427 procharger F-1a L92 heads 858 RWHP
09-06-2007, 09:32 PM
#41
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Originally Posted by Stang's Bane
See that is the great thing about having a head that flows it's *** off. You don't need to hold the valves open that long to make good power.
Congrats on the setup man, amazing results, completely amazing!!
Congrats on the setup man, amazing results, completely amazing!!
Thanks
09-11-2007, 04:32 PM
#45
Wow Timmy, you didn't know you were starting some drama huh? 
It is funny what people think works and what doesn't.
The first blower heads I ported were for a Mustang and it used stock Ford iron heads, they flowed 160/120 stock and I got them to flow 200/200 and damn near slowed the car down. Thats when I derived my overscavenging theory... circa 1995.
The next set of blower heads I ported were TFS Twisted Wedge heads and I ported the snot out of the intake and just cleaned up the exhaust, the car ran 138 mph in the 1/4 mile with an S-Trim in 1996, and no one was running that fast back then with that size blower and those parts.
By 2000 our customer won the NMRA Renegade class championship, which is basically a 306 with .550" lift hyd roller cam, street heads and street intakes. Of the first 10 Renegade cars to run 8's in the 1/4 mile we did the heads and intakes on 8 of them.
Twisted Wedge heads have the intake valve moved away from the cylinder wall and the exhaust valve moved closer to the cylinder wall, this helps intake flow and hurts exhaust flow, but makes a bunch of power.
You can't imagine how many blower customers I have sold blower heads to with tiny exhaust ports that made a ton of power and they didn't understand why. It all goes back to the pressures in the ports and what is happening during overlap, you could have probably put more cam duration in it and lost power everywhere, you could have put a better exhaust port on it and lost power, all due to over scavenging during overlap.
It is funny what people think works and what doesn't.
The first blower heads I ported were for a Mustang and it used stock Ford iron heads, they flowed 160/120 stock and I got them to flow 200/200 and damn near slowed the car down. Thats when I derived my overscavenging theory... circa 1995.
The next set of blower heads I ported were TFS Twisted Wedge heads and I ported the snot out of the intake and just cleaned up the exhaust, the car ran 138 mph in the 1/4 mile with an S-Trim in 1996, and no one was running that fast back then with that size blower and those parts.
By 2000 our customer won the NMRA Renegade class championship, which is basically a 306 with .550" lift hyd roller cam, street heads and street intakes. Of the first 10 Renegade cars to run 8's in the 1/4 mile we did the heads and intakes on 8 of them.
Twisted Wedge heads have the intake valve moved away from the cylinder wall and the exhaust valve moved closer to the cylinder wall, this helps intake flow and hurts exhaust flow, but makes a bunch of power.
You can't imagine how many blower customers I have sold blower heads to with tiny exhaust ports that made a ton of power and they didn't understand why. It all goes back to the pressures in the ports and what is happening during overlap, you could have probably put more cam duration in it and lost power everywhere, you could have put a better exhaust port on it and lost power, all due to over scavenging during overlap.
09-11-2007, 05:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Brian Tooley
Wow Timmy, you didn't know you were starting some drama huh?
It is funny what people think works and what doesn't.
It is funny what people think works and what doesn't.
You never know for sure what works until you try. Thats why I never recommend for people to try this or change that unless it is something that I or Dave have done before with success.
I was just lucky with that build. Originally it was going to be an NA 427 but the wrong pistons were ordered. Since I had dished pistons and LT1 Dave happened to get an account with Procharger that same week, I decided to buy an F-1A. The cam came about when we were joking
about making 1000hp (crank) with a 219 cam. Dave picked the cam specs and I figured I may as well go for it since nothing else was really planned. I had no idea what kind of power it would make or where. I just knew it had to be a bunch.This also brings to mind a cam jokingly called the E.T. cam. LT1 Dave picked that one too.
Its a cam with less than 240* duration that has made 535rwhp with small bore 2.02/1.60 patriot heads, and 550rwhp with out of the box TFS 215 heads
But all I know is that i need a bigger cam.
09-15-2007, 06:09 AM
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Originally Posted by corvettetimmy
I agree.. Its hard starting all of this trouble. (and it was expensive)
Originally Posted by corvettetimmy
You never know for sure what works until you try. Thats why I never recommend for people to try this or change that unless it is something that I or Dave have done before with success.
But all I know is that i need a bigger cam.
But all I know is that i need a bigger cam.
BTW: Beautiful new ride!
09-16-2007, 03:11 PM
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Wow, huge numbers Timmy. I was wondering what I could expect from my similar blown L92 427 build for my 99' coupe. 
Here is to keeping it straight forward and simple without fuss. Again impressive numbers!! 
Here is to keeping it straight forward and simple without fuss. Again impressive numbers!!
09-17-2007, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Instigator
No sh.... I mean 10-4 on the expensive!
Great numbers Timmy. That thing ran great and remained streetable, something that gets lost in the debate sometimes. I don't think it would matter if you made 1200 RWHP with this setup because there would always be someone suggesting a better way. That seems to be the status quo around here. And it all started with a post on whether or not L92 heads could make any power.
BTW: Beautiful new ride!
Great numbers Timmy. That thing ran great and remained streetable, something that gets lost in the debate sometimes. I don't think it would matter if you made 1200 RWHP with this setup because there would always be someone suggesting a better way. That seems to be the status quo around here. And it all started with a post on whether or not L92 heads could make any power.
BTW: Beautiful new ride!
Im sure that you will be subject to the same BS, especially if it makes 900+. You know that there are a ton of 900+ cars on here and their owners will all be telling you how you did it wrong.. Sorry, I meant stock cars and their owners..
Good luck ROB
09-17-2007, 01:05 PM
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Originally Posted by unit213
...even still, that blower should make power right 'til redline. The setup
clearly isn't optimal, but ****...that's a ton more power than I'm making so
I say cheers to ya! 
clearly isn't optimal, but ****...that's a ton more power than I'm making so
I say cheers to ya!
Optimal for racing-NO
Optimal for reliability yet still pulling hard on just about any super car-YES
Like he said, you can shift at 6K instead of the 7k it was built for, and still win the race easily. Or in another case...still have a huge amount of adrenaline pumping through your body. I'm not saying this setup is as reliable as it can get..but I am saying that it will be much more reliable when you shift at 6k instead of 7k, and yet still have enough power to have all the fun you want.
Great setup, I wish it were mine.
09-17-2007, 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted by fueledpassion
It depends on what you call optimal...
Optimal for racing-NO
Optimal for reliability yet still pulling hard on just about any super car-YES
Like he said, you can shift at 6K instead of the 7k it was built for, and still win the race easily. Or in another case...still have a huge amount of adrenaline pumping through your body. I'm not saying this setup is as reliable as it can get..but I am saying that it will be much more reliable when you shift at 6k instead of 7k, and yet still have enough power to have all the fun you want.
Great setup, I wish it were mine.
Optimal for racing-NO
Optimal for reliability yet still pulling hard on just about any super car-YES
Like he said, you can shift at 6K instead of the 7k it was built for, and still win the race easily. Or in another case...still have a huge amount of adrenaline pumping through your body. I'm not saying this setup is as reliable as it can get..but I am saying that it will be much more reliable when you shift at 6k instead of 7k, and yet still have enough power to have all the fun you want.
Great setup, I wish it were mine.
+1 I'd rather have my setup last a few years then a few weeks becuase it was on a dangerous tune that let her make an extra 20 rwhp or so. And for what, bragging rights ??
09-21-2007, 09:24 PM
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Instigator is putting together a real similar setup and it should be rolling soon.
The main difference is that he is using LS6 heads/fast and a cam with more duration. Same cubes and same blower but air/air intercooled.
It should be a good comparison.
The main difference is that he is using LS6 heads/fast and a cam with more duration. Same cubes and same blower but air/air intercooled.
It should be a good comparison.
12-14-2007, 12:04 AM
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I have a hunch it was exhaust port choked as well....but another 10 degrees of intake timing might have helped a bit....thats alot of engine to feed at RPM.
Personally, a think a head with less intake flow and a much better exhaust port is better suited to forced induction. Both the LS7 and L92 stuff have a really crappy exhaust valve location to make room for the huge intake valve. The exhaust valve is practically against the chamber wall so even ported you are somewhat limited simply by design.
Either way good numbers....just sharing some opinions on the topic at hand.
The power delivery on that big inch bad boy must feel phenominal.
Cheers,
Tony
Personally, a think a head with less intake flow and a much better exhaust port is better suited to forced induction. Both the LS7 and L92 stuff have a really crappy exhaust valve location to make room for the huge intake valve. The exhaust valve is practically against the chamber wall so even ported you are somewhat limited simply by design.
Either way good numbers....just sharing some opinions on the topic at hand.
The power delivery on that big inch bad boy must feel phenominal.
Cheers,
Tony
