1970 Camaro RS: Operation Budget LSx
02-17-2010, 05:03 AM
#22
First thing I wanted to say was that after a lot of research I found that this combo, the SLP double roller and SLP ported oil pump DOES NOT need to use the spacers. One side of the pump was REALLY close to the chain, so I gave it a little extra room with the grinder. I decided to make it fit with the shims in place as a how-to.
With the shim in place on the oil pump, this is what happened to the timing cover. Hard riding condition on the left side, minor one on the lower right.
I applied assembly grease to all the areas I suspect might ride or come close to the cover.
The only thing on this side that smashed flat was the area on the strengthening rib directly below the area SLP already clearanced. It even left a grease mark behind from the cover.
Another area that rode was near the pick-up tube boss. You can see the black grease that was left behind.
You can see on the cover the areas that were close to touching and those that hit solid. The solid hits not only left grease behind, but scratched off the coating of oil.
I then ground these areas(note: I did not have the proper tool for this job, a carbide bit would have saved me a LOT of time):
After a very through cleaning (as if rinse, wipe, rinse, wipe, rinse, wipe over and over), I was able to get the cover down without riding anything at all.
Side note: When I decided to run the pump without the shims, the passenger side of the pump was incredibly close to touching and likely would rub on the pump at operating temp and RPM. I snugged the pump in place, put grease on the timing chain and turned the motor over by hand multiple times. After removing the pump I could see a very faint outline where the chain was getting too close, so I clearenced these areas as little as possible for just a bit more room. There were, of course, no issues at all with the cover fitting in the configuration.
With the shim in place on the oil pump, this is what happened to the timing cover. Hard riding condition on the left side, minor one on the lower right.
I applied assembly grease to all the areas I suspect might ride or come close to the cover.
The only thing on this side that smashed flat was the area on the strengthening rib directly below the area SLP already clearanced. It even left a grease mark behind from the cover.
Another area that rode was near the pick-up tube boss. You can see the black grease that was left behind.
You can see on the cover the areas that were close to touching and those that hit solid. The solid hits not only left grease behind, but scratched off the coating of oil.
I then ground these areas(note: I did not have the proper tool for this job, a carbide bit would have saved me a LOT of time):
After a very through cleaning (as if rinse, wipe, rinse, wipe, rinse, wipe over and over), I was able to get the cover down without riding anything at all.
Side note: When I decided to run the pump without the shims, the passenger side of the pump was incredibly close to touching and likely would rub on the pump at operating temp and RPM. I snugged the pump in place, put grease on the timing chain and turned the motor over by hand multiple times. After removing the pump I could see a very faint outline where the chain was getting too close, so I clearenced these areas as little as possible for just a bit more room. There were, of course, no issues at all with the cover fitting in the configuration.
02-17-2010, 05:13 AM
#23
First thing's first, remove the existing rod bolt (only ONE at a time, very important!) using a long handled ratchet and a 11mm socket. After a good push, the torque with break and the bolt will come out in about 4-5 turns.
But, the bolt will not come out all of the way. I used a pair of vise-grips and yanked a few times until the ferrel loosened and the bolts came out with it.
Apply plenty of ARP lube (provided in the kit) to the bolt, especially under the head.
Then torque to 40lb-ft per ARP's instructions using a 10mm socket and your favorite trusty torque wrench.
Note: the instructions in the kit are hidden under the complimentary packet of lube. The instructions say you need to resize the rods, but I discovered these are the same instruction sheets provided in the SBC kits. You do not have to resize rods in GenIII motors when upgrading to ARP bolts.
So rinse, lather, repeat until all of the bolts are done. Then it's a good idea to go around a few more times, loosen each bolt one at a time and re-torque them. The debate rages on if you need to retorque or not, but I think it's a good idea and can't hurt anything.
But, the bolt will not come out all of the way. I used a pair of vise-grips and yanked a few times until the ferrel loosened and the bolts came out with it.
Apply plenty of ARP lube (provided in the kit) to the bolt, especially under the head.
Then torque to 40lb-ft per ARP's instructions using a 10mm socket and your favorite trusty torque wrench.
Note: the instructions in the kit are hidden under the complimentary packet of lube. The instructions say you need to resize the rods, but I discovered these are the same instruction sheets provided in the SBC kits. You do not have to resize rods in GenIII motors when upgrading to ARP bolts.
So rinse, lather, repeat until all of the bolts are done. Then it's a good idea to go around a few more times, loosen each bolt one at a time and re-torque them. The debate rages on if you need to retorque or not, but I think it's a good idea and can't hurt anything.
02-17-2010, 11:14 AM
#24
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i have a texas speed t3 cam ( ground by comp cams) deff a good idea to degree it in .. comps tolaraces are +/- 6 deg , and one member here had the same cam and was off - 23 degrees .so mine will be degree'd in
02-19-2010, 01:36 AM
#25
First off I want to say sorry for the lack of pictures in this update. I had a bad day and went to the garage to work it out. I didn't stop to take many pictures. It did however make me mock everything up to give me a little push to keep going.
Got the windage tray and pick-up tube installed. Make sure you lube the o-ring with the same oil you will be running in the engine. It also helps to install the tube, it should slide right in.
Since these are new untested parts, I decided to check the clearance between the oil pan and pick-up. Didn't get any pictures of that, but the result was good.
Curious thing happened when I went to install the oil-pan. One of the holes in the pan didn't have a corresponding hole in the block! I took the pan off to double check to see if it was a misplaced hole, but no....there wasn't a hole in the block anywhere near that spot!
Interesting note: I used a straight edge to align the oil pan to the back of the block, then something struck me. Is that step truely necessary for engines being bolted to TH400/350/700r4's? The bellhousing bolt holes that are on the pan dont have corresponding structure on my 700r4 to attach to. Or am I just being crazy?
Moving on, I got the front cover installed then moved on to the ARP studs. No pictures of that, but I will take some when I take the mock-up apart to finish the heads.
So, I put the dowls in the block, slid the heads onto the studs, got the valve covers and coil packs sitting on top of them. Then I put the Vic Jr. on, put the carb that needs to be rebuilt on top of that and test fit the K&N. I thought it would also be neat to see the headers hanging there, so I added those too. These pictures will serve as inspiration to keep me going these next few months.
I plan on making a custom valley cover to delete the knock sensor holes and will paint it the same color as the block. Debating on if I should spray in gloss black or chevy orange. Also thinking about painting the valve covers to match as well. Need to make that decision soon, but first I have to get a valve spring compressor to finish the heads and put the long block together. Those pictures look good, but theres a ton left to do!
Got the windage tray and pick-up tube installed. Make sure you lube the o-ring with the same oil you will be running in the engine. It also helps to install the tube, it should slide right in.
Since these are new untested parts, I decided to check the clearance between the oil pan and pick-up. Didn't get any pictures of that, but the result was good.
Curious thing happened when I went to install the oil-pan. One of the holes in the pan didn't have a corresponding hole in the block! I took the pan off to double check to see if it was a misplaced hole, but no....there wasn't a hole in the block anywhere near that spot!
Interesting note: I used a straight edge to align the oil pan to the back of the block, then something struck me. Is that step truely necessary for engines being bolted to TH400/350/700r4's? The bellhousing bolt holes that are on the pan dont have corresponding structure on my 700r4 to attach to. Or am I just being crazy?
Moving on, I got the front cover installed then moved on to the ARP studs. No pictures of that, but I will take some when I take the mock-up apart to finish the heads.
So, I put the dowls in the block, slid the heads onto the studs, got the valve covers and coil packs sitting on top of them. Then I put the Vic Jr. on, put the carb that needs to be rebuilt on top of that and test fit the K&N. I thought it would also be neat to see the headers hanging there, so I added those too. These pictures will serve as inspiration to keep me going these next few months.
I plan on making a custom valley cover to delete the knock sensor holes and will paint it the same color as the block. Debating on if I should spray in gloss black or chevy orange. Also thinking about painting the valve covers to match as well. Need to make that decision soon, but first I have to get a valve spring compressor to finish the heads and put the long block together. Those pictures look good, but theres a ton left to do!
02-22-2010, 08:31 AM
#28
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how much slack is in that timing chain your using ? i just installed a LS2 timing set , and theres a **** load of slack .. some say it's normal .. but i'm not running it like that .. wanted to see how yours was and if it was tight i'll pick up a timing set like the one you got.
02-22-2010, 06:58 PM
#29
how much slack is in that timing chain your using ? i just installed a LS2 timing set , and theres a **** load of slack .. some say it's normal .. but i'm not running it like that .. wanted to see how yours was and if it was tight i'll pick up a timing set like the one you got.
02-23-2010, 06:06 PM
#30
very nice build and cool story telling.
please tell me you didnt LITERALLY throw away the truck oil pan. those things are perfect for modding and being ready to go for the next build.
I also had a bbc and put a lsx in. my goal is the same as yours at 550hp but I went 5.3 with turbo at 9psi and you went 6.0 NA with worked heads. the interesting thing is that our budget is the exact same. my goal was $3000 but it ended up being around $4000. Funny enough, had I known I could have got 550hp na with a 6.0, I would have gone that route.
pray tell, what headers do you plan to use?
please tell me you didnt LITERALLY throw away the truck oil pan. those things are perfect for modding and being ready to go for the next build.
I also had a bbc and put a lsx in. my goal is the same as yours at 550hp but I went 5.3 with turbo at 9psi and you went 6.0 NA with worked heads. the interesting thing is that our budget is the exact same. my goal was $3000 but it ended up being around $4000. Funny enough, had I known I could have got 550hp na with a 6.0, I would have gone that route.
pray tell, what headers do you plan to use?
02-23-2010, 07:01 PM
#31
very nice build and cool story telling.
please tell me you didnt LITERALLY throw away the truck oil pan. those things are perfect for modding and being ready to go for the next build.
I also had a bbc and put a lsx in. my goal is the same as yours at 550hp but I went 5.3 with turbo at 9psi and you went 6.0 NA with worked heads. the interesting thing is that our budget is the exact same. my goal was $3000 but it ended up being around $4000. Funny enough, had I known I could have got 550hp na with a 6.0, I would have gone that route.
pray tell, what headers do you plan to use?
please tell me you didnt LITERALLY throw away the truck oil pan. those things are perfect for modding and being ready to go for the next build.
I also had a bbc and put a lsx in. my goal is the same as yours at 550hp but I went 5.3 with turbo at 9psi and you went 6.0 NA with worked heads. the interesting thing is that our budget is the exact same. my goal was $3000 but it ended up being around $4000. Funny enough, had I known I could have got 550hp na with a 6.0, I would have gone that route.
pray tell, what headers do you plan to use?
03-04-2010, 10:46 PM
#33
Keep the pictures up...looks good. On a side note, my dad used to work at that plant in everett on the 767's I think it was when they first came out. Every time I went there I thought the little bridge they have going over the freeway to the runway is crazy.
03-13-2010, 11:03 AM
#36
any updates dude......?
03-24-2010, 10:09 PM
#37
Been a while since I've updated, but I've had a huge curveball in my life. When the time is right I will tell that story, but for now, on with the show.
Between extended periods of time away from home, I've managed to clean, prep, mask, prime and paint both the engine block and the valve covers. I used a ceramic high temp primer and chevy orange rattle can paint. Turned out nice for the $20 I spent on materials.
Just a bit of overspray to clean off the front cover.
Valve covers primed.
Coated in Chevy Orange a few times.
With the valve covers loose installed.
With the coil packs.
Between extended periods of time away from home, I've managed to clean, prep, mask, prime and paint both the engine block and the valve covers. I used a ceramic high temp primer and chevy orange rattle can paint. Turned out nice for the $20 I spent on materials.
Just a bit of overspray to clean off the front cover.
Valve covers primed.
Coated in Chevy Orange a few times.
With the valve covers loose installed.
With the coil packs.
03-24-2010, 10:10 PM
#38
Over a few nights I managed to take apart my carb, clean it and replace every part that is made out of rubber. I deleted the choke mechanicals and plugged the hole for the choke rod. I've cut the choke horn away before on previous builds, but I think I will just leave it for now. Turns out the carb is a 4780-5 800cfm double pumper and not an 850 as I was led to believe. Oh well, still plenty for what I'm doing. While I was at it I found that it had factory jets and a 6.5 power valve. I installed a 5.5 for now and will wait to change out the jets when it's time to tune it.
Pile of parts.
Ended up with this.
Pile of parts.
Ended up with this.
03-26-2010, 11:29 AM
#40
Looks good man. I'm doing a carb'd LY6 6.0L into my 73 RS/LT. I've got an entire build thread going on the 2nd Gen site 
, but like you, I'll probably wait until I start on the LS engine before starting a thread in here. Hopefully that will be within three or four months. Keep up the good work.
, but like you, I'll probably wait until I start on the LS engine before starting a thread in here. Hopefully that will be within three or four months. Keep up the good work.