Jeep wrangler ls1 swap blog, check out my progress
04-09-2007, 10:27 AM
#61
I'm out of town right now but I'll see if I can find some numbers on this computer but the way it was explained to me was that the E-2000 will pressurize the fuel system to high ##'s but the sustained flow rate is at question. Someone from another board dynoed the e-2000 vs the walbro. I don't remember the exact numbers but the he and others determined the walbro flowed better at a more consistant pressure.
Well, I could not find the e-2000 Specs here but I'll quote something from APE that all might find useful.
I want to say the e-2000 is a 190 ltr/hr pump but again, I need to find the numbers to back it up.
Hope this is useful. As for me, the 225 ltr/hr walbro pump is about the same price as the e-2000.
Scott
Well, I could not find the e-2000 Specs here but I'll quote something from APE that all might find useful.
Let's use the formula that says
horsepower (HP) = lb/hr (fuel) / BSFC
If we assume BSFC of .5, then HP = 2 * lb/hr. Then, if we round the weight of a pound of fuel to 6 pounds HP = 12 * gal/hr. So, if we assume .5 BSFC, then you can actually multiply the numbers in the flow charts by 12 to compute supported horsepower.
For example, If you look up the flow rate of the 190 ltr/hr pump in the Technical section, you will see that it will push 36 gal/hr at 50 psi with a 12 VDC power source. If your engine is pumping out 500 hp when the fuel pressure is 50 psi [@ 12VDC], you probably won't want to use the 190 ltr/hr pump [36 * 12 = 432].
Remember, that forced-induction engines typically raise the fuel pressure under boost. Be sure to take into account that you will have a higher-than-base fuel pressure under boost.
horsepower (HP) = lb/hr (fuel) / BSFC
If we assume BSFC of .5, then HP = 2 * lb/hr. Then, if we round the weight of a pound of fuel to 6 pounds HP = 12 * gal/hr. So, if we assume .5 BSFC, then you can actually multiply the numbers in the flow charts by 12 to compute supported horsepower.
For example, If you look up the flow rate of the 190 ltr/hr pump in the Technical section, you will see that it will push 36 gal/hr at 50 psi with a 12 VDC power source. If your engine is pumping out 500 hp when the fuel pressure is 50 psi [@ 12VDC], you probably won't want to use the 190 ltr/hr pump [36 * 12 = 432].
Remember, that forced-induction engines typically raise the fuel pressure under boost. Be sure to take into account that you will have a higher-than-base fuel pressure under boost.
I want to say the e-2000 is a 190 ltr/hr pump but again, I need to find the numbers to back it up.
Hope this is useful. As for me, the 225 ltr/hr walbro pump is about the same price as the e-2000.
Scott
04-09-2007, 02:13 PM
#62
is the 225 ltr/hr walbro an external pump? if its internal does it fit in the jeeps tank or do you have to make it fit some how
man Novak adapters is starting to **** me off, still no word back from their customer service, i ordered this adapter almost a month ago. i dont know if i should just cancel the order and go with advance adapter, or just wait....
this is pathetic because i could have already been driving it around with the ls1 in it if it wasnt for this damn adapter company
man Novak adapters is starting to **** me off, still no word back from their customer service, i ordered this adapter almost a month ago. i dont know if i should just cancel the order and go with advance adapter, or just wait....
this is pathetic because i could have already been driving it around with the ls1 in it if it wasnt for this damn adapter company
04-09-2007, 03:06 PM
#63
Staging Lane
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 50
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by TXjeepTJ
is the 225 ltr/hr walbro an external pump? if its internal does it fit in the jeeps tank or do you have to make it fit some how
man Novak adapters is starting to **** me off, still no word back from their customer service, i ordered this adapter almost a month ago. i dont know if i should just cancel the order and go with advance adapter, or just wait....
this is pathetic because i could have already been driving it around with the ls1 in it if it wasnt for this damn adapter company
man Novak adapters is starting to **** me off, still no word back from their customer service, i ordered this adapter almost a month ago. i dont know if i should just cancel the order and go with advance adapter, or just wait....
this is pathetic because i could have already been driving it around with the ls1 in it if it wasnt for this damn adapter company
im fixin to call them and advanced. ill let you know what they say.
wanna see if we can get a "deal" on these? maybe save a couple of bucks?
any one else interested in these adapters?
steve
04-09-2007, 03:18 PM
#64
The walbro can be used either way. Go the link above for ape to get the part numbers.
I put a e-2000 in the tank of a cj with very little hassle. You can do the same. It did leak a little at the seal where the wires for the pump went through the tank, but I could deal with it without problems (after a full day of wheeling, the tank was only damp). The fuel cell is another story. I have had hell getting it to seal properly. That's why I've gone back to the external pump. Plus, I like the access to the pump.
I put a e-2000 in the tank of a cj with very little hassle. You can do the same. It did leak a little at the seal where the wires for the pump went through the tank, but I could deal with it without problems (after a full day of wheeling, the tank was only damp). The fuel cell is another story. I have had hell getting it to seal properly. That's why I've gone back to the external pump. Plus, I like the access to the pump.
04-09-2007, 03:28 PM
#65
Originally Posted by gremlinsteve
im fixin to call them and advanced. ill let you know what they say.
wanna see if we can get a "deal" on these? maybe save a couple of bucks?
any one else interested in these adapters?
steve
wanna see if we can get a "deal" on these? maybe save a couple of bucks?
any one else interested in these adapters?
steve
ya i was thinking the same thing about getting a deal on them, i have no idea what is taking forever. its not like alot of people are doing this swap
04-09-2007, 04:04 PM
#66
Staging Lane
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 50
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
advanced seemed like they had a better grip on a delivery date. 1-2 weeks tops they told me. they have most of the parts in stock except a single hard part and the motor mounts.
novak stated 3 weeks for delivery of the adapter for the 4l60e.
advanced stated they might be willing to work on a price deal. as is, 1296 out the door plus shipping for everything from them to include the radiator. kent stated they would do better in price than that tho.
let me know if you wanna go with advanced. im ready to place the order and will talk to kent a little about better pricing. but i need to know soon and what is wanted..
also, how many want in?
steve
novak stated 3 weeks for delivery of the adapter for the 4l60e.
advanced stated they might be willing to work on a price deal. as is, 1296 out the door plus shipping for everything from them to include the radiator. kent stated they would do better in price than that tho.
let me know if you wanna go with advanced. im ready to place the order and will talk to kent a little about better pricing. but i need to know soon and what is wanted..
also, how many want in?
steve
04-09-2007, 04:43 PM
#67
Originally Posted by gremlinsteve
advanced seemed like they had a better grip on a delivery date. 1-2 weeks tops they told me. they have most of the parts in stock except a single hard part and the motor mounts.
novak stated 3 weeks for delivery of the adapter for the 4l60e.
advanced stated they might be willing to work on a price deal. as is, 1296 out the door plus shipping for everything from inclthem to ude the radiator. kent stated they would do better in price than that tho.
let me know if you wanna go with advanced. im ready to place the order and will talk to kent a little about better pricing. but i need to know soon and what is wanted..
also, how many want in?
steve
novak stated 3 weeks for delivery of the adapter for the 4l60e.
advanced stated they might be willing to work on a price deal. as is, 1296 out the door plus shipping for everything from inclthem to ude the radiator. kent stated they would do better in price than that tho.
let me know if you wanna go with advanced. im ready to place the order and will talk to kent a little about better pricing. but i need to know soon and what is wanted..
also, how many want in?
steve
i know the 4l60e to np231 adapter from advanced is only like 8bucks more than novak's, i dont know how much the mount is for the adapter though
so advance adapter will give us all a good deal if a few of us ditch novak?
04-10-2007, 12:07 AM
#68
I finally got an email back from Novak, this is what he said..i still never got an answer as to when my adapters would be shipped out.
"Scott,
The reason that it takes so long is that it takes a lot of time to go
through all the heat treating processes for the different parts, some of the
parts are outsourced (the VSS for instance)so we are at the mercy of our
suppliers and we have to wait for the castings to be made and shipped to us
before machining can begin. Once machining does begin, we do production
runs, say 15 of each specific part, that way there is less setup time in
programming the machines for the different parts, so if the specific part
falls at the end of a production run it may take longer to get than if it is
in the start of the production run. I suppose we could cut corners but that
is not what makes us the best. We would rather make our customers wait,
possibly losing sales, than to sell inferior products. Demand for these is
extremely high, as the wait proves. We are always looking for ways to speed
up the processes and keep our costs low. Hopefully you do understand our
position and will remain patient. Believe me we want to make our customers
happy so they will be return customers. If you have any other questions
please let me know.
Thanks,
Brian at Novak"
"Scott,
The reason that it takes so long is that it takes a lot of time to go
through all the heat treating processes for the different parts, some of the
parts are outsourced (the VSS for instance)so we are at the mercy of our
suppliers and we have to wait for the castings to be made and shipped to us
before machining can begin. Once machining does begin, we do production
runs, say 15 of each specific part, that way there is less setup time in
programming the machines for the different parts, so if the specific part
falls at the end of a production run it may take longer to get than if it is
in the start of the production run. I suppose we could cut corners but that
is not what makes us the best. We would rather make our customers wait,
possibly losing sales, than to sell inferior products. Demand for these is
extremely high, as the wait proves. We are always looking for ways to speed
up the processes and keep our costs low. Hopefully you do understand our
position and will remain patient. Believe me we want to make our customers
happy so they will be return customers. If you have any other questions
please let me know.
Thanks,
Brian at Novak"
04-10-2007, 12:18 AM
#70
Staging Lane
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 50
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
yea, they said at least 3 weeks. they where hoping to have the stuff in in two weeks and shipped the third.
advanced said 1.5 weeks tops 2, they have most of the parts for the kit, one item, a ring or gear of some sort, im not what yet, is being made. once there done, there kits are ready to go.
his parting words where he would work on a price. ill call back tomorrow and chat with him, but if your already ordered from novak and paid up, are you sure you wanna drop that order. i guess if 1.5 weeks goes by and advanced does not deliver, then you can reorder from novak.
steve
advanced said 1.5 weeks tops 2, they have most of the parts for the kit, one item, a ring or gear of some sort, im not what yet, is being made. once there done, there kits are ready to go.
his parting words where he would work on a price. ill call back tomorrow and chat with him, but if your already ordered from novak and paid up, are you sure you wanna drop that order. i guess if 1.5 weeks goes by and advanced does not deliver, then you can reorder from novak.
steve
04-10-2007, 07:03 AM
#71
On The Tree
iTrader: (5)
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Texarkana Tx
Posts: 132
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Pick01 and any other guys looking to run a Dana 300 behind a 4L60e, its going to be a TIGHT TIGHT fit for the front driveshaft. Guys have been having to use 2 piece driveshafts to avoid a trainwreck with the transmission pan. Seems like if you flip it and use drivers drop axles theres more room on that side.
Another note, make sure you offset the motor/tranny about an inch or so to the opposite side of the front driveline. It'll help make room!
Kyle
Another note, make sure you offset the motor/tranny about an inch or so to the opposite side of the front driveline. It'll help make room!
Kyle
04-10-2007, 07:07 AM
#72
Teching In
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 27
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
TXjeepTJ- Novak told me the same thing two months ago when I first placed a order with them. I then cancel a part of my order with them. The rest of my order with Novak was shipped very fast. My dad had the same problem with advance adapter last summer. The problem then was heat treating the new output shaft. Which seem to take forever.
When I placed the order with advance adapter is was delivered in 5 days.
When I placed the order with advance adapter is was delivered in 5 days.
04-10-2007, 07:45 AM
#73
I've waited over 4 weeks for an adapter from Advance for the 4L80E/atlas. Nearly 8 weeks for that atlas II 4 speed. I was told two weeks for the adapter and 6 weeks for the TC.
At this time of the year, it seems to always take long to get stuff in.
At this time of the year, it seems to always take long to get stuff in.
04-10-2007, 11:37 AM
#75
Teching In
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 15
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This guy is selling a Novak 4l60e to D300 adapter. Its not a complete kit but it has the main parts.
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showt...ighlight=4l60e
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showt...ighlight=4l60e
04-10-2007, 04:47 PM
#76
On The Tree
iTrader: (5)
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Texarkana Tx
Posts: 132
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Why not do some searching for a factory 4L60E to 231 adaptor? They came behind the later model S10s and shouldnt be that hard to find. that and a 4wd output shaft in the tranny and you would come out much cheaper than AA or Novak?
04-10-2007, 11:36 PM
#77
Novak just emailed me saying that im #6 on the waiting list and that i would be part of the 1st ship out of adapters, soo they said they should be getting the adapters from their suppliers in a week. as of now, im just going to get the trans on the engine and permanently mount it and get it running even if i dont have the transfer case on
04-11-2007, 03:18 PM
#79
Teching In
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 27
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
FYI- If you get the a adapter from advance adapter you will need to shorten the front driveshaft. I was aligning the engine/ transmission onto the skid plate and notice that the front drive shaft was about two inches too long. I tried to slide the transmission back but no luck. I'm not sure if you will have the same results with Novak.
04-11-2007, 08:56 PM
#80
Originally Posted by bacressey
FYI- If you get the a adapter from advance adapter you will need to shorten the front driveshaft. I was aligning the engine/ transmission onto the skid plate and notice that the front drive shaft was about two inches too long. I tried to slide the transmission back but no luck. I'm not sure if you will have the same results with Novak.
doesnt that just depend on where you want the engine?