Anyone who owns a car with 22-inch rims NEEDS that car to be slow - otherwise it could outrun their 
22" wheels make a big difference
22" wheels make a big difference A buddy of mine has an awesome Chevelle, with a built 4l60e, 2500 stall, LQ9 with L92 heads and a moderate cam with LS3 intake, Hooker long tube headers and 3.55 gears. However he says it doesn't feel as fast as he thought it would (I wasn't sure what to expect, but I like it). He drove my C5 with ported stock heads, generic manifolds, high lift cam, 3200 stall and 3.15 gears and was stunned that mine felt faster and more responsive (on the highway, I can't pull away from him as fast as I want to) We were theorizing as to why that would be 
I suggested maybe it was the massive 22" wheels that look awesome by the way. Or maybe even the mild cam that may not take advantage of the excellent flow characteristics of the L92's until much higher in the rpm range. I told him the road tune was cool, but lets put in on the dyno and see what it makes, and slap some 17's on it for good measure. 
I suggested maybe it was the massive 22" wheels that look awesome by the way. Or maybe even the mild cam that may not take advantage of the excellent flow characteristics of the L92's until much higher in the rpm range. I told him the road tune was cool, but lets put in on the dyno and see what it makes, and slap some 17's on it for good measure. 
I bet the 22's with tires are what, 80 pounds each? That's 320 pounds of unsprung weight. That can easily be the difference!
I bought a Miata with some TSW 16 with 205/45 tires. It rode like a dump truck. I always thought it was because of the Koni coilovers. The 16s were going bald so I swapped to stock wheels and tires. The car felt quicker and the ride got WAY nicer.
Food for thought.
Andrew
I bought a Miata with some TSW 16 with 205/45 tires. It rode like a dump truck. I always thought it was because of the Koni coilovers. The 16s were going bald so I swapped to stock wheels and tires. The car felt quicker and the ride got WAY nicer.
Food for thought.
Andrew
You also have a higher stall in your car.
Also what is his Tranny shifting at ?
Did you guys try swapping wheels and get different results or were you just guessing that they were the problem. The title has me confused. Would be curious to see how much it really changed things.
Last edited by chuckd71; Apr 5, 2012 at 10:45 PM.
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Verdad Gallardo I see your point Andrew. He has a set of 17's we may put on at the end of the month. C5 is light, but not that light. On a truck scale it comes in at 3280 lbs, and my Lemans weighed 3900 with the original Pontiac 350, so its more like 700lbs which is still significant. For some of you I know its a public forum so caveat emptor but a little tact is in order. I am sure there more than a few people who feel confident we are douche bags for taking out the stock engine of a classic car and replacing it with an incredibly ugly engine...all in the name of progress.
For some of you I know its a public forum so caveat emptor but a little tact is in order. I am sure there more than a few people who feel confident we are douche bags for taking out the stock engine of a classic car and replacing it with an incredibly ugly engine...all in the name of progress.
I'll be the first to apologize for ignorant behavior.
Of course the 22s are going to mess with the handling and responsiveness. Also, has he compared compression ratios with your car's? I suspect he may have a lazier CR (or DCR) than he thinks. I thought my **** was up there, and couldn't figure out why it wasn't so snappy. Surprise! I found out it was actually lower than stock. Anyways, that could be part of it. I would also revisit the head and cam selection if he was expecting more. While rectangle port heads have very nice flow numbers, on a 4" bore I've heard they shroud the **** out of the intake valve. LS3s have a 4.065 bore stock, so they are less shrouded in that motor. Also, back to compression ratio, having a stock compression motor with a lopey cam will actually cost you. Aside from having stock SCR to begin with, releasing some cylinder pressure due to excess overlap will weaken power under the curve and will make the motor not feel as strong on the butt-dyno, or as responsive. Find out the DCR of his motor if you can. I'm no expert, as a matter of fact I have a lot to learn, but he may have made some of the same mistakes in his setup as I have in mine.
Of course the 22s are going to mess with the handling and responsiveness. Also, has he compared compression ratios with your car's? I suspect he may have a lazier CR (or DCR) than he thinks. I thought my **** was up there, and couldn't figure out why it wasn't so snappy. Surprise! I found out it was actually lower than stock. Anyways, that could be part of it. I would also revisit the head and cam selection if he was expecting more. While rectangle port heads have very nice flow numbers, on a 4" bore I've heard they shroud the **** out of the intake valve. LS3s have a 4.065 bore stock, so they are less shrouded in that motor. Also, back to compression ratio, having a stock compression motor with a lopey cam will actually cost you. Aside from having stock SCR to begin with, releasing some cylinder pressure due to excess overlap will weaken power under the curve and will make the motor not feel as strong on the butt-dyno, or as responsive. Find out the DCR of his motor if you can. I'm no expert, as a matter of fact I have a lot to learn, but he may have made some of the same mistakes in his setup as I have in mine.
Big *** rims act just like a heavier flywheel, they don't rev up as fast. Not only are the wheels heavier, they have more rotating weight out a longer way from the axle . It is a simple matter of physics that says you will be sucking up horsepower that could have gone into accelerating the car into just making the wheels turn. Then when it comes time to stop, all of the energy stored up in the wheels will need to be dissipated as heat by the brakes.
A total lose-lose scenario as far as performance.
If you every go to a museum of science and industry most have a display where you roll wheels down and incline. Take equal sized and weight wheels and the one with more weight concentrated out near the edge take massively longer to get to the end of the ramp.
Bigger rims will make you slower.
A total lose-lose scenario as far as performance.
If you every go to a museum of science and industry most have a display where you roll wheels down and incline. Take equal sized and weight wheels and the one with more weight concentrated out near the edge take massively longer to get to the end of the ramp.
Bigger rims will make you slower.
Obvious wheel will slow it down.
Will also depend on what kinda wheels, design etc. Full almost solid face wheel will weight more then spoked wheel. What kind of rims are they?
If you are going got speed, I wouldn't put rims on the car.
Checkout this car without rim.
http://youtu.be/YmleR-lZsQ8
http://youtu.be/wDGMGELQDqM
With rims
http://youtu.be/-paDnOj8kV8
Skip to 48 sec mark lol
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wrjCT...eature=related
Will also depend on what kinda wheels, design etc. Full almost solid face wheel will weight more then spoked wheel. What kind of rims are they?
If you are going got speed, I wouldn't put rims on the car.
Checkout this car without rim.
http://youtu.be/YmleR-lZsQ8
http://youtu.be/wDGMGELQDqM
With rims
http://youtu.be/-paDnOj8kV8
Skip to 48 sec mark lol
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wrjCT...eature=related
thought?? After some thought??? a fact is that the size of the wheel--22" does not mean squat-- it is the overall diameter of wheel/tire combo that changes your effective gear ratio-- if the car was high geared to start with and you throw on a combo that is taller yet-- your gear ratio changes also-- not for the better for your seat of the pants acceleration. If you wish to figure it out, go to one of the gear manufacturer's website and they should have the formulas there for you so you can take your established know specs, add your new specs and you will know what "actual effective gear ratio " you will have after the said change.. Sorry, but facts are facts, you can't just wish the numbers.
Nobody is arguing that, the subject at hand is moving the weight of the wheel/ tire combo farther from it's center. This is assuming your wheel material weighs more than the tire it is replacing. Overall diameter being constant a larger wheel can present you with often overlooked inertia and momentum issues.
I'll be the first to apologize for ignorant behavior.
Of course the 22s are going to mess with the handling and responsiveness. Also, has he compared compression ratios with your car's? I suspect he may have a lazier CR (or DCR) than he thinks. I thought my **** was up there, and couldn't figure out why it wasn't so snappy. Surprise! I found out it was actually lower than stock. Anyways, that could be part of it. I would also revisit the head and cam selection if he was expecting more. While rectangle port heads have very nice flow numbers, on a 4" bore I've heard they shroud the **** out of the intake valve. LS3s have a 4.065 bore stock, so they are less shrouded in that motor. Also, back to compression ratio, having a stock compression motor with a lopey cam will actually cost you. Aside from having stock SCR to begin with, releasing some cylinder pressure due to excess overlap will weaken power under the curve and will make the motor not feel as strong on the butt-dyno, or as responsive. Find out the DCR of his motor if you can. I'm no expert, as a matter of fact I have a lot to learn, but he may have made some of the same mistakes in his setup as I have in mine.
Of course the 22s are going to mess with the handling and responsiveness. Also, has he compared compression ratios with your car's? I suspect he may have a lazier CR (or DCR) than he thinks. I thought my **** was up there, and couldn't figure out why it wasn't so snappy. Surprise! I found out it was actually lower than stock. Anyways, that could be part of it. I would also revisit the head and cam selection if he was expecting more. While rectangle port heads have very nice flow numbers, on a 4" bore I've heard they shroud the **** out of the intake valve. LS3s have a 4.065 bore stock, so they are less shrouded in that motor. Also, back to compression ratio, having a stock compression motor with a lopey cam will actually cost you. Aside from having stock SCR to begin with, releasing some cylinder pressure due to excess overlap will weaken power under the curve and will make the motor not feel as strong on the butt-dyno, or as responsive. Find out the DCR of his motor if you can. I'm no expert, as a matter of fact I have a lot to learn, but he may have made some of the same mistakes in his setup as I have in mine.
