Project GatTagO

iTrader: (7)

Both the Terminator X and the Max can take a speed input, but it has to be a Hall Effect sensor, which is as I understand, a 5v square wave. Someone can correct me if I am wrong about that. Speed input to the ECU is not mandatory, but there are features that are helpful to program in that are based on speed. For instance, I have an advanced 1D table programmed into my Cougar that alters the target idle RPM based on speed. So from 1-20MPH the target RPM climbs at a slope to +300 RPM. This is extremely helpful for drivability, especially with a manual transmission. Obviously this can't be implemented unless the ECU has a vehicle speed input.

A simple way to input speed is a collar on the driveshaft with a Hall Effect sensor, sort of like a crank trigger, but on the driveshaft. I think Holley also sells a GPS module that has a square wave output that can be fed into the Terminator.

Andrew

Haggar

The transmission harness for the Max plugs into the VSS, so that gets me the speed in. Hopefully, I'll start my install tomorrow, my goal is to run a speed out to my VDO speedometer. I don't have a tune file created yet, so the software is mostly greyed out. My CAN to USB cable should be here tomorrow. I'm doing a few other things at the same time, so it might take a few days to get the system installed. I'll try to do photos and put something up if I get it done.

Project GatTagO

iTrader: (7)

See my post #179

epfatboy

iTrader: (3)

Thats easy, cut the red wire, always cut the red wire. If that didn't work cut the blue wire but don't ever splice the red wire back together. If cutting the red and blue wire didn't work don't even think of splicing the blue wire together but by all means splice the red wire back together. If that still doesn't work splice the Blue wire back together and you should be all set.

pdxmotorhead

Hmm,, depends on how the VVT in question works doesn't it?
Many VVT systems are strictly ON or OFF ,
I know the two cars I own literally just open a solenoid to let oil push the cam timing..
Its not infinitely variable, just takes about a second or so to change modes.
Be interesting to figure out a way to watch the change..

Michael Yount

iTrader: (1)

Clarity.

G Atsma

Oh yeah..... clear as mud......

Haggar

About 95% installed with mine, hope to having running tomorrow. Slowed down from the other things I'm doing at the same time-- intake manifold & throttle body swap, injectors, a few other things. Had to fab up a throttle cable bracket for the TBSS intake. So far, the install has been pretty smooth. Harness seems high quality. I wish a few spots were a few inches longer, it was tricky to get the cam sensor plugged in. But that is more an issue with my truck (72 GMC), the engine is very close to the firewall, so it's tough to get everything in place. I just need to wire the switched battery and relay for transmission power, and the brake switch, fans, and it should be ready to start.

Haggar

Update: Got the last few wires hooked up this morning. Did the start up wizards, which took 5 minutes, most of which was trying to find which part number my FAST 33# injectors are (rebranded Corvette LS2 injectors) and it fired right up. Idles great (Was not sure how this would go, since I installed the TBSS manifold and 92mm WARR TB at the same time). Throttle response seems great.

I need to sort out my alternator next, the holley system doesn't have an alternator wire. Once that's done, I can take it out for a test drive.

So, assuming things go OK from here, here's my quick thoughts:

My previous setup was a Painless Wiring truck harness with a Red/Blue ECU. Motor is an 2005(?) LQ4, with ported heads, 223/231 camshaft, Corvette LS2 injectors, 4" intake, 1-7/8" headers, 2.5" exhaust, no cats. TBSS Intake manifold and 92mm TB now, as mentioned above. Previously tuned with HP tuners.

Installation is about the same compared to my previous setup. I did have to drill and tap my intake pipes to accept an IAT sensor, since the factory MAF sensor had the integrated IAT.

Both systems I was able to get to fire up on the first try. But its hugely different experience.

With HP tuners, I had to first look online for some LQ4 files and figure out where to start, and flash a base tune into my 4.8l ECU. Then learning waht in the SW to disable, like VATS, rear O2s, etc, and other vehicle setup items. Then learn how to setup my wideband and log things in HP tuners. Then watch youtube and read idle tuning guides, and try to figure out how to tune idle. Good stuff, that is useful even now, but there was a lot of research before I was comfortable trying to start it the first time. Then once I did the idle tuning, then lots of driving, slowly working on the VE table. etc, etc, etc...


With the Holley, it was 5 minutes to go from nothing to up and idling, with the handheld logging things for me.

There's certainly a place for all of these systems. There are going to be people who will scrounge, and try to save every penny. Then there will be those who want everything done to racecar levels. I an happily inbetween. Time is valuable, busy work schedule and 3 kids. I rarely have time outside of weekends to work on things, and I'd rather be out cruising. I don't have a problem figuring out harnesses and tuning (am an automotive electrical engineer), but I'd rather have things new and easy, given the choice.

I like what I've experienced so far with this one. *MY* setup (and my other vehicles) are older, and I have them basically gutted and stand alone wiring, so I'm not concerned with integrating into any other vehicle stuff. I really like that I can do some tuning / monitoring / logging without my laptop, since it's a convertible with no locking storage in it.

If I look at costs, like I said, I have the painless harness, that I got from a friend. They normally cost $600. Someone starting without an ECU would need another $50-$100 there. Then if you wanted to tune yourself, $400ish for HPtuners, and then another, what $250 for a wideband setup? At least thats what I Think I had into my old setup. So thats the exact same price as this kit, and would be more expensive than the holley if I wasn't controlling the transmission. Getting it all in one box, and not having the hp tuners learning curve is nice

Project GatTagO

iTrader: (7)

All you need for the alternator is a 12+v to the L terminal with an inline resister, or it can be wired through your vehicles original alternator warning light circuit. I also highly recommend adding a wire to the S terminal and running that wire to the main power distribution point in the car wiring system.

Andrew

Haggar

Which is exactly how it's wired. The only difference is that the L wiring (which I'm running inline resistors) used to hook to a wire labelled Alt from the painless kit, and now I connected it to a switched +12v. I run a remote distribution/fuse block, and have my sense wire connected there.

I suspect the switched 12v isn't switching. I took a lunch break heading back to check it. In the instructions, Holley was specific to point out that the switch 12v for the transmission harness needs to be separated from the switched 12v feed to the rest of the ECU. So, I took that ECU switched line to turn on a relay to create a 'buffered' switched 12v for the transmission, and then I also used this to feed the L line. It's possible that I have an issue with that relay, and it's not feeding power correctly. I didn't try to shift the transmission, so if there was no power there, I might not have seen it. Should be something easy.

I do appreciate your helpfulness in this thread, thanks

Project GatTagO

iTrader: (7)

No worries. We're all hear to learn from our experience!

Andrew

Long Beach GTO

Hey guys. I just purchased the X Max kit for my 69 Chevelle with a 416" LSA. I still have the T400 transmission with the cable driven speedo. Is there a simple way to convert the cable speedo to some sort of electrical out put going to the Terminator X Max ECU? Thanks for your thoughts,

Haggar

LOL... somehow, I left the wire to the L terminal unconnected. Hooked it up to my relay and it's all good now. Got my fans wired in, ran it up to temp, and and took it for a drive.

So, with 10 minutes of total run time, it already feels as good as my SD tune that I was running last summer. Very impressed with the Holley system. Can't wait to get it on the road and do the real tuning on it to get it dialed in.

Project GatTagO

iTrader: (7)

Yes, various companies make a pass through VSS for cable drive. They bolt into the trans, then the speed cable bolts to it and the VSS is inline. Those are 3 wire hall effect sensors, so easy hook up! Check auto meter and VDO.

Andrew

Haggar

What do you need the speed input into the system for? (curious what you will use the signal for)

Project GatTagO

iTrader: (7)

Awesome! Get a laptop on it and start learning the software.

Andrew

Project GatTagO

iTrader: (7)

There are nice tuning features that can be implemended based on vehicle speed. For instance, I disable cooling fans above 40mph. I also bump target idle speed based on speed. This helps a lot with drivability when running a manual trans. Also, if you want to use the Holley 7" dash and want speed displayed, you'll need a vss input to the ecu.

Andrew

Long Beach GTO

[QUOTE=Project GatTagO;20076418]There are nice tuning features that can be implemended based on vehicle speed. For instance, I disable cooling fans above 40mph. I also bump target idle speed based on speed. This helps a lot with drivability when running a manual trans. Also, if you want to use the Holley 7" dash and want speed displayed, you'll need a vss input to the ecu.

Andrew[/QUOTE

The 7" ( or 12") Holley dash is in my future plans. Disable the fans above 40mph might work for me also, thanks for that tip!

LLLosingit

iTrader: (4)

If the software if similar to the HP and Dominator you can also setup additional tables for safeties to override commands when needed, My fans are PWM and set to slow down as speed increases and is also temperature based, So the fans won't turn off at speed if the temperature is higher than a preset.
You can also setup numerous safeties incase of low oil pressure or fuel pressure and so on, Basically anything it monitors can be used to trigger an event if it deviates from the predefined parameters you set.