low ms3 numbers
low ms3 numbers EDIT: Got the Graphs for you guys.
Took it to the dyno yesterday and put down 376.47hp and 353.82 ft/lbs at a very popular shop in my region.
I have The MS3 on a 112 lsa with PRC 5.3l heads stg 2.5 with longtubes, catback and stock intake manifold, 42* injectors, lid k&n filter blah blah blah. Shouldnt I be making more power than this or were my expectations too high? I realize the stock intake is choking it down pretty good but damn i figured i would be north of 400. Any suggestions would be appriciated and I will be able to get up a dyno graph soon.
Took it to the dyno yesterday and put down 376.47hp and 353.82 ft/lbs at a very popular shop in my region.
I have The MS3 on a 112 lsa with PRC 5.3l heads stg 2.5 with longtubes, catback and stock intake manifold, 42* injectors, lid k&n filter blah blah blah. Shouldnt I be making more power than this or were my expectations too high? I realize the stock intake is choking it down pretty good but damn i figured i would be north of 400. Any suggestions would be appriciated and I will be able to get up a dyno graph soon.
Last edited by 93batmobile; Jul 22, 2010 at 12:04 PM. Reason: Uploaded Dyno Graphs
By stock intake we are assuming LS1? That could be the start of the problem right there....no way you'd be north of 400 with it on. Get an LS6, were the injectors scaled correctly too?
Agreed with the LS1 manifold, it bottlenecks pretty quickly. If you still have it on there, that is most likely the culprit. Like John said, post up a graph it you have it bro.
True, the ls1 intake is a restriction, but it's not going to pick up 60-70 rwhp from going to an ls6 or FAST, something else is wrong.
With a cam that big, and that much compression, you should easily be over 430 rwhp.
With a cam that big, and that much compression, you should easily be over 430 rwhp.
With that cam you should be building power up through 6,700 RPMs. I have the Texas Speed 233/239 cam on a 112 and it maxed out at 7,000 rpms. I have the same heads, 5.3L Stage 2.5 heads but have a ported Fast 92mm from Texas Speed along with the 92mm PTM TB.
At what RPM does the car start to drop off power wise?
Where is max HP at RPM wise?
Max TQ?
What RPM is max TQ at?
One thing I didn't see is who did your tune? If you tell me the car hasn't been tuned yet, problem solved.
At what RPM does the car start to drop off power wise?
Where is max HP at RPM wise?
Max TQ?
What RPM is max TQ at?
One thing I didn't see is who did your tune? If you tell me the car hasn't been tuned yet, problem solved.
Full dyno tune by a prolific shop in the Chicago area. It is an ls1 and I will try and post graphs by tomorrow cuz I dont want to try and answer all of these then post it up lol. Just a little preview though.. The final run had 1 hp less than the first run shown on the graph and the final graph cuts off at 6200 rpm... The graph of the two runs together doesnt have rpms and that graph shows the power dropping off so I can't say for sure where the power really does drop off. I don't want to go pointing fingers, but this all seems a little fishy to me.... Once i post the graphs and hear some replies then I will decide if its my car or something else.
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From: Bahrain - middile east
had the same issue as you but with smaller cam+4.10 ..
got 341/350 with cam only ..
mostly its the ls1 intake ..
swap it for ls6 .. clean your maf,fillter,newplugs,wires and get back for the dyno ..
easy 20hp there ..
got 341/350 with cam only ..
mostly its the ls1 intake ..
swap it for ls6 .. clean your maf,fillter,newplugs,wires and get back for the dyno ..
easy 20hp there ..
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+ 1
I picked up about 30RWHP between 6,200 and where I maxed out at 7,000. So, if they only took it to 6,200, my guess is you are probably missing out on 25+ hp beyond that and where your cam truly peaks. They should have looked at the graph to see if power was still climbing. If so, should have pulled it higher on the next run. Do this (within reason) until you find where the car starts to start losing power from its peak number.
If it was losing power at 6,200 then there is a problem. Even stock they make power past that.
Good Luck.
I picked up about 30RWHP between 6,200 and where I maxed out at 7,000. So, if they only took it to 6,200, my guess is you are probably missing out on 25+ hp beyond that and where your cam truly peaks. They should have looked at the graph to see if power was still climbing. If so, should have pulled it higher on the next run. Do this (within reason) until you find where the car starts to start losing power from its peak number.
If it was losing power at 6,200 then there is a problem. Even stock they make power past that.
Good Luck.
don't know for sure about that, my cam peaks right at 6000rpm and starts to fall off after...it's modeled after the tr230 which peaks at 6300 but mine has advance ground in due to an ordering mistake
Spinning it higher isn't going to make the torque number any bigger, which is where most of the problems lie. 353 ft/lbs of torque is shitty at best. That's bolt on torque numbers, and it's a 6-speed car so it's not like a torque converter is eating up the torque.
Torque is cylinder pressure. If you are down on torque, you're not generating, or you're losing cylinder pressure pure and simple.
Torque is cylinder pressure. If you are down on torque, you're not generating, or you're losing cylinder pressure pure and simple.
Sorry but theres a chunk left from 6200-6800. MS3 is not made to peak at 6200. Even if your torq doesnt go up that much, I bet you have a good 20rwhp left in the higher rpm. Something is wrong, either your tuner or valvetrain issue.
As for compression, I will check that as soon as i can. I didn't tear into the bottom end when doing the build and the motor only has 59k on it. The valvetrain as far as i know is correct/still properly operating. I used a pushrod length checker and it measured out to be what my pushrods currently are at 7.4". Unless that intake is causing such weak numbers? I left it on because I thought i would be able to break into the 4's like I said earlier, but obviously I was incorrect with that assumption 
I will definitely get one on soon. Would I need a lot of adjustment in my tune after a fast 90/90 setup or similar?
I will definitely get one on soon. Would I need a lot of adjustment in my tune after a fast 90/90 setup or similar? This isn't a 4.6l mod motor that makes 420hp and 353 torque. By spinning it higher, it's not going to make any more torque than it did at 4800-5000 rpm. By 6200 rpm, the torque is going down. Something is not right with that massive of a cam and heads. I made over 400ft/lbs of torque with handported heads and a tr224 cam back in 2002. Granted, it put down 438 hp, but that's because the tr224 cam on a 112 with 4 degrees of advance ground in was peaking by 6000rpm.