Help with 25.5 Cert
08-22-2006, 09:53 AM
#1
Outlaw 10.5 Director
Thread Starter
iTrader: (9)
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Commerce Twp.
Posts: 2,136
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Help with 25.5 Cert Well, Stenod took the Red Rocket to get the Chassis certified and it did not pass. I was not there but from what I understand this modification had something to do with the major reason for not passing:
On a more minor side, the trans crossmember diameter is too small, the seat support does not have enough structure, 5 bars need to be added but I need to get more info from Stenod on the exact location and many gussets need to be added. The window net mount needs to be changed as well. If it was not for the #1 bar being wrong the majority of stuff would be relativley easy except for the fact that I need to grind/cut/weld on a "finished" cage and re-paint.
Thanks to Stenod for your help this morning!
Tom
On a more minor side, the trans crossmember diameter is too small, the seat support does not have enough structure, 5 bars need to be added but I need to get more info from Stenod on the exact location and many gussets need to be added. The window net mount needs to be changed as well. If it was not for the #1 bar being wrong the majority of stuff would be relativley easy except for the fact that I need to grind/cut/weld on a "finished" cage and re-paint.
Thanks to Stenod for your help this morning!
Tom
Last edited by FSTR-THANU; 08-22-2006 at 02:14 PM.
08-22-2006, 09:56 AM
#2
Outlaw 10.5 Director
Thread Starter
iTrader: (9)
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Commerce Twp.
Posts: 2,136
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Alright, let's please stay on track with a technical discussion.
The picture above shows how the #1 bar was cut and contoured around the frame. It is completely finish welded. The issue is the bar being cut and not running completely across the car. In order to pass that section needs to be cut out and the bar run completely across the car. Is that true to the rules or is it an interpretaion of one chassis guy compared to another?
Madman? NRC? Is there any light you guys could shed based on your interpretation of the rules around the construction of the number 1 bar? Do I have a leg to stand on with a different certification guy or should I get the plasma cutter out tonight?
Thanks,
Tom
The picture above shows how the #1 bar was cut and contoured around the frame. It is completely finish welded. The issue is the bar being cut and not running completely across the car. In order to pass that section needs to be cut out and the bar run completely across the car. Is that true to the rules or is it an interpretaion of one chassis guy compared to another?
Madman? NRC? Is there any light you guys could shed based on your interpretation of the rules around the construction of the number 1 bar? Do I have a leg to stand on with a different certification guy or should I get the plasma cutter out tonight?
Thanks,
Tom
08-22-2006, 10:23 AM
#3
Tom I dont see any other inspectors passing it. The rule is pretty straight forward on the #1 bar. The bad part is that is the main bar that the cage starts with. I would have to see the car to come up with a reasonable fix IF its possible.
__________________
__________________
08-22-2006, 10:24 AM
#4
Outlaw 10.5 Director
Thread Starter
iTrader: (9)
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Commerce Twp.
Posts: 2,136
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by MADMAN
Tom I dont see any other inspectors passing it. The rule is pretty straight forward on the #1 bar. The bad part is that is the main bar that the cage starts with. I would have to see the car to come up with a reasonable fix IF its possible.
__________________
__________________
UGHHHH!
Thanks!
Tom
Trending Topics
08-22-2006, 12:26 PM
#9
8 Second Club
Tom,
I am pretty sure #1 must go from side to side of the car, meaning from the left rocker to the right as a complete bar. It can have bends in it but it must not be altered and must be a continuous tube or box
I have the 25.2, 25.5 and 25.4 spec at home and can look that info up to make sure.
I am pretty sure #1 must go from side to side of the car, meaning from the left rocker to the right as a complete bar. It can have bends in it but it must not be altered and must be a continuous tube or box
I have the 25.2, 25.5 and 25.4 spec at home and can look that info up to make sure.
08-22-2006, 02:09 PM
#12
Outlaw 10.5 Director
Thread Starter
iTrader: (9)
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Commerce Twp.
Posts: 2,136
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Big Mike
Tom,
What size intercooler is that?
What size intercooler is that?
It is a PT1800.
Well I just got off of the phone with SFI (thanks Derty) and after looking at the pictures I sent him he said that he thinks this can be salvaged. First thing is that per pg7 sec6 para5 it states that 3 pieces are permissible so for that fix he reccomemded running a bar in the car around the hoop connecting the 2 sides.
"Hi Thomas,
Here is the the answer I find in the 25.5 spec. page 7, chapter 6, paragraph 5, section A.
The Rear Cross Member (#1) can be three (3) pieces and there must be a minimum of two (2) Floor Gussets (#39) of 1 5/8” x .083 CM or .118” MS tubing. The Floor Gusstes (#39) must be coincident with the center section of the Rear Cross Member (#1) at the intersection point of the Inner Frame Rails (#’s 2A & 2B) and extend rearward to the outer sections of the Rear Cross Member (#1).
I’ve attached a copy of the spec also, refer to the diagram on the bottom of page 20, I hope this helps you out. If you have any further questions, please give me a call.
Best Regards
Dave Allard
Laboratory Testing Coordinator
SFI Foundation, Inc.
15708 Pomerado Road, Suite N208
Poway, CA 92064
08-22-2006, 02:14 PM
#13
8 Second Club
Tom,
that is good news, but what about the 2X3 you have that the main hoop is resting on that has been cut up to conture the floor. Does that have to be replaced?
that is good news, but what about the 2X3 you have that the main hoop is resting on that has been cut up to conture the floor. Does that have to be replaced?
08-22-2006, 02:17 PM
#14
Outlaw 10.5 Director
Thread Starter
iTrader: (9)
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Commerce Twp.
Posts: 2,136
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Outlaw
Tom,
that is good news, but what about the 2X3 you have that the main hoop is resting on that has been cut up to conture the floor. Does that have to be replaced?
that is good news, but what about the 2X3 you have that the main hoop is resting on that has been cut up to conture the floor. Does that have to be replaced?
He is telling me no since it is resting on and around the main frame structure. He mentioned he has seen this before but is doing some homework still.
Thanks,
Tom
08-22-2006, 02:50 PM
#15
On The Tree
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 107
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Talked to Keith Had a talk with Keith at Skinny Kids this morning regarding Tom's
comment (before editing) on when Keith said he was not impressed with the
cage work. Keith was very upset and stated that he never said anything
of the sort. Infact he said that the cage work and welds where very good.
Pretty bad how Tom can fly out such BS and edited it with no apolagizes.
Both Skinney Kid and KTS Rac Cars are very upset about the comment.
KTS would still finish Toms car if he would stop this foolishness.
Dave K
comment (before editing) on when Keith said he was not impressed with the
cage work. Keith was very upset and stated that he never said anything
of the sort. Infact he said that the cage work and welds where very good.
Pretty bad how Tom can fly out such BS and edited it with no apolagizes.
Both Skinney Kid and KTS Rac Cars are very upset about the comment.
KTS would still finish Toms car if he would stop this foolishness.
Dave K
08-22-2006, 03:01 PM
#17
On The Tree
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 107
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Fix is simple To stop all you guys wondering.
We have several cars using this method that cert's 25.5.
The car left unfinshed and needs an atttachment between
the two 2x4's. The other issue is the #6 bars by the feet.
We take and bend the sub frm bar into the stock frame to replace
the 6a and 6b bars. This has past seversl times but not with Keith.
He wants to see the additional 6 bars from the front stantions to the
sub frame bars. I respect his discision. He is the cert. man in this case.
Once again if Tom stops, we will cert the car for him.
ITS NO BIG DEAL PEOPLE!!!!!!!!!
Dave K
We have several cars using this method that cert's 25.5.
The car left unfinshed and needs an atttachment between
the two 2x4's. The other issue is the #6 bars by the feet.
We take and bend the sub frm bar into the stock frame to replace
the 6a and 6b bars. This has past seversl times but not with Keith.
He wants to see the additional 6 bars from the front stantions to the
sub frame bars. I respect his discision. He is the cert. man in this case.
Once again if Tom stops, we will cert the car for him.
ITS NO BIG DEAL PEOPLE!!!!!!!!!
Dave K
08-22-2006, 03:01 PM
#18
TECH Resident
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: aiken ,sc
Posts: 835
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by FSTR-THANU
Alright, let's please stay on track with a technical discussion.
The picture above shows how the #1 bar was cut and contoured around the frame. It is completely finish welded. The issue is the bar being cut and not running completely across the car. In order to pass that section needs to be cut out and the bar run completely across the car. Is that true to the rules or is it an interpretaion of one chassis guy compared to another?
Madman? NRC? Is there any light you guys could shed based on your interpretation of the rules around the construction of the number 1 bar? Do I have a leg to stand on with a different certification guy or should I get the plasma cutter out tonight?
Thanks,
Tom
The picture above shows how the #1 bar was cut and contoured around the frame. It is completely finish welded. The issue is the bar being cut and not running completely across the car. In order to pass that section needs to be cut out and the bar run completely across the car. Is that true to the rules or is it an interpretaion of one chassis guy compared to another?
Madman? NRC? Is there any light you guys could shed based on your interpretation of the rules around the construction of the number 1 bar? Do I have a leg to stand on with a different certification guy or should I get the plasma cutter out tonight?
Thanks,
Tom
the net thing thats not a cert thing but for some reason,i see a lot of new cars on here with it on the outside of cage ,and that hasnt been allowed in quite a few yrs, let me know thnx bob ill post some picts if my computer ever gets up
Last edited by NRC-Motorsports; 08-22-2006 at 03:16 PM.
08-22-2006, 03:03 PM
#19
On The Tree
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 107
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Thunder175
Here we go again... 
I have a family to feed also. I will stick up for my company.
All I am after is the truth. I dont lie!
Dave
08-22-2006, 03:33 PM
#20
8 Second Club
Dave@KTS,
I am not part of this deal in anyway other then to help Tom with his question. I do understand you had part in this cage work, but this thread is not in anyway directed at you, your company, or skinny kid's. Tom has just asked a question and he has gotten level headed response on how to resolve his problems. I think you are taking Tom’s post as a personal attack and if you read what was written it was just his way of getting outside views of how to solve his problem and its NOT about you or your work.
I do understand you are upset about this or that and have every right to defend your company and its practices. But to be honest, the way you are representing your company in the few posts I have seen, I would shy away from ever doing business with you. Tom may feel the same way, that’s his right to look for outside venues to fix his problem. For you to go on every thread that’s made on this subject and make it a Tom VS. KTS battle is just wrong so please stop.
I am not part of this deal in anyway other then to help Tom with his question. I do understand you had part in this cage work, but this thread is not in anyway directed at you, your company, or skinny kid's. Tom has just asked a question and he has gotten level headed response on how to resolve his problems. I think you are taking Tom’s post as a personal attack and if you read what was written it was just his way of getting outside views of how to solve his problem and its NOT about you or your work.
I do understand you are upset about this or that and have every right to defend your company and its practices. But to be honest, the way you are representing your company in the few posts I have seen, I would shy away from ever doing business with you. Tom may feel the same way, that’s his right to look for outside venues to fix his problem. For you to go on every thread that’s made on this subject and make it a Tom VS. KTS battle is just wrong so please stop.