)

The plunge actually helps both on the install and reducing the odds of vibrations from less than ideal angles. My understanding is that the CVs like to live somewhere towards the middle of their plunge, but I wouldn't bet my life on it. I am pretty sure fully extended is no good, I assume fully compressed is no good but that last is only a guess. Would be grateful for an answer I can hang my hat on from someone like Frank.

FuzzyLog1c

iTrader: (4)

That's correct. They're designed to be operated in the middle of the plunging region, however, setting the CVs up to be 50% preloaded at zero RPM is a mistake.

kra86

I still would love an answer regards to me sitting in traffic in 95+ degree weather and 95% humidity with a carbon fiber driveshaft. As much as I want to be spinning that driveshaft wildly, I have to live in reality and I have a good bit of traffic in my reality.

As well as the transmission mount Polyu an issue or seems to be a concern from Frank. I want to get the creative steel parts and would like advisement from either someone who has first hand experience or from Frank himself. Hopefully Frank is having a great day.