how do I build max torque? GN (lc2) going LSx?
#21
TECH Enthusiast
iTrader: (5)
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: nh
Posts: 656
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
![](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/ranks/ls1tech10year.png)
![Default](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
There are fewer and fewer that are original. Most owners mod them to the point of destroying the engine and then the numbers don't match. That's not too far from where I am going with mine. There is a youtube video of a guy with a six liter in a GN. It seemed like it was a little slow to spool but, a good tune could fix that.
![Mr. Cool](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/smilies/LS1Tech/gr_cool.gif)
#22
TECH Fanatic
iTrader: (24)
![Default](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
It's your car, make it fast and fun. Who cares what engine you put in it as long as you drive the thing. ![Happy](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/smilies/LS1Tech/gr_stretch.gif)
A setup like mine will make a ton of power without breaking the bank (relatively speaking):
347" Aluminum block
Stock crank
Callies Compstar Rods
Wiseco Forged/Coated 2618 Boost pistons (-25cc)
Stage III heads (58cc chambers)
CheaTR cam (117 LSA, smooth idle, low overlap for turbo)
TC76 Turbo
Should make 700+ RWHP and get 25+ MPG with near-stock drivability.
![Happy](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/smilies/LS1Tech/gr_stretch.gif)
A setup like mine will make a ton of power without breaking the bank (relatively speaking):
347" Aluminum block
Stock crank
Callies Compstar Rods
Wiseco Forged/Coated 2618 Boost pistons (-25cc)
Stage III heads (58cc chambers)
CheaTR cam (117 LSA, smooth idle, low overlap for turbo)
TC76 Turbo
Should make 700+ RWHP and get 25+ MPG with near-stock drivability.
![Happy](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/smilies/LS1Tech/gr_stretch.gif)
#23
Teching In
iTrader: (1)
![Default](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
Something else to consider would be swapping in a modern 3.8L
http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/gen...-national.html
The LSx + turbo + intercooler is going to make for a crowded engine bay and place a lot of weight in front of the wheels. The downside to the 3800 Series II is that you wouldn't be able to run your 200-r4 and would have to replace it with a built 60 degree 4L60e transmission.
http://www.turbobuick.com/forums/gen...-national.html
The LSx + turbo + intercooler is going to make for a crowded engine bay and place a lot of weight in front of the wheels. The downside to the 3800 Series II is that you wouldn't be able to run your 200-r4 and would have to replace it with a built 60 degree 4L60e transmission.
#24
LS1Tech Co-Founder
iTrader: (34)
![Default](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
What's torque again? I see folks say that once in a while.
You can make 600-700rwhp with a 6.0 LQ4 iron block setup no problem. Add a cam, head studs, and the rest of the stuff and you'll get there.
I had a GT47-88 348 8:1 setup in my Formula, went 10.0@139mph @ 16 psi might have gone 141 with some experimentation. Kit later went 8.8@150 in another car not sure of the boost.
You can make 600-700rwhp with a 6.0 LQ4 iron block setup no problem. Add a cam, head studs, and the rest of the stuff and you'll get there.
I had a GT47-88 348 8:1 setup in my Formula, went 10.0@139mph @ 16 psi might have gone 141 with some experimentation. Kit later went 8.8@150 in another car not sure of the boost.
#25
![Default](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
What's torque again? I see folks say that once in a while.
You can make 600-700rwhp with a 6.0 LQ4 iron block setup no problem. Add a cam, head studs, and the rest of the stuff and you'll get there.
I had a GT47-88 348 8:1 setup in my Formula, went 10.0@139mph @ 16 psi might have gone 141 with some experimentation. Kit later went 8.8@150 in another car not sure of the boost.
You can make 600-700rwhp with a 6.0 LQ4 iron block setup no problem. Add a cam, head studs, and the rest of the stuff and you'll get there.
I had a GT47-88 348 8:1 setup in my Formula, went 10.0@139mph @ 16 psi might have gone 141 with some experimentation. Kit later went 8.8@150 in another car not sure of the boost.
#26
On The Tree
iTrader: (7)
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Illinois
Posts: 187
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
![](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/ranks/ls1tech10year.png)
![Default](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
FWIW, I sold my GN to fund my Metro. I think you'll be money ahead to do that. If you do go with a V8, try not to chop up too much so you can go back to stock at some point (or the next owner can). Then you haven't destroyed any long term value.
And they did not make tons of 86 GN's less than 6000, there were over 22000 of the 87's, same car except for the grill.
And they did not make tons of 86 GN's less than 6000, there were over 22000 of the 87's, same car except for the grill.
#27
#28
![Default](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
They made a **** load of GN's in 86-87. More in 87. I say cut it up and make all the others worth more. It's your car so do what you want to it. Use a 6.0l with an 04 ZO6 cam and springs, Turbonetics T76 w/.96 a/r ball bearing if you can swing it, stock motor, 72lbs injectors, A-1000 pump and reg, alky control meth kit. Run it on pump gas with 16-18psi and 17* timing and replace 18% of your fuel under boost with the meth. You should put at least low-mid 600's down for torque to the wheels. Maybe more if you tune it right. Just my $.02 worth. You should get about 4-5 usuable combos here on the board and pic between them.
Your rear will hold up just fine. Maybe swap up to a good set of axles. Use a good lockable conveter in the 4L80 as well. Gears you have are fine. lets see it happen! Cheers!![Mr. Cool](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/smilies/LS1Tech/gr_cool.gif)
Your rear will hold up just fine. Maybe swap up to a good set of axles. Use a good lockable conveter in the 4L80 as well. Gears you have are fine. lets see it happen! Cheers!
![Mr. Cool](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/smilies/LS1Tech/gr_cool.gif)
look up chris chow on youtube with his GN and a TT SBC. I think he is the fastest stock suspension GN or was. his was 1100HP at one point. My friend has an 87 GN and an 89 TTA. Both are modded but with different blocks so he doesn't window the original. Both cars have around 45K miles on them. He still takes them to the track regularly. ![Mr. Cool](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/smilies/LS1Tech/gr_cool.gif)
![Mr. Cool](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/smilies/LS1Tech/gr_cool.gif)
Yeah I would imagine the car would be kinda rough for 6500. Even a "cheap" GN in decent shape should be able to pull 8k. got any pics??
#29
![Default](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
FWIW, I sold my GN to fund my Metro. I think you'll be money ahead to do that. If you do go with a V8, try not to chop up too much so you can go back to stock at some point (or the next owner can). Then you haven't destroyed any long term value.
And they did not make tons of 86 GN's less than 6000, there were over 22000 of the 87's, same car except for the grill.
And they did not make tons of 86 GN's less than 6000, there were over 22000 of the 87's, same car except for the grill.
Yea, for 6500 it wasn't too bad, I just hate to put a ton of money in an old V6 when the same money will get me something I can find in a junkyard and take a beating.
#30
![Default](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
Do it. I threaten to do mine all the time.
When and if I ever do my GN, I will be running a nice little twin setup.
Not sure if I will keep the 200r or go with a 4l80.
Eiter way, it's on the back burner. My engine isnt original, and it would cost considerably more to make a GN clone.
Just make it a nice clean build and no one should ever give you an issue.
When and if I ever do my GN, I will be running a nice little twin setup.
Not sure if I will keep the 200r or go with a 4l80.
Eiter way, it's on the back burner. My engine isnt original, and it would cost considerably more to make a GN clone.
Just make it a nice clean build and no one should ever give you an issue.
#31
![Default](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
I dissagree, The LC2 109 is Junk, I have seen so many split in half, Caps cracking , heads lifting etc.
Big deal it wont be origanal , who cares you only live once, Buld it KLRV6 they way you want to, you have a good vision of how its going to come out. It will be very reliable and sound great NA , blower or turbo, nothing like a V8 sound.
After you install that LSX powerplant you should show up on GM's door step and show them this is how they should have built it.
Thant what i am going to do, and if a New style GN was to be built today , what would to power it with ??????
I have a complete LS2 out of a 06 vette , only 2,000 miles on it , i am installing my own custom grind methanol injection blower camshaft with a set of lunati double/duel valve springs, hardend push rods and a set of rebuilt stock set of harlem sharp stock rocker arms.
Thats it to the LS2, O yeah i cant forget My Procharger system, I will set the pullys for 8-10 PSI and spray a custom twin nozzle Methanol injection system , set up by me, run VP M-5 fuel.
A 4L70 tranny with small converter , i guess around 3,200-3,600 stall.
I have to figure out what headers/exhaust to run, i want SS 3' exhaust with some type of X pipe and 1.75 long tube headers, I am thinking on dynomax ultra flow mufflers, i dont want the car to loud, and have the exhaust exit behind the rear tires just like a Stock T type.
I picked up a SUPER clean white with black out 87 T type a few months ago, I am going to install the motor over the winter, with new Rewired wiring harness GNX dash gauge cluster, Fuel pressure gauge mounted on hood. LSX badges. That all the money i have will take me, tranny, exhaust, dyno tune next spring
Big deal it wont be origanal , who cares you only live once, Buld it KLRV6 they way you want to, you have a good vision of how its going to come out. It will be very reliable and sound great NA , blower or turbo, nothing like a V8 sound.
After you install that LSX powerplant you should show up on GM's door step and show them this is how they should have built it.
Thant what i am going to do, and if a New style GN was to be built today , what would to power it with ??????
I have a complete LS2 out of a 06 vette , only 2,000 miles on it , i am installing my own custom grind methanol injection blower camshaft with a set of lunati double/duel valve springs, hardend push rods and a set of rebuilt stock set of harlem sharp stock rocker arms.
Thats it to the LS2, O yeah i cant forget My Procharger system, I will set the pullys for 8-10 PSI and spray a custom twin nozzle Methanol injection system , set up by me, run VP M-5 fuel.
A 4L70 tranny with small converter , i guess around 3,200-3,600 stall.
I have to figure out what headers/exhaust to run, i want SS 3' exhaust with some type of X pipe and 1.75 long tube headers, I am thinking on dynomax ultra flow mufflers, i dont want the car to loud, and have the exhaust exit behind the rear tires just like a Stock T type.
I picked up a SUPER clean white with black out 87 T type a few months ago, I am going to install the motor over the winter, with new Rewired wiring harness GNX dash gauge cluster, Fuel pressure gauge mounted on hood. LSX badges. That all the money i have will take me, tranny, exhaust, dyno tune next spring
#32
Old School Heavy
iTrader: (16)
![Default](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
I dissagree, The LC2 109 is Junk, I have seen so many split in half, Caps cracking , heads lifting etc.
Big deal it wont be origanal , who cares you only live once, Buld it KLRV6 they way you want to, you have a good vision of how its going to come out. It will be very reliable and sound great NA , blower or turbo, nothing like a V8 sound.
Big deal it wont be origanal , who cares you only live once, Buld it KLRV6 they way you want to, you have a good vision of how its going to come out. It will be very reliable and sound great NA , blower or turbo, nothing like a V8 sound.
#33
![Default](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
I'd recommend that you go for it. You have a good foundation already. If you aren't happy with the way the LS engine runs, then you can always go back to the LC2. I've had 5 Turbo Buicks. My current one is my favorite of all of them. It's a turbo LQ4 powered 87 Regal Limited. Here's my thread.
https://ls1tech.com/forums/conversio...c70-turbo.html
https://ls1tech.com/forums/conversio...c70-turbo.html
#34
![Default](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
Hi Kevin87turbot,, my Turbo T looks just like yours, but i got diffetent seats, mine look the exact same as GN seats except all solid silver grey
I got to post up some pictures
I got to post up some pictures
#35
![Default](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
I yanked that LC2 like a bad tooth for a LS2, LOL
You know if you go on any of the turbo buick sights and talk like this , they will cry like babies and boot you off. last winter when i bought the LS2 and C6 Procharger head unit system, i asked a few ? about what was involved to install a LSX PowerPlant. Man they got pissy and all insulted, They are a true V6 Turbo Family , but so are we
You know if you go on any of the turbo buick sights and talk like this , they will cry like babies and boot you off. last winter when i bought the LS2 and C6 Procharger head unit system, i asked a few ? about what was involved to install a LSX PowerPlant. Man they got pissy and all insulted, They are a true V6 Turbo Family , but so are we
#36
Old School Heavy
iTrader: (16)
![Default](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
I yanked that LC2 like a bad tooth for a LS2, LOL
You know if you go on any of the turbo buick sights and talk like this , they will cry like babies and boot you off. last winter when i bought the LS2 and C6 Procharger head unit system, i asked a few ? about what was involved to install a LSX PowerPlant. Man they got pissy and all insulted, They are a true V6 Turbo Family , but so are we
You know if you go on any of the turbo buick sights and talk like this , they will cry like babies and boot you off. last winter when i bought the LS2 and C6 Procharger head unit system, i asked a few ? about what was involved to install a LSX PowerPlant. Man they got pissy and all insulted, They are a true V6 Turbo Family , but so are we
BuickV8.com and TurboBuick.com are both excellent communities, but they are nothing short of disgusted with me when I talk LSX. So, I just don't talk motor stuff on those forums.
Signed,
Turncoat AKA Benedict Arnold
#37
TECH Junkie
iTrader: (28)
![Default](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
I built a couple GN powered RX-7's and then went LS1. Never looked back. 500hp on 91 octane n/a with streetable mods with a stock LS1 shortblock.
Most the gaskets on an LSx motor are reuseable, the cylinder head design is awesome, stock intakes flow well, you can use stock manifolds to build up a turbo setup, good oiling and ignition systems, the stock block and cranks can handle 1000rwhp+.
My built LC2 was $$$s to build (forged rods/JE pistons, RJC girdle etc), overpriced stock cast cranks, with fully ported iron heads I think they barely flowed 210cfm. Just about any ported or aftermarket LSx heads will flow 300cfm+. I sold that engine before I even ran it and glad I did. Money pits. Actually 2 brand new GN crankshafts for something like $450 each after dumping all my parts collection.
When you can make 600rwhp with a $500 5.3 engine, $700 MPT70 turbo, $200 injectors, $100 used Z06 cam, and $75 yellow Z06 valvesprings and a tune reliably you know you are onto something good. Go with the LSx setup and never look back.
LC2 in its day and in the late 90's was a bad *** setup. But it was developed from a 70's engine where they weren't trying to make 500rwhp+. Technology has given birth to the GenIII/IV/V small block and its kicking ***.
Most the gaskets on an LSx motor are reuseable, the cylinder head design is awesome, stock intakes flow well, you can use stock manifolds to build up a turbo setup, good oiling and ignition systems, the stock block and cranks can handle 1000rwhp+.
My built LC2 was $$$s to build (forged rods/JE pistons, RJC girdle etc), overpriced stock cast cranks, with fully ported iron heads I think they barely flowed 210cfm. Just about any ported or aftermarket LSx heads will flow 300cfm+. I sold that engine before I even ran it and glad I did. Money pits. Actually 2 brand new GN crankshafts for something like $450 each after dumping all my parts collection.
When you can make 600rwhp with a $500 5.3 engine, $700 MPT70 turbo, $200 injectors, $100 used Z06 cam, and $75 yellow Z06 valvesprings and a tune reliably you know you are onto something good. Go with the LSx setup and never look back.
LC2 in its day and in the late 90's was a bad *** setup. But it was developed from a 70's engine where they weren't trying to make 500rwhp+. Technology has given birth to the GenIII/IV/V small block and its kicking ***.
#39
11 Second Truck Club
iTrader: (2)
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Missouri
Posts: 1,412
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
![](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/ranks/ls1tech10year.png)
![Default](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
I say just do it. I used to have a 72 Skylark with a big block Buick engine and I took it to Buick nationals etc so I have been around the Buick guys and that mentality. My buddy has 3 Gn's and would NEVER consider putting a V8 in any of them. I would do the conversion for the V8 sound if for no other reason, but like others have already said once you go LS you will never go back.
As far as the collector value goes, just do whatever you want. I was going to hack up a Typhoon when I found my Blazer. I was arranging to fly to Texas and pick up a mint Ty I had located when I found my Blazer on a local used car lot. The Blazer was less than half the price of the Ty but it isn't a Ty and thats what I wanted. I have spent lots of $$ on things like a Ty console and floor shifter, transfer case etc etc and its still just an old Blazer. Since you already have the GN you should just go for it !!
As far as the collector value goes, just do whatever you want. I was going to hack up a Typhoon when I found my Blazer. I was arranging to fly to Texas and pick up a mint Ty I had located when I found my Blazer on a local used car lot. The Blazer was less than half the price of the Ty but it isn't a Ty and thats what I wanted. I have spent lots of $$ on things like a Ty console and floor shifter, transfer case etc etc and its still just an old Blazer. Since you already have the GN you should just go for it !!
#40
![Default](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/icons/icon1.gif)
As far as selling it and getting a regular regal and clone it and dropping a motor....**** that
Don't listen to these guys, cars come and go. They are just cars. Pull that old v6 outta there and have some fun.
When the funds get right a GN with an Iron lsx block with twin turbos will hit the streets. For the ones that dont like it...
& can kiss my ***.
Don't listen to these guys, cars come and go. They are just cars. Pull that old v6 outta there and have some fun.
When the funds get right a GN with an Iron lsx block with twin turbos will hit the streets. For the ones that dont like it...
![STFU](https://ls1tech.com/forums/images/smilies2/STFU.gif)