my idea...
08-03-2005, 09:11 AM
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my idea... although it isnt really an LSx conversion, it will be used to tow my ls1 (soon to be ls2 402 stroker) powered camaro to and from the track.
I am think of buying either a 1947 studebaker M16 1 1/2 ton truck or a 1941 Dodge COE and converting the rear frame into a trick carhauler. I was also going to put a late model deisel engine in it....probably a CTD, it would be really nice if i could find a wrecked ram 600
what do you guys think about that?
I am think of buying either a 1947 studebaker M16 1 1/2 ton truck or a 1941 Dodge COE and converting the rear frame into a trick carhauler. I was also going to put a late model deisel engine in it....probably a CTD, it would be really nice if i could find a wrecked ram 600
what do you guys think about that? 
08-04-2005, 08:16 AM
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And if you're going to be putting it in that big a truck, maybe you should be thinking about more motor anyway.
Like the Cummins 8.3 or 10 liter, or a late model Cat or something.
Buddy of mine was going to do something similar with a 1950 Ford F5. Already had the ramp back, because it was an ex-tow truck. Was going to get the running gear from a late model dump truck (engine, trans, axles & brakes, etc.). Basically hit the big rig wrecking yards and see what you find. Sadly that project didn't happen (too many others, finally gave the truck away before it rusted away).
'Dreamin'
Like the Cummins 8.3 or 10 liter, or a late model Cat or something.
Buddy of mine was going to do something similar with a 1950 Ford F5. Already had the ramp back, because it was an ex-tow truck. Was going to get the running gear from a late model dump truck (engine, trans, axles & brakes, etc.). Basically hit the big rig wrecking yards and see what you find. Sadly that project didn't happen (too many others, finally gave the truck away before it rusted away).
'Dreamin'
08-04-2005, 09:30 AM
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i would not put a powerstroke or duramax in it due to the fact the cummins are better designed and they are medium duty diesels not light duty diesels like the ford and chevy counterparts.
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08-04-2005, 10:15 AM
#8
Originally Posted by badtexasZ28
i would not put a powerstroke or duramax in it due to the fact the cummins are better designed and they are medium duty diesels not light duty diesels like the ford and chevy counterparts.
08-04-2005, 12:28 PM
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Why stop at 6 speeds? Why not 7 or 8 or 9.... Maybe a good Road Ranger 10 speed? I think I've seen them through 14 speeds. That might be overkill there.....
And why sell yourself short in the horsepower department. Why not use a motor that'll make 400 to 500 hp and 1000 ft-lbs in stock trim? You can always turn up the wick later????
Just food for thought. The bigger motors certainly make more power, but also weigh more and take up more space. Maybe not your best choice, but something I'd consider along with the light duty diesels. Then you can make an informed decision, having weighed all your potential options and their respective benefits & drawbacks.
'Dreamin'
And why sell yourself short in the horsepower department. Why not use a motor that'll make 400 to 500 hp and 1000 ft-lbs in stock trim? You can always turn up the wick later????
Just food for thought. The bigger motors certainly make more power, but also weigh more and take up more space. Maybe not your best choice, but something I'd consider along with the light duty diesels. Then you can make an informed decision, having weighed all your potential options and their respective benefits & drawbacks.
'Dreamin'
08-04-2005, 12:39 PM
#11
uum, this is only going to haul itself and one car, right?
diesels are most efficient when they're loaded down... a one car load isnt going to load down this huge motor... so you'll still have the 10mpg goodness of the huge diesel... true, you could then add 4 other cars, and still get the 10mpg, but the point of a car hauler is to efficiently get your car, tools, ect to and from the track... MPG is pretty important in that aspect.. especially if you're like most of us and have to drive a good distance between diffrent tracks. you dont need a huge diesel.... why do you want one? what possible benefit might it have? you put that smaller one in, its cheaper. you have more parts easily available.. you can easily up the power on them, and while you still wont get excellent MPG towing, it will be much better the rest of the time...
i dunno... i mean, sure they seem like such small motors for such a large truck, but remember their original motor output, and then look at the output of modern motors..
diesels are most efficient when they're loaded down... a one car load isnt going to load down this huge motor... so you'll still have the 10mpg goodness of the huge diesel... true, you could then add 4 other cars, and still get the 10mpg, but the point of a car hauler is to efficiently get your car, tools, ect to and from the track... MPG is pretty important in that aspect.. especially if you're like most of us and have to drive a good distance between diffrent tracks. you dont need a huge diesel.... why do you want one? what possible benefit might it have? you put that smaller one in, its cheaper. you have more parts easily available.. you can easily up the power on them, and while you still wont get excellent MPG towing, it will be much better the rest of the time...
i dunno... i mean, sure they seem like such small motors for such a large truck, but remember their original motor output, and then look at the output of modern motors..
08-04-2005, 02:14 PM
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Hey MrDude_1.....
You are correct that diesels are most efficient when they're loaded down, probably peak around the 75% output range. BUT the nice thing about diesels are they meter fuel based on load. You are correct, the smaller the engine, the better fuel economy potential. Maybe we should be suggesting something in the 2l range? Ok, maybe not.
I find it interesting that the manufacturers are doing some strange things to get them to heat up (because they aren't burning enough fuel because not enough load). Like Ford's Powerstroke has an exhaust brake (really a flapper) in it, not for the braking capacity, but to get the motor to warm up and provide cabin heat. The latest revision of the Duramax is supposed to get a fast idle setting, which will not only crank up the idle speed, but the Allison 6 speed behind it is supposed to load up the engine (not sure how they're doing that, maybe trans brake?) to accomplish the same deal. Neither of those systems help fuel economy, now do they?
I don't really think they're all that small a motor relative to the truck. Most 1 ton duallies have a capacity (in the bed) of something over 5000lbs. Thats not a 1 ton truck, its not even a 1.5T truck. That's 2 1/2 tons. Which either means the manufacturers are overly optimistic or that things have gotten much stronger. Compare the 1ton dually to a 2.5T military. There is a world of difference there in terms of axle strength and such, but the Duece and a half still probably has less motor than a current Powerstroke, Duramax, or Cummins. I've riden in one of those (the Duece) on the highway and man it wasn't fun. Just put your foot on the floor, and hold it wide open, about 500 rpm PAST redline. Made a heck of a racket at 55mph, especially till the tires got to be round again. I'm also glad that if it came apart it was on Uncle Sam's dime. Or consider the factory motor in the '50 Ford F5 my buddy was going to go through was a flathead V8. I'm sure it'd drag that thing around, but I think it'd be a rolling traffic hazard on the highway. Probably not enough power to pull 55 up most grades. Just because they felt it was enough motor in 1941 doesn't mean its enough now. How about the 40' Dodge PowerWagon (or Troop Transport if you look at the military version). Do you realize that those things came stock with a flathead inline 6? And they weigh 8000lbs plus stock. Thats for a 3/4ton rated truck BTW. Thats not alot of motor to haul around that amount of weight. And the brakes have got to be even more questionable.
Anyway, enough of my rambling. My point before was to not overlook some of the heavier stuff, because it might be on par with what he's looking to do. An over the road truck is probably not what you want (too heavy), but parts from say an International 4800 series might be a real good fit (size, durability, braking capability, etc). And you might even spend less money (I don't know that for certain). The junkyard Duramax's I've seen listed are running like $4k to $6k or more (from what I've seen). That doesn't include the trans, axles, brakes, or any of the other stuff that you'd want to upgrade from 1940's technology.
Maybe a light truck diesel is the best choice. But if it were my project I would prefer not to just jump to that conclusion, but to reach it after thinking about my options. That's the only thing I'm really suggesting.
'Dreamin'
You are correct that diesels are most efficient when they're loaded down, probably peak around the 75% output range. BUT the nice thing about diesels are they meter fuel based on load. You are correct, the smaller the engine, the better fuel economy potential. Maybe we should be suggesting something in the 2l range? Ok, maybe not.
I find it interesting that the manufacturers are doing some strange things to get them to heat up (because they aren't burning enough fuel because not enough load). Like Ford's Powerstroke has an exhaust brake (really a flapper) in it, not for the braking capacity, but to get the motor to warm up and provide cabin heat. The latest revision of the Duramax is supposed to get a fast idle setting, which will not only crank up the idle speed, but the Allison 6 speed behind it is supposed to load up the engine (not sure how they're doing that, maybe trans brake?) to accomplish the same deal. Neither of those systems help fuel economy, now do they?
I don't really think they're all that small a motor relative to the truck. Most 1 ton duallies have a capacity (in the bed) of something over 5000lbs. Thats not a 1 ton truck, its not even a 1.5T truck. That's 2 1/2 tons. Which either means the manufacturers are overly optimistic or that things have gotten much stronger. Compare the 1ton dually to a 2.5T military. There is a world of difference there in terms of axle strength and such, but the Duece and a half still probably has less motor than a current Powerstroke, Duramax, or Cummins. I've riden in one of those (the Duece) on the highway and man it wasn't fun. Just put your foot on the floor, and hold it wide open, about 500 rpm PAST redline. Made a heck of a racket at 55mph, especially till the tires got to be round again. I'm also glad that if it came apart it was on Uncle Sam's dime. Or consider the factory motor in the '50 Ford F5 my buddy was going to go through was a flathead V8. I'm sure it'd drag that thing around, but I think it'd be a rolling traffic hazard on the highway. Probably not enough power to pull 55 up most grades. Just because they felt it was enough motor in 1941 doesn't mean its enough now. How about the 40' Dodge PowerWagon (or Troop Transport if you look at the military version). Do you realize that those things came stock with a flathead inline 6? And they weigh 8000lbs plus stock. Thats for a 3/4ton rated truck BTW. Thats not alot of motor to haul around that amount of weight. And the brakes have got to be even more questionable.
Anyway, enough of my rambling. My point before was to not overlook some of the heavier stuff, because it might be on par with what he's looking to do. An over the road truck is probably not what you want (too heavy), but parts from say an International 4800 series might be a real good fit (size, durability, braking capability, etc). And you might even spend less money (I don't know that for certain). The junkyard Duramax's I've seen listed are running like $4k to $6k or more (from what I've seen). That doesn't include the trans, axles, brakes, or any of the other stuff that you'd want to upgrade from 1940's technology.
Maybe a light truck diesel is the best choice. But if it were my project I would prefer not to just jump to that conclusion, but to reach it after thinking about my options. That's the only thing I'm really suggesting.
'Dreamin'
Last edited by 'JustDreamin'; 08-04-2005 at 02:23 PM.
08-04-2005, 02:21 PM
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you make an excellent point dreamin, but this will be towing my car(2002 camaro) and an enclosed 24-30ft trailer later on down the road. where can i find out info on the heavier duty diesels
08-04-2005, 02:25 PM
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Depends upon how heavy you wanna go. Look at International and some of the other medium duty manufacturers. Not that you'll be buying the whole truck, but you'll get an idea of what their capacities are.
I think alot of people with RV's are going towards dedicated "Toter's" like small Freightliners and such. They're finding that 1 ton and 450 series trucks aren't quite heavy enough for some of the heavy 5th wheel trailers. Personally I prefer to have more truck than not enough.
'Dreamin'
I think alot of people with RV's are going towards dedicated "Toter's" like small Freightliners and such. They're finding that 1 ton and 450 series trucks aren't quite heavy enough for some of the heavy 5th wheel trailers. Personally I prefer to have more truck than not enough.
'Dreamin'
