Stalled A4 vs. M6
06-02-2006, 02:20 AM
#1
Stalled A4 vs. M6 I've heard so many different things on this issue, and I wanted to get some opinions from 'tech. My car did the numbers in the sig (392/373) and I also have a 3500 stall and 3.23's. Im kinda bummed it didnt break 400, but the cut out was closed, and not really the point to my thread. So when people realize I'm a lil down about not hitting 400 they tell me that with a stall I should be able to take those with 400-430 (the various numbers I've been told by seperate people) to the wheels in M6's. How much truth is there to this? How much more can an M6 have to the wheels than me, and me still be able to come on top? Now I dont really bench race, and this isnt me trying to figure out if I can take some specific vehicle I'm about to race. I'd just like to know that my car can be equally as fast as a 4XX RWHP M6, someone fill in those X's please!!
06-02-2006, 04:15 AM
#2
TECH Fanatic
This is sure to be the stick that hit the hornet's nest, but here we go. Almost every ls-1 f-body with a manual transmission is capable of a 12 second run due to their ability to put more hp to the ground then auto's. This is due to the amount of slippage that all automatic transmission's have.
The issue with m-6 car's is the skill of the driver. To get the best time's with the m-6 mean's lot's of practice, and most driver's that I have seen are not willing to really push their car to the limit. I said most, not all.
Getting a solid launch and rowing thru the gear's is not as easy as most people think.
To really be on the top of the game a good driver can slam thru the gear's without ever having to take his right foot off of the floor.
THAT'S the key.
If a driver dosn't hammer the car in practice he will never get good.
Seen quite a few manual ls-1's run in the low to mid 14's.
The only mod needed to put those into the 12's is the type of driver I described.
Auto's are a tad easier, but not foolproof.
You get the launch down, and let the computor take care of the shifting.
Long story short, yes, if you can get a good launch you can beat a manual car with considerably more horsepower IF the driver doesn't know how to shift.
O.K., got my flame suit on.
Let 'er rip guy's.
The issue with m-6 car's is the skill of the driver. To get the best time's with the m-6 mean's lot's of practice, and most driver's that I have seen are not willing to really push their car to the limit. I said most, not all.
Getting a solid launch and rowing thru the gear's is not as easy as most people think.
To really be on the top of the game a good driver can slam thru the gear's without ever having to take his right foot off of the floor.
THAT'S the key.
If a driver dosn't hammer the car in practice he will never get good.
Seen quite a few manual ls-1's run in the low to mid 14's.
The only mod needed to put those into the 12's is the type of driver I described.
Auto's are a tad easier, but not foolproof.
You get the launch down, and let the computor take care of the shifting.
Long story short, yes, if you can get a good launch you can beat a manual car with considerably more horsepower IF the driver doesn't know how to shift.
O.K., got my flame suit on.
Let 'er rip guy's.
06-02-2006, 11:19 AM
#4
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I'd seriously guess your car should be mid to low 11's easily. With a stalled car, the HP numbers start to mean less and less when you get hooked on track times. I run a 12.4 with a 1.70 60ft, so there is more to be had with slicks. the HP numbers in my sig. were before my converter went in. I'm almost scared to think how low they are now, but I'm not complaining cause i have the times to back up what the car can do. 390 is a lot from an auto with that size cam, so you can should be a monster if it can hook. So as for numbers, I'd say you should easily beat m6 cars with as much as 425-430 as long as you pull a decent launch. I will agree with dannyz and also say most drivers of m6 cars won't drive them to their FULL potential. Hope this helps
Jeremy
Jeremy
06-02-2006, 11:20 AM
#5
11 Second Club
you have pretty good numbers for an auto...are those numbers locked?...if you were 6 speed i would think you be putting down some where around 420
i say if you are racing a guy who does not know how to drive then he can have up to 420 and you should still win...thats if you get your launch down but its all reletive man
i know with my car putting down 392/383 through a 12 bolt and a 6speed with me driving it would give ya one hell of a run
its all about the launch with and auto but with a 6 speed its both launch and shifting
i drop my clutch at 6000 and i pull the wheels and im out
you also need alot more suspention work in a m6 car then a auto car
an auto car can put down mid 1.6s on a nitto and some practice on stock suspention...a m6 car cant do that...thats where you guys have the edge but if the m6 car actually has a good driver and suspention work...
btw i beat the **** out of my car everytime i drive it...
when my car was just a lid/catback/nitto car i was launchin at 4000 on nittos, shiftin at 6000 and getting 12.30s...i dont care if i break i just drive
i say if you are racing a guy who does not know how to drive then he can have up to 420 and you should still win...thats if you get your launch down but its all reletive man
i know with my car putting down 392/383 through a 12 bolt and a 6speed with me driving it would give ya one hell of a run
its all about the launch with and auto but with a 6 speed its both launch and shifting
i drop my clutch at 6000 and i pull the wheels and im out
you also need alot more suspention work in a m6 car then a auto car
an auto car can put down mid 1.6s on a nitto and some practice on stock suspention...a m6 car cant do that...thats where you guys have the edge but if the m6 car actually has a good driver and suspention work...
btw i beat the **** out of my car everytime i drive it...
when my car was just a lid/catback/nitto car i was launchin at 4000 on nittos, shiftin at 6000 and getting 12.30s...i dont care if i break i just drive
06-02-2006, 12:10 PM
#6
Originally Posted by jerflash
...i dont care if i break i just drive
EDIT: Those are locked numbers. Wish I would have opened the cut out though.
06-02-2006, 12:25 PM
#7
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I know this is a bit 
but I will ask since were pretty close. Ok so lets say You put two cars with exactly the same set-up, both cars make exactly the same HP/TQ. Both of them automatics. The only difference is the stall. For example car #1 has 3500 stall and car #2 has 4400 stall. Will the car #2 with 4400 stall show lower numbers on the dyno than car #1 with smaller stall ?
Thanks
but I will ask since were pretty close. Ok so lets say You put two cars with exactly the same set-up, both cars make exactly the same HP/TQ. Both of them automatics. The only difference is the stall. For example car #1 has 3500 stall and car #2 has 4400 stall. Will the car #2 with 4400 stall show lower numbers on the dyno than car #1 with smaller stall ?Thanks
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06-02-2006, 01:06 PM
#8
TECH Fanatic
Originally Posted by CRZYPWR
I know this is a bit but I will ask since were pretty close. Ok so lets say You put two cars with exactly the same set-up, both cars make exactly the same HP/TQ. Both of them automatics. The only difference is the stall. For example car #1 has 3500 stall and car #2 has 4400 stall. Will the car #2 with 4400 stall show lower numbers on the dyno than car #1 with smaller stall ?
Thanks
but I will ask since were pretty close. Ok so lets say You put two cars with exactly the same set-up, both cars make exactly the same HP/TQ. Both of them automatics. The only difference is the stall. For example car #1 has 3500 stall and car #2 has 4400 stall. Will the car #2 with 4400 stall show lower numbers on the dyno than car #1 with smaller stall ?Thanks
06-02-2006, 01:22 PM
#9
11 Second Club
thanks man...i have so much work in my suspention right now so i can actually hook on drag radials...im not a big fan of slicks so i built my car to go really fast on radials...granted im used the mt et Street radials and they work awesome...small tire also 255/50/16. like i said before im pullin the wheels on them so my suspention and tires have to be workin.
i ahve to get back to the track because last time out i had some bad hydrolic problems and the car would not shift into second after the hard launch but i let the car cool and granny shifted and lifted off the gas and still got a 11.9 so im hoping for mid 11s when i go back...thats without the 150 shot
you are an auto with a stall so you with have an easir time stickin on then i would on those tires and since your auto no need to upgrade to a 12 bolt either right now...buddy of mine is way in the 10s with a 10bolt haha but a 12 bolt will be needed if you do more to your car
what kinda tire is it?...if i were you i would get a set of 16s and put on some 245 nittos or even some 255 mt radials
i ahve to get back to the track because last time out i had some bad hydrolic problems and the car would not shift into second after the hard launch but i let the car cool and granny shifted and lifted off the gas and still got a 11.9 so im hoping for mid 11s when i go back...thats without the 150 shot
you are an auto with a stall so you with have an easir time stickin on then i would on those tires and since your auto no need to upgrade to a 12 bolt either right now...buddy of mine is way in the 10s with a 10bolt haha but a 12 bolt will be needed if you do more to your car
what kinda tire is it?...if i were you i would get a set of 16s and put on some 245 nittos or even some 255 mt radials
06-02-2006, 01:26 PM
#10
They are 275/40/17 555R's. I was going to get some old 16's and put some DR's on those, but a friend of mine still has his old SS wheels, so we split the cost of the Nittos and mounted em' on his wheels. What would you say is a realistic E/T with those tires?
06-02-2006, 01:44 PM
#11
11 Second Club
you could go mid 11s on those...the onlything is the shorter sidewall of the 17s compared to the 16s
my friend with 16" nittos did very low 11s on them in an auto/10 bolt camaro with heads and cam but i little more power then you got and he got 1.6 60fts
my friend with 16" nittos did very low 11s on them in an auto/10 bolt camaro with heads and cam but i little more power then you got and he got 1.6 60fts
06-03-2006, 09:18 AM
#15
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A stick car will always be faster (if the person can drive) if its the same power, proved it time and time again.
You can take a car making 380rwhp setup for drag racing with an automatic.
Take the same car put a stick in it ,its gonna make more power prolly 400 ish rwhp.
How can some one say an automatic will win there's more power being put to the ground its very easy to understand.
Here are some quick personal examples
1)
70 camaro 355 10.71 at 123 automatic set up on kill for drag racing 1.43 60 foot wheel's way in the air.
All I did was put a Jerico in it 10.48 at 128 mph 1.38 60 foot spinning while it was leaving never did hook it with the leaf springs.
2)
My Dad's 67 camaro 355 ci 11.05 at 119 with an automatic set up on kill.1.49 60 foot
Put a Jerico in it 10.61 at 125 with a 1.45 60 foot nothing else changed.
To answer the question of the thread ,no a car with 390 rwhp automatic will never beat a 420 rwhp m6 if the m6 driver can shift.Will never happen inless the m6 driver misses a gear
Just my 2 cents about the auto vs stick arguments
Like I always say take your automatic and STICK IT
You can take a car making 380rwhp setup for drag racing with an automatic.
Take the same car put a stick in it ,its gonna make more power prolly 400 ish rwhp.
How can some one say an automatic will win there's more power being put to the ground its very easy to understand.
Here are some quick personal examples
1)
70 camaro 355 10.71 at 123 automatic set up on kill for drag racing 1.43 60 foot wheel's way in the air.
All I did was put a Jerico in it 10.48 at 128 mph 1.38 60 foot spinning while it was leaving never did hook it with the leaf springs.
2)
My Dad's 67 camaro 355 ci 11.05 at 119 with an automatic set up on kill.1.49 60 foot
Put a Jerico in it 10.61 at 125 with a 1.45 60 foot nothing else changed.
To answer the question of the thread ,no a car with 390 rwhp automatic will never beat a 420 rwhp m6 if the m6 driver can shift.Will never happen inless the m6 driver misses a gear
Just my 2 cents about the auto vs stick arguments
Like I always say take your automatic and STICK IT
Last edited by TOSTO RACING; 06-03-2006 at 09:25 AM.
06-03-2006, 02:43 PM
#17
TECH Fanatic
Originally Posted by TOSTO RACING
A stick car will always be faster (if the person can drive) if its the same power, proved it time and time again.
You can take a car making 380rwhp setup for drag racing with an automatic.
Take the same car put a stick in it ,its gonna make more power prolly 400 ish rwhp.
How can some one say an automatic will win there's more power being put to the ground its very easy to understand.
Here are some quick personal examples
1)
70 camaro 355 10.71 at 123 automatic set up on kill for drag racing 1.43 60 foot wheel's way in the air.
All I did was put a Jerico in it 10.48 at 128 mph 1.38 60 foot spinning while it was leaving never did hook it with the leaf springs.
2)
My Dad's 67 camaro 355 ci 11.05 at 119 with an automatic set up on kill.1.49 60 foot
Put a Jerico in it 10.61 at 125 with a 1.45 60 foot nothing else changed.
To answer the question of the thread ,no a car with 390 rwhp automatic will never beat a 420 rwhp m6 if the m6 driver can shift.Will never happen inless the m6 driver misses a gear
Just my 2 cents about the auto vs stick arguments
Like I always say take your automatic and STICK IT
You can take a car making 380rwhp setup for drag racing with an automatic.
Take the same car put a stick in it ,its gonna make more power prolly 400 ish rwhp.
How can some one say an automatic will win there's more power being put to the ground its very easy to understand.
Here are some quick personal examples
1)
70 camaro 355 10.71 at 123 automatic set up on kill for drag racing 1.43 60 foot wheel's way in the air.
All I did was put a Jerico in it 10.48 at 128 mph 1.38 60 foot spinning while it was leaving never did hook it with the leaf springs.
2)
My Dad's 67 camaro 355 ci 11.05 at 119 with an automatic set up on kill.1.49 60 foot
Put a Jerico in it 10.61 at 125 with a 1.45 60 foot nothing else changed.
To answer the question of the thread ,no a car with 390 rwhp automatic will never beat a 420 rwhp m6 if the m6 driver can shift.Will never happen inless the m6 driver misses a gear
Just my 2 cents about the auto vs stick arguments
Like I always say take your automatic and STICK IT
06-03-2006, 03:30 PM
#19
but for this car a stick is most likely better. I am done dealing with clutch issues. I can buy an a3 for the price of a good clutch and once you buy a couple it is not fun.
06-03-2006, 03:49 PM
#20
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Originally Posted by ls1408cp
but for this car a stick is most likely better. I am done dealing with clutch issues. I can buy an a3 for the price of a good clutch and once you buy a couple it is not fun.
I feel ya.