Is 575whp possible n/a?
What's your definition of a stock bottom end? So your saying I could get a wrecking yard 346 and make 500+ HP with it.
I've looked over several years of engine master builds and those guys aren't making the kind of power your talking about with those heads and cubic inches.
The ET's you have run with your builds are very impressive. If everything else on the car is optimized you can run good ET's with less power. Several of the other posters show that.
I'm not drinking the kool aid just yet. If you have this figured out then you should be building engines for the NHRA stock classes and making some $$$, or better yet step up and run those classes.
So not to be a true Richard head and just bash people. I give you a lot of credit for going as far as you have and pushing the boundries. I certainly have not with my builds. Good luck with your quest.
I've looked over several years of engine master builds and those guys aren't making the kind of power your talking about with those heads and cubic inches.
The ET's you have run with your builds are very impressive. If everything else on the car is optimized you can run good ET's with less power. Several of the other posters show that.
I'm not drinking the kool aid just yet. If you have this figured out then you should be building engines for the NHRA stock classes and making some $$$, or better yet step up and run those classes.
So not to be a true Richard head and just bash people. I give you a lot of credit for going as far as you have and pushing the boundries. I certainly have not with my builds. Good luck with your quest.
Engine Masters rules require 92 octane and power is measured from 3500-6500rpm. My BBC 477 did 766hp at the 2013 competition. At 7000 it does 810hp and at 7500, I hope it does 850hp.
I think getting 575rwhp, 625fwhp is doable with e85, more compression, and more rpm. It would not be easy but possible.
We do a lot of the same things with the c6Z that we did with the c5Z to make power and to perform well on the drag strip.
Some of the fastest c6's that I help with all take advantage of high rpm and lightweight stuff.
Here 's one way to make power in a C6Z.
https://ls1tech.com/forums/dynamomet...935fwhp-n.html
This setup was originally designed for my car @ 10,000+ rpms but it has found a new home in a C6Z and at a more conservative atmosphere.
A 396ci pushing 1000fwhp in my vette.... One can only dream.
Some of the fastest c6's that I help with all take advantage of high rpm and lightweight stuff.
Here 's one way to make power in a C6Z.
https://ls1tech.com/forums/dynamomet...935fwhp-n.html
This setup was originally designed for my car @ 10,000+ rpms but it has found a new home in a C6Z and at a more conservative atmosphere.
A 396ci pushing 1000fwhp in my vette.... One can only dream.
I wish I had a c6z but I have to deal with having the ls7 in my fbody lol. Im getting the valvetrain setup now with the light weight valves and psi beehives so hopefully I see a good increase with that. Also trying the msd intake. I think my times will improve alot this year once I get it all back together.
Ive read some of your other threads, I have a 28x10.5 Hoosier stiffwall with 4.30 gears, I noticed you like the 26" tires. Recon they would do any good with my gearing in a fbody?
CID X RPM / 3456 = CFM
CFM * .069 = lb/min, at some temp K
Working backwards,
60lb/min / .069 = 869CFM~ needed
869CFM * 3456 / 350CID = 8,500 RPM with 100% VE
Answer to the thread: Yes, at 8,500rpm if you had 100% you should be around 600bhp which would put you around 550~rwhp to the tires.
I wouldn't do it though, because
A: street manners will be poor
B: Economy will be mediocre
C: OEM bearing clearances will not enjoy the ride (it will probably spin a rod bearing at some point) i.e. just because you see max PSI in oil pressure at the sender doesn't mean the bearings are all receiving their fare share.
Instead: Forced induction is your friend
CFM * .069 = lb/min, at some temp K
Working backwards,
60lb/min / .069 = 869CFM~ needed
869CFM * 3456 / 350CID = 8,500 RPM with 100% VE
Answer to the thread: Yes, at 8,500rpm if you had 100% you should be around 600bhp which would put you around 550~rwhp to the tires.
I wouldn't do it though, because
A: street manners will be poor
B: Economy will be mediocre
C: OEM bearing clearances will not enjoy the ride (it will probably spin a rod bearing at some point) i.e. just because you see max PSI in oil pressure at the sender doesn't mean the bearings are all receiving their fare share.
Instead: Forced induction is your friend
Make sure you get some videos if that ever makes it to the track!
I wish I had a c6z but I have to deal with having the ls7 in my fbody lol. Im getting the valvetrain setup now with the light weight valves and psi beehives so hopefully I see a good increase with that. Also trying the msd intake. I think my times will improve alot this year once I get it all back together.
Ive read some of your other threads, I have a 28x10.5 Hoosier stiffwall with 4.30 gears, I noticed you like the 26" tires. Recon they would do any good with my gearing in a fbody?
I wish I had a c6z but I have to deal with having the ls7 in my fbody lol. Im getting the valvetrain setup now with the light weight valves and psi beehives so hopefully I see a good increase with that. Also trying the msd intake. I think my times will improve alot this year once I get it all back together.
Ive read some of your other threads, I have a 28x10.5 Hoosier stiffwall with 4.30 gears, I noticed you like the 26" tires. Recon they would do any good with my gearing in a fbody?
I'd start with some extra air in those tires.
I'd also have Mamo work over the manifold.
Cathedral or square port heads?
CID X RPM / 3456 = CFM
CFM * .069 = lb/min, at some temp K
Working backwards,
60lb/min / .069 = 869CFM~ needed
869CFM * 3456 / 350CID = 8,500 RPM with 100% VE
Answer to the thread: Yes, at 8,500rpm if you had 100% you should be around 600bhp which would put you around 550~rwhp to the tires.
I wouldn't do it though, because
A: street manners will be poor
B: Economy will be mediocre
C: OEM bearing clearances will not enjoy the ride (it will probably spin a rod bearing at some point) i.e. just because you see max PSI in oil pressure at the sender doesn't mean the bearings are all receiving their fare share.
Instead: Forced induction is your friend
CFM * .069 = lb/min, at some temp K
Working backwards,
60lb/min / .069 = 869CFM~ needed
869CFM * 3456 / 350CID = 8,500 RPM with 100% VE
Answer to the thread: Yes, at 8,500rpm if you had 100% you should be around 600bhp which would put you around 550~rwhp to the tires.
I wouldn't do it though, because
A: street manners will be poor
B: Economy will be mediocre
C: OEM bearing clearances will not enjoy the ride (it will probably spin a rod bearing at some point) i.e. just because you see max PSI in oil pressure at the sender doesn't mean the bearings are all receiving their fare share.
Instead: Forced induction is your friend
That's why we actually race.
I'm making well over 500w dynojet now cam only which tells me the formula is missing something and you didn't read the thread.
Its still a handy little tool to figure out what an air pump is going to move, within reason, which helps size other parts, like a compressor for example. Also, why would I read the thread? The topic is clearly trolling the community for grey area answers. like mine
There is no right or wrong answer, everybody knows you can make 600horsepower with a 350cid engine N/A its been done since like 1967, that isn't the proper question though. It should be something like "can you do it and get 30mpg and maintain daily driver manners" etcif I am not mistaken, one must read the thread title to understand the thread content, as the title drives the content. Thus my response is correctly oriented against the thread topic without needing to read further.
Last edited by kingtal0n; Apr 1, 2016 at 10:04 PM.
Thanks ill keep you updated. Okay will do, these tires seem to work pretty good so far. Yeah thats who I got the msd from is him and a 102tb. It hasn't came in yet but looking forward to it.
Square ports, still using gm ls7 heads with tsp port program and a little extra hand work from the local machine shop
of course its missing something, its just for a general idea. Air temp, rolling resistance, compression, fuel quality, the list goes on.
Its still a handy little tool to figure out what an air pump is going to move, within reason, which helps size other parts, like a compressor for example. Also, why would I read the thread? The topic is clearly trolling the community for grey area answers. like mine
There is no right or wrong answer, everybody knows you can make 600horsepower with a 350cid engine N/A its been done since like 1967, that isn't the proper question though. It should be something like "can you do it and get 30mpg and maintain daily driver manners" etc
Its still a handy little tool to figure out what an air pump is going to move, within reason, which helps size other parts, like a compressor for example. Also, why would I read the thread? The topic is clearly trolling the community for grey area answers. like mine
There is no right or wrong answer, everybody knows you can make 600horsepower with a 350cid engine N/A its been done since like 1967, that isn't the proper question though. It should be something like "can you do it and get 30mpg and maintain daily driver manners" etc I see another .3 cam only without any necessary R&D.
If I had the motivation, I'd run it another 10 passes with the more optimal setup to see how low it would go then do heads.
For heads for this particular setup I'd consider:
1) LS3 small bore square port heads
2) MMS 220 cathedral heads
...along with a fast 102 manifold ported by Mamo.
I'd like to try and gain 50+ from the heads, ported 102, and nice bump in compression over my current setup.
My top priority would be to sell the car. The best of both worlds would be if someone wanted the car with heads so I would be obligated to dyno test and back it up on the drag strip for the new buyer. lol
If I had the motivation, I'd run it another 10 passes with the more optimal setup to see how low it would go then do heads.
For heads for this particular setup I'd consider:
1) LS3 small bore square port heads
2) MMS 220 cathedral heads
...along with a fast 102 manifold ported by Mamo.
I'd like to try and gain 50+ from the heads, ported 102, and nice bump in compression over my current setup.
My top priority would be to sell the car. The best of both worlds would be if someone wanted the car with heads so I would be obligated to dyno test and back it up on the drag strip for the new buyer. lol
Enjoyed reading the thread on CF about this. I wish Ed Curtis wasn't banned on her. When I was going to get the Mast heads for the cam he spec'ed for me, he said I could clear 500 easy with a few changes to my set up. Unfortunately my car didn't drive friendly for me. Specs of the cam were 244/248 .630 112.0. People told me with the added compression it would help with driveability.
This is a very good thread. I don't think you have much of an argument. If any. After seeing what could be accomplished with the best combo, if you want more, you can still step up to a solid roller cam.
Make sure you get some videos if that ever makes it to the track!
I wish I had a c6z but I have to deal with having the ls7 in my fbody lol. Im getting the valvetrain setup now with the light weight valves and psi beehives so hopefully I see a good increase with that. Also trying the msd intake. I think my times will improve alot this year once I get it all back together.
Ive read some of your other threads, I have a 28x10.5 Hoosier stiffwall with 4.30 gears, I noticed you like the 26" tires. Recon they would do any good with my gearing in a fbody?
I wish I had a c6z but I have to deal with having the ls7 in my fbody lol. Im getting the valvetrain setup now with the light weight valves and psi beehives so hopefully I see a good increase with that. Also trying the msd intake. I think my times will improve alot this year once I get it all back together.
Ive read some of your other threads, I have a 28x10.5 Hoosier stiffwall with 4.30 gears, I noticed you like the 26" tires. Recon they would do any good with my gearing in a fbody?
That's where we started the pull on the engine dyno. lol








