Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants...
12-19-2002, 08:47 AM
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Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants... I think we're to the point of actually starting to plan/discuss/debate some stuff for this idea that is rapidly taking shape. At this time, this is what I see.
What: An ET shootout between the quickest of the 'internally-stock' M6 LS1 F-body's, the quickest of the 'internally-stock' A4 LS1 F-body's, and the quickest of the 'internally-stock' DOHC 4.6 Cobra's.
When: May 31st, 2003
Where: Bowling Green, KY during the "North vs South 2003 Shootout"
Why: For the hell of it! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />
How: Invite only, and with the consent of those of us that are putting this together. In order to keep out any potential "cheaters", I suggest that we all agree on who can and who cannot compete. I think most folks that are on ya'lls list are probably good to go. I know of 2 or 3 other DOHC guys that might want to show up, and I'll vouch for their legality. That said, we will need to carefully police ourselves. That shouldn't be a big issue, as we all want to be "top dogs", even amongst ourselves. I trust the top guys on the LS1 side to keep out potential cheaters, and ask that you trust me to do the same on the Mustang side.
This will allow us to confidently run the best of the M6 LS1's, the best of the A4 LS1's, and the best of the 4.6's. Little more than bragging rights to the winner, but hey, if we did this for a living, we'd all be broke.
Rules: Some of this will need to be discussed/debated. The basic rules are simple....naturally-aspirated, bolt-ons only.
Engine: Must be N/A, no internal engine modifications allowed - no exceptions. No overbores, no valve jobs, no aftermarket springs, no aftermarket push-rods, no nothing. 'Bolt-ons' only. For the purpose of this race, a 'bolt-on' modification is defined as anything that does not touch engine oil - at all.
Transmission: OD transmission required - and OD must be functional. T56/T45/T5/T3550 all acceptable. Any street-type, single-disc, non-adjustable clutch acceptable. For A4's, any torque converter allowed, shift kits allowed.
Drivetrain: Any rear end and any gear allowed.
Tires: No restrictions.
Chassis: Stock-type chassis required. Common bolt-ons allowed, including aftermarket control arms, torque arms, panhards, shocks/struts, subframe connectors, rollbars, etc. Tubular front end pieces allowed. Front coil-overs allowed. Rear coil-overs prohibited.
Rear-mounted battery allowed.
Exterior: Stock appearing. May use lightweight hood, but other pieces must be as-delivered, including stock safety glass.
***MAJOR DEBATE ITEMS****
Bumper supports must be in the car.
Exhaust: Any exhaust allowed, but it must run through the mufflers. If the majority of the group would rather, we can allow open exhaust. Up for discussion, and I don't have a hardon for either way.
Interior: Full interior required. No exposed sheet metal. All plastic panels must be in place. Any front seats allowed. Back seat can be removed, but area must be carpeted (see weight paragraph below for alternative).
Accessories: Must have functional lights, turn signals, horn, etc. Must have functioning heater. P/S required. A/C system required, but does not have to be functional (see weight paragraph below for alternative).
Weight: No minimum weight. The car simply has to have the items described above. However, if the group would like to agree on a minimum weight, and we can confirm that Bowling Green will have its scales operating (big issue), we could probably dump some or all of the above restrictions and work out a minimum weight.
Race Format: This is an ET race. He/she with the best ET of the day, wins. Conversely, would could try and run some sort of shootout. However, as this is a race to see who has the fastest bolt-on car, I believe it should be kept to ET. The racing can be done in one of the various classes in the regular shootout (for example, I'll enter the brackets).
That's what I've come up with. Let's discuss, debate, decide, and then get it on!
<img border="0" alt="[Fluffy]" title="" src="graemlins/fluffy.gif" />
What: An ET shootout between the quickest of the 'internally-stock' M6 LS1 F-body's, the quickest of the 'internally-stock' A4 LS1 F-body's, and the quickest of the 'internally-stock' DOHC 4.6 Cobra's.
When: May 31st, 2003
Where: Bowling Green, KY during the "North vs South 2003 Shootout"
Why: For the hell of it! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />
How: Invite only, and with the consent of those of us that are putting this together. In order to keep out any potential "cheaters", I suggest that we all agree on who can and who cannot compete. I think most folks that are on ya'lls list are probably good to go. I know of 2 or 3 other DOHC guys that might want to show up, and I'll vouch for their legality. That said, we will need to carefully police ourselves. That shouldn't be a big issue, as we all want to be "top dogs", even amongst ourselves. I trust the top guys on the LS1 side to keep out potential cheaters, and ask that you trust me to do the same on the Mustang side.
This will allow us to confidently run the best of the M6 LS1's, the best of the A4 LS1's, and the best of the 4.6's. Little more than bragging rights to the winner, but hey, if we did this for a living, we'd all be broke.
Rules: Some of this will need to be discussed/debated. The basic rules are simple....naturally-aspirated, bolt-ons only.
Engine: Must be N/A, no internal engine modifications allowed - no exceptions. No overbores, no valve jobs, no aftermarket springs, no aftermarket push-rods, no nothing. 'Bolt-ons' only. For the purpose of this race, a 'bolt-on' modification is defined as anything that does not touch engine oil - at all.
Transmission: OD transmission required - and OD must be functional. T56/T45/T5/T3550 all acceptable. Any street-type, single-disc, non-adjustable clutch acceptable. For A4's, any torque converter allowed, shift kits allowed.
Drivetrain: Any rear end and any gear allowed.
Tires: No restrictions.
Chassis: Stock-type chassis required. Common bolt-ons allowed, including aftermarket control arms, torque arms, panhards, shocks/struts, subframe connectors, rollbars, etc. Tubular front end pieces allowed. Front coil-overs allowed. Rear coil-overs prohibited.
Rear-mounted battery allowed.
Exterior: Stock appearing. May use lightweight hood, but other pieces must be as-delivered, including stock safety glass.
***MAJOR DEBATE ITEMS****
Bumper supports must be in the car.
Exhaust: Any exhaust allowed, but it must run through the mufflers. If the majority of the group would rather, we can allow open exhaust. Up for discussion, and I don't have a hardon for either way.
Interior: Full interior required. No exposed sheet metal. All plastic panels must be in place. Any front seats allowed. Back seat can be removed, but area must be carpeted (see weight paragraph below for alternative).
Accessories: Must have functional lights, turn signals, horn, etc. Must have functioning heater. P/S required. A/C system required, but does not have to be functional (see weight paragraph below for alternative).
Weight: No minimum weight. The car simply has to have the items described above. However, if the group would like to agree on a minimum weight, and we can confirm that Bowling Green will have its scales operating (big issue), we could probably dump some or all of the above restrictions and work out a minimum weight.
Race Format: This is an ET race. He/she with the best ET of the day, wins. Conversely, would could try and run some sort of shootout. However, as this is a race to see who has the fastest bolt-on car, I believe it should be kept to ET. The racing can be done in one of the various classes in the regular shootout (for example, I'll enter the brackets).
That's what I've come up with. Let's discuss, debate, decide, and then get it on!
<img border="0" alt="[Fluffy]" title="" src="graemlins/fluffy.gif" />
12-19-2002, 09:15 AM
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Re: Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants... I hope this comes together Bob! I've been pretty entertained watching this all go down. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
Good luck making it float!
Good luck making it float!
12-19-2002, 09:25 AM
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Re: Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants... You must make the cars weight the same. Thats my 2 cents. Makes us 3500lbs, thats easy.
Jason D
I'm in, 11.86 115mph 3390lbs never had the valve covers off. <img border="0" alt="[Burnout]" title="" src="graemlins/burnout.gif" />
Jason D
I'm in, 11.86 115mph 3390lbs never had the valve covers off. <img border="0" alt="[Burnout]" title="" src="graemlins/burnout.gif" />
12-19-2002, 09:38 AM
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Re: Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants... Wow Bob, you should set up a big event <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="gr_tounge.gif" />
Just an opinion here, but I wouldn't change anything you have listed. That all seems fair to me. I especially like the fact that any tires are permitted. Most people think bolt-on cars belong on drag radials <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />
Also, a question to you and all these 11.6 and quicker stock internal LS1 guys; the times you have on the list, where those times run in ideal conditions, (i.e. good track prep, good DA, ect)?
TIA
Lynda
Just an opinion here, but I wouldn't change anything you have listed. That all seems fair to me. I especially like the fact that any tires are permitted. Most people think bolt-on cars belong on drag radials <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />
Also, a question to you and all these 11.6 and quicker stock internal LS1 guys; the times you have on the list, where those times run in ideal conditions, (i.e. good track prep, good DA, ect)?
TIA
Lynda
12-19-2002, 09:50 AM
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Re: Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants... Curt...your car is not eligible. Sorry. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />
Jason...3500 is almost unattainable for me, and likely won't be viewed well from some of the other guys, but I'm open to whatever. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> I would say that one issue will be the scales at BG. They HAVE to be open, and we will have to have someone at them recording weights after each run.
Lynda...I've put together a few races in the past (some might remember CyberBrawl 2000 at BG, several Corral Day events, and I am the race director for the Ford Modular Shootout), so I have a bit of experience.
I can do drag radials, but the more restrictions you put on a class, the harder it is to police.
As for the question about air...my 11.67 was run with a DA of ~ +200 ft. The track was very good.
Jason...3500 is almost unattainable for me, and likely won't be viewed well from some of the other guys, but I'm open to whatever. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> I would say that one issue will be the scales at BG. They HAVE to be open, and we will have to have someone at them recording weights after each run.
Lynda...I've put together a few races in the past (some might remember CyberBrawl 2000 at BG, several Corral Day events, and I am the race director for the Ford Modular Shootout), so I have a bit of experience.
I can do drag radials, but the more restrictions you put on a class, the harder it is to police.
As for the question about air...my 11.67 was run with a DA of ~ +200 ft. The track was very good.
12-19-2002, 10:03 AM
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Re: Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants... </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> However, if the group would like to agree on a minimum weight, and we can confirm that Bowling Green will have its scales operating (big issue), we could probably dump some or all of the above restrictions and work out a minimum weight. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Looking at the Stock Internal list, 50% of the people on the list have their cars at 33xx lbs and lighter, and then many of the other cars are not far behind with a 34xx lb car. Just something to think about if you decide to have a set race weight.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I can do drag radials, but the more restrictions you put on a class, the harder it is to police. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> I especially like the fact that any tires are permitted </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"><img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I can do drag radials, but the more restrictions you put on a class, the harder it is to police. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> I especially like the fact that any tires are permitted </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"><img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />
12-19-2002, 10:19 AM
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Re: Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants... I said 3500 because thats what Thunder did, its easyer to add then take out for most, I'm fine with what ever weight as long as we come up with one! I went 11.86 @ DA +450, but I have more, lets do this!
Jason D. <img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_cheers.gif" />
Jason D. <img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_cheers.gif" />
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12-19-2002, 11:35 AM
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Re: Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants... Well, I'll be honest, I'd prefer not to have a set weight, and instead, go with the other requirements. But again, as we get more input from the main players, we'll figure all that out.
[best excuses mode]You guys should give me SOME kind of break - I'm 40 or more HP down to most of ya'll![/best excuses mode]
<img border="0" alt="[whiner]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_cry.gif" />
[best excuses mode]You guys should give me SOME kind of break - I'm 40 or more HP down to most of ya'll![/best excuses mode]
<img border="0" alt="[whiner]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_cry.gif" />
12-19-2002, 11:59 AM
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Re: Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants... That's a long ways away, but if it happens, I'd HAVE to be there! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> I don't really care about the weight, since my car's a pig compared to the other cars on the SI list.
Especially, if Jason goes <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> . Mike(V6bird) would then have to go, then JS12 I'm sure - kind of a snowball affect. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
My runs were made in 800+ DA.
Especially, if Jason goes <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> . Mike(V6bird) would then have to go, then JS12 I'm sure - kind of a snowball affect. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
My runs were made in 800+ DA.
12-19-2002, 03:26 PM
#10
Re: Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants... I will not put my bumper supports back in nor my AC.
Another thing is cages.(I will have one)so I will be heavier.
As it sits-3090
cage 60?
carpet 15
pass seat 32ish
That puts me about 3200#(I can also make the rest up in fuel)
Drag radials are out-I run on slicks
My run was made at +1600 DA, track prep was decent
Another thing is cages.(I will have one)so I will be heavier.
As it sits-3090
cage 60?
carpet 15
pass seat 32ish
That puts me about 3200#(I can also make the rest up in fuel)
Drag radials are out-I run on slicks
My run was made at +1600 DA, track prep was decent
12-19-2002, 03:52 PM
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Re: Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants... What about if I want to run my 4600 LIGHTNING is there going to be a truck class since I no longer have my stripped down SS <img border="0" alt="[jester]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_jest.gif" />
12-19-2002, 03:58 PM
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Re: Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants... Guys...I really don't want to come off as being harsh, but if everybody says "I want come if blah blah blah", then nobody is going to come.
Please...more input.
Please...more input.
12-19-2002, 06:29 PM
#13
Re: Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants... Bob-I don't really care about interior stuff.
I just told you the things I'm not going to do. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
I would like to run 'as it sits' only with a cage.
But whatever,I am EXTREMELY amped about running all you guys.
THAT'S what I like,that intense feeling in my stomache.
Winning is nice,but it's the 'rush' That I dig.
I will be there,regardless.
Taking all comers. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
I just told you the things I'm not going to do. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
I would like to run 'as it sits' only with a cage.
But whatever,I am EXTREMELY amped about running all you guys.
THAT'S what I like,that intense feeling in my stomache.
Winning is nice,but it's the 'rush' That I dig.
I will be there,regardless.
Taking all comers. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />
12-19-2002, 06:41 PM
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Re: Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants... Seeing this post made me so happy, I just wanted to cry. I guess what we needed was someone who is taken seriously on the board (like Bob) to step up and post the rules. Brilliant. Now, then. Going on the assumption that I'll be one of the ones that is allowed to play, here are my thoughts, as worthless as they may be. And if you have any problems with my thoughts, talk to Bob because he asked for them. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
Engine: Agree hands-down.
Transmission: Agree except for maybe one small thing. What about twin-disk street clutches (i.e. McLeod)? Not that I have one or would ever get one, but I was just wondering.
Drivetrain, tires, chassis, exterior: No problems.
Bumper supports: Questionable. See paragraph "Weight minimum or not" below.
Exhaust: Bob, in case you didn't know, the coolest thing for LS1 guys to do nowadays is get true-dual exhaust and dump it before the rear axles. I have done this, and do use two mufflers, but I guess as long as there's no problem with the exhaust exiting before the rear wheels, I have no problems.
Interior, accessories, weight: See paragraph "Weight minimum or not" below.
Weight minimum or not: Bob, I gotta vote for a weight minimum here. I agree that this should not become a race to see who can remove the most off their car. It will also allow people that have removed their power steering, A/C, etc. to run, as long as they meet the looks and weight requirement. I'd say to make it 3200 or 3300. 3200 is gonna be real hard for me to get with no interior pieces removed. How about a 100-lb. break for you since you have 65 less cubes? Just an idea. Maybe make your minimum 3200 and ours 3300 or something. I don't know. Also does "P/S required" mean you can't run a short belt and bypass it? And is BG an IHRA or NHRA track?
Engine: Agree hands-down.
Transmission: Agree except for maybe one small thing. What about twin-disk street clutches (i.e. McLeod)? Not that I have one or would ever get one, but I was just wondering.
Drivetrain, tires, chassis, exterior: No problems.
Bumper supports: Questionable. See paragraph "Weight minimum or not" below.
Exhaust: Bob, in case you didn't know, the coolest thing for LS1 guys to do nowadays is get true-dual exhaust and dump it before the rear axles. I have done this, and do use two mufflers, but I guess as long as there's no problem with the exhaust exiting before the rear wheels, I have no problems.
Interior, accessories, weight: See paragraph "Weight minimum or not" below.
Weight minimum or not: Bob, I gotta vote for a weight minimum here. I agree that this should not become a race to see who can remove the most off their car. It will also allow people that have removed their power steering, A/C, etc. to run, as long as they meet the looks and weight requirement. I'd say to make it 3200 or 3300. 3200 is gonna be real hard for me to get with no interior pieces removed. How about a 100-lb. break for you since you have 65 less cubes? Just an idea. Maybe make your minimum 3200 and ours 3300 or something. I don't know. Also does "P/S required" mean you can't run a short belt and bypass it? And is BG an IHRA or NHRA track?
12-19-2002, 07:01 PM
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Re: Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants... I am pretty sure i will be going to the north vs. south shoot out, I would run in the bolt on class and all the rules seem fine for me except the unlimited tire rule. b/c not many 10 bolt people are going to want to run slicks on the back.
12-19-2002, 07:03 PM
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Re: Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants... While I'd love to have a weight break, I would rather us all be on as equal footing as possible. That way there can be no excuses when I whoop your butt. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />
Probably not a big deal for the twin disc McCleod. Besides that, a clutch is a hard thing to tech.
No problem in my book on the exhaust you talked about. In fact, I don't mind open exhaust, so long as everybody agree's with it.
Based on what you guys are saying, how about this for weight removal issues...and remember...this is just a suggestion that can be modified, dumped, whatever.
If you run an interior as described in my original post, and you have the accessories mentioned above (P/S, A/C, bumper supports), then there is no weight restriction. Keep in mind that you must have carpet, 2 front seats, all the plastic panels, etc.
If you do not meet one of the above requirements, then the minimum weight is 3200 lbs.
Thoughts? Revisions? Pack sand?
Probably not a big deal for the twin disc McCleod. Besides that, a clutch is a hard thing to tech.
No problem in my book on the exhaust you talked about. In fact, I don't mind open exhaust, so long as everybody agree's with it.
Based on what you guys are saying, how about this for weight removal issues...and remember...this is just a suggestion that can be modified, dumped, whatever.
If you run an interior as described in my original post, and you have the accessories mentioned above (P/S, A/C, bumper supports), then there is no weight restriction. Keep in mind that you must have carpet, 2 front seats, all the plastic panels, etc.
If you do not meet one of the above requirements, then the minimum weight is 3200 lbs.
Thoughts? Revisions? Pack sand?
12-19-2002, 07:05 PM
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Re: Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants... IMHO, I think tires should be unlimited. I am quite experienced with running on DR's, and that wouldn't bother me, but I think folks should be allowed to step up to the best possible traction.
12-19-2002, 07:34 PM
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Re: Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants... </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Bob Cosby:
<strong>While I'd love to have a weight break, I would rather us all be on as equal footing as possible. That way there can be no excuses when I whoop your butt. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Understood. We'll keep it even then. It'll be just that much more amazing if you do whoop us all.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"><strong>Probably not a big deal for the twin disc McCleod. Besides that, a clutch is a hard thing to tech.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Yeah, I mean, it's a street clutch, but anyway...not really an issue.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"><strong>No problem in my book on the exhaust you talked about. In fact, I don't mind open exhaust, so long as everybody agree's with it.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I don't really care either, so I would say unless someone protests, we should allow any exhaust.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"><strong>Based on what you guys are saying, how about this for weight removal issues...and remember...this is just a suggestion that can be modified, dumped, whatever.
If you run an interior as described in my original post, and you have the accessories mentioned above (P/S, A/C, bumper supports), then there is no weight restriction. Keep in mind that you must have carpet, 2 front seats, all the plastic panels, etc.
If you do not meet one of the above requirements, then the minimum weight is 3200 lbs.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">It sounds an awful lot like you may have your raceweight under 3200 with all the interior and mentioned accessories. I don't think that's possible in an LS1 car. How about we enforce the photo-friendly rule (interior carpeted and panelled, etc.) and remove the accessories rule. That way people can take out what they want and leave in what they want. You couldn't live with an across-the-board 3200-lb. minimum? I just think that would level the field quite nicely. Don't worry, we'll reach an agreement eventually. We're just discussing right now. Just throwing ideas around.
<strong>While I'd love to have a weight break, I would rather us all be on as equal footing as possible. That way there can be no excuses when I whoop your butt. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Understood. We'll keep it even then. It'll be just that much more amazing if you do whoop us all.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"><strong>Probably not a big deal for the twin disc McCleod. Besides that, a clutch is a hard thing to tech.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Yeah, I mean, it's a street clutch, but anyway...not really an issue.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"><strong>No problem in my book on the exhaust you talked about. In fact, I don't mind open exhaust, so long as everybody agree's with it.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I don't really care either, so I would say unless someone protests, we should allow any exhaust.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"><strong>Based on what you guys are saying, how about this for weight removal issues...and remember...this is just a suggestion that can be modified, dumped, whatever.
If you run an interior as described in my original post, and you have the accessories mentioned above (P/S, A/C, bumper supports), then there is no weight restriction. Keep in mind that you must have carpet, 2 front seats, all the plastic panels, etc.
If you do not meet one of the above requirements, then the minimum weight is 3200 lbs.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">It sounds an awful lot like you may have your raceweight under 3200 with all the interior and mentioned accessories. I don't think that's possible in an LS1 car. How about we enforce the photo-friendly rule (interior carpeted and panelled, etc.) and remove the accessories rule. That way people can take out what they want and leave in what they want. You couldn't live with an across-the-board 3200-lb. minimum? I just think that would level the field quite nicely. Don't worry, we'll reach an agreement eventually. We're just discussing right now. Just throwing ideas around.
12-19-2002, 07:37 PM
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Re: Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants... </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Bob Cosby:
<strong>IMHO, I think tires should be unlimited. I am quite experienced with running on DR's, and that wouldn't bother me, but I think folks should be allowed to step up to the best possible traction.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Definitely.
<strong>IMHO, I think tires should be unlimited. I am quite experienced with running on DR's, and that wouldn't bother me, but I think folks should be allowed to step up to the best possible traction.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Definitely.
12-19-2002, 07:45 PM
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Re: Attn: Potential "Bolt-on" Shootout Participants... Bob, how about the P/S bypass via short belts?
Does BG have an IHRA or NHRA track?
Also, those of us that can't compete in any of the classes outlined for the N/S shootout and thus, must run brackets, what do we do if we get eliminated in the first round or something? Can we use our time trial runs in the bolt-on shootout?
Does BG have an IHRA or NHRA track?
Also, those of us that can't compete in any of the classes outlined for the N/S shootout and thus, must run brackets, what do we do if we get eliminated in the first round or something? Can we use our time trial runs in the bolt-on shootout?