Can i beat my friends mustang?!
05-06-2010 | 08:12 PM
#21
TECH Apprentice
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 335
Likes: 0
From: CA
My 03 with a tune picked up 3rwhp..... I worked at DMP for quite a few years. 2v cars gain no real hp from a tune. My a/f was 12.5-12.1 throughout the band, with offroad x pipe, magnaflow catback, trick flow plenum and cold air, that was untuned. My experience in them was on the dyno, 4v cars do pick up quite a bit more power from a tune.
MPH I have seen alot of 2v cars stock trap 100mph, My friends 02gt trapped 99mph bone stock with 4500 miles at ennis. Again these cars on the dyno and at the track are about as consistant as a hooker on blow.
One of the stupids gains I have seen on mod motor cars is degreeing the stock cams, some of them come retarded as much as 3deg, some advanced a deg or so. Mine was retarded 2 deg, setting it to zero my car picked up 15rwhp untuned from stock cam!!!!!!!!!
MPH I have seen alot of 2v cars stock trap 100mph, My friends 02gt trapped 99mph bone stock with 4500 miles at ennis. Again these cars on the dyno and at the track are about as consistant as a hooker on blow.
One of the stupids gains I have seen on mod motor cars is degreeing the stock cams, some of them come retarded as much as 3deg, some advanced a deg or so. Mine was retarded 2 deg, setting it to zero my car picked up 15rwhp untuned from stock cam!!!!!!!!!
The bolts ons he has, shorties, x pipe, cold air. Don't gain but 10-15, long tubes, cams, throttle body, plenum or intake swap you can make close to 300rwhp NA. Again I have yet to see a single N/A bolt on car come close to running lean with a wideband on the dyno and I watched hundreds. I am sure that some could run lean, but seeing it first hand and watching hundreds dynoed I havn't seen it. So yes I guess it could be possible to run lean with bolt ons with a 2v, that be said My other fox 91lx coupe with gt-40 iron heads, f cam, gt-40 intake, S trim with 10psi on a cold day with 36lb injectors with a **** maf on the a/f is at 12.2, this is a stock A9p, my car lays down 447hp and 459tq.
No disrespect to you, this is just my experience with them. I am 31yrs old and have owned and driven mustangs since i was 16. I know alot but damn sure don't know everything.
No disrespect to you, this is just my experience with them. I am 31yrs old and have owned and driven mustangs since i was 16. I know alot but damn sure don't know everything.
My only point is you can not use A stang to insure that B stang is the same. Two different cars. To say you can do that, is to say they all dyno the exact same.....peak power, powerband, and A/F. You should know that that is not the case. TOo many times I see peopel say "This should happen, cause I've seen it this one time at band camp" and that is ignorant mentality IMO.
I'm not really sure why you brought your car into it, as it's a pushrod and (more or less) is a different ECU setup.
Hey fancy that....I'm 31 too. LOL I'll give you this, I have not owned a 2V modular personally. LIke I said I am a 4V guy. However, that doesn't mean the rules 'change' because person A's car is not person B's car. Again, you may be 100% correct in this instance, but you also may not be. The ONLY way to tell is to do some WOT pulls with it hooked up. And that's not getting into the fact that he can still benefit from getting a custom tune. Any and ALL cars will get a benefit. It's only a question of is it worth the money for the results. Only the owner can answer that as it's his perception.
05-06-2010 | 10:27 PM
#22
That's in part because 12.1-12.5 is considered on teh fat side for an N/A non-road racing car. Had it been smoothened out and been 12.7-13.0, you would have seen a better gain. IMO
I guess I did misunderstand you. I took it as a NE won't see but 10-15rwhp without LT's, etc. Not that the OP stang referenced car had maybe that.
My only point is you can not use A stang to insure that B stang is the same. Two different cars. To say you can do that, is to say they all dyno the exact same.....peak power, powerband, and A/F. You should know that that is not the case. TOo many times I see peopel say "This should happen, cause I've seen it this one time at band camp" and that is ignorant mentality IMO.
I'm not really sure why you brought your car into it, as it's a pushrod and (more or less) is a different ECU setup.
Hey fancy that....I'm 31 too. LOL I'll give you this, I have not owned a 2V modular personally. LIke I said I am a 4V guy. However, that doesn't mean the rules 'change' because person A's car is not person B's car. Again, you may be 100% correct in this instance, but you also may not be. The ONLY way to tell is to do some WOT pulls with it hooked up. And that's not getting into the fact that he can still benefit from getting a custom tune. Any and ALL cars will get a benefit. It's only a question of is it worth the money for the results. Only the owner can answer that as it's his perception.
I guess I did misunderstand you. I took it as a NE won't see but 10-15rwhp without LT's, etc. Not that the OP stang referenced car had maybe that.
My only point is you can not use A stang to insure that B stang is the same. Two different cars. To say you can do that, is to say they all dyno the exact same.....peak power, powerband, and A/F. You should know that that is not the case. TOo many times I see peopel say "This should happen, cause I've seen it this one time at band camp" and that is ignorant mentality IMO.
I'm not really sure why you brought your car into it, as it's a pushrod and (more or less) is a different ECU setup.
Hey fancy that....I'm 31 too. LOL I'll give you this, I have not owned a 2V modular personally. LIke I said I am a 4V guy. However, that doesn't mean the rules 'change' because person A's car is not person B's car. Again, you may be 100% correct in this instance, but you also may not be. The ONLY way to tell is to do some WOT pulls with it hooked up. And that's not getting into the fact that he can still benefit from getting a custom tune. Any and ALL cars will get a benefit. It's only a question of is it worth the money for the results. Only the owner can answer that as it's his perception.
The Point I was making was about the versitility of ECU, my fox is still EEC iV. I am quite sure more then half the ls1 cars here could probably beat up my 92fox even with a blower. You know ford ECU are insanely forgiving. Yes Giving a alittle leaner will wake it up a bit, but not worth the amount until you have all the supporting mods to take advantage of it.
I am realistic with what you get, would it be awesome to gain 25-30rwhp from a tune, you damn right. I would have loved for that to happen everytime one hits the dyno, less 2v cars would be getting slammed by damn ls1 cars lol.
Oh the age wasn't a slap junior so don't get all butthurt over it, it was merely a statement that I am not a 16yr keyboard warrior bragging that nothing is better then a ford. I like my LS1 car, and I am spending more then I should making it alittle faster. I see you sold your stang did you get another one, or just the honda now? I had to sell my 03gt because of my divorce, it was in her name. Miss that car. You don't sound like a guy who doesn't know **** about stangs, I will give you that. You seem to know them quite well.
Last edited by prochargedpony; 05-06-2010 at 10:54 PM.
05-06-2010 | 10:45 PM
#23
Here is my 93gt, I am not a complete moron when it comes to mustangs lol.
This is the one in my sig, my 92 is kind of a **** box car, I am done motor wise but the body needs work, my 93 I am finishing up the body work from hail, and the old bumper was repaired and it was done like crap so I just replaced it. I work for a paint and body shop so it goes and comes to my house til it is perfect.
I didn't post this up for bragging rights, I can do that after it is painted and I finish up my fuel system and have dyno numbers right now, it is a 42lb siemen deka injectors with pintels opened up to flow 48lb, I got them for free so I won't complain. I have a tweecer r/t tuner so the tune is fair and runs good.
This is the one in my sig, my 92 is kind of a **** box car, I am done motor wise but the body needs work, my 93 I am finishing up the body work from hail, and the old bumper was repaired and it was done like crap so I just replaced it. I work for a paint and body shop so it goes and comes to my house til it is perfect.
I didn't post this up for bragging rights, I can do that after it is painted and I finish up my fuel system and have dyno numbers right now, it is a 42lb siemen deka injectors with pintels opened up to flow 48lb, I got them for free so I won't complain. I have a tweecer r/t tuner so the tune is fair and runs good.
05-06-2010 | 10:56 PM
#24
Banned
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
From: LS1Tech.com
My friends 2004 GT has BBK Shorty Headers, BBK Off Road H, Flowmaster Catback, 3:73 Gears, Hurst Billet Plus Shifter, BBK Cold Air Intake, 75mm BBK Throttle Body/Plenum, and UD pulleys.
My 2002 ws6 has a c-force clutch, Z06 flywheel, long tube headers, 85mm throttle body, smooth bellow slp, with k&n filter, and a computer chip, torch arm bar and pan handling bars, all polyurethane bushings, tranny mount and motor mounts.
We both have Nitto drag radials. We argue all the time but we both just got our cars and arent used to driving them, let alone racing them hard. Be honest with me, lol. We'll findout soon
My 2002 ws6 has a c-force clutch, Z06 flywheel, long tube headers, 85mm throttle body, smooth bellow slp, with k&n filter, and a computer chip, torch arm bar and pan handling bars, all polyurethane bushings, tranny mount and motor mounts.
We both have Nitto drag radials. We argue all the time but we both just got our cars and arent used to driving them, let alone racing them hard. Be honest with me, lol. We'll findout soon
05-07-2010 | 12:23 AM
#25
TECH Apprentice
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 335
Likes: 0
From: CA
I guess this is where we agree, to me a 400-500 dyno tune to pick up 10-pushing 15rwhp isn't worth it and I guess I should have conveyed that as my point.
The Point I was making was about the versitility of ECU, my fox is still EEC iV. I am quite sure more then half the ls1 cars here could probably beat up my 92fox even with a blower. You know ford ECU are insanely forgiving. Yes Giving a alittle leaner will wake it up a bit, but not worth the amount until you have all the supporting mods to take advantage of it.
I am realistic with what you get, would it be awesome to gain 25-30rwhp from a tune, you damn right. I would have loved for that to happen everytime one hits the dyno, less 2v cars would be getting slammed by damn ls1 cars lol.
Oh the age wasn't a slap junior so don't get all butthurt over it, it was merely a statement that I am not a 16yr keyboard warrior bragging that nothing is better then a ford. I like my LS1 car, and I am spending more then I should making it alittle faster. I see you sold your stang did you get another one, or just the honda now? I had to sell my 03gt because of my divorce, it was in her name. Miss that car. You don't sound like a guy who doesn't know **** about stangs, I will give you that. You seem to know them quite well.
The Point I was making was about the versitility of ECU, my fox is still EEC iV. I am quite sure more then half the ls1 cars here could probably beat up my 92fox even with a blower. You know ford ECU are insanely forgiving. Yes Giving a alittle leaner will wake it up a bit, but not worth the amount until you have all the supporting mods to take advantage of it.
I am realistic with what you get, would it be awesome to gain 25-30rwhp from a tune, you damn right. I would have loved for that to happen everytime one hits the dyno, less 2v cars would be getting slammed by damn ls1 cars lol.
Oh the age wasn't a slap junior so don't get all butthurt over it, it was merely a statement that I am not a 16yr keyboard warrior bragging that nothing is better then a ford. I like my LS1 car, and I am spending more then I should making it alittle faster. I see you sold your stang did you get another one, or just the honda now? I had to sell my 03gt because of my divorce, it was in her name. Miss that car. You don't sound like a guy who doesn't know **** about stangs, I will give you that. You seem to know them quite well.
My response to age wasn't a butthurt. I ahve no idea where you got that from. It was merely an amusement that we are the same age.
As for my experience with stangs.....well, yeah, you can say I've owned a few. N/A, FI, Pushrod, and modular. For you to speak broadly about fords ECU being VERY forgiving seems ignorant to me. In an N/A 4V, slapping on a CAI/RAI, midpipe and carback, you should definitely have the A/F checked as it will go lean at WOT more times than not. ANd your comment in the other thread about the Cobra makes me seriously wonder what knowledge you have in modulars. At least in 4V's.
Even with your explenation, I still ahve no idea why you brought up tuning in your pushrod. It really has no bearing on this conversation IMO.
As for me....well, I did have to sell my procharged mach 1. Why? simple, taking care of my 4 kids on my own is more important. As for your childish and schoolyard attempt to slam me with your Honda comment; you're way off base. I dn't own an import thank you very much. But much like you, I went through a divorce and now have primary physical custody of my 4 kids so I'm doing what any responsible parent should do IMO. Doing for them!
Anything else N00b?
05-07-2010 | 07:13 AM
#29
Like I said, your perception may not be that of someone elses. Just because your experience in your car wasn't very good, doesn't mean everyone's is. IMO, gaining 10% in a few bolt ons and a tune is worth it for someone that A) doesn't want a whole lot of power, B) can't afford FI, or C) just like to do that kind of thing. It's up to them not you or I. The only reason why I made my first post is there are A LOT of 'newbie" V8 NE owners out there and they truly believe the ECU will compensate for most (if not all) mods. My point is that is wrong and if that guy's stang is his DD, it would be good "insurance" to pay $75 for three runs jsut to make sure it's 'safe'. BUt again, that's my opinion.
My response to age wasn't a butthurt. I ahve no idea where you got that from. It was merely an amusement that we are the same age.
As for my experience with stangs.....well, yeah, you can say I've owned a few. N/A, FI, Pushrod, and modular. For you to speak broadly about fords ECU being VERY forgiving seems ignorant to me. In an N/A 4V, slapping on a CAI/RAI, midpipe and carback, you should definitely have the A/F checked as it will go lean at WOT more times than not. ANd your comment in the other thread about the Cobra makes me seriously wonder what knowledge you have in modulars. At least in 4V's.
Even with your explenation, I still ahve no idea why you brought up tuning in your pushrod. It really has no bearing on this conversation IMO.
As for me....well, I did have to sell my procharged mach 1. Why? simple, taking care of my 4 kids on my own is more important. As for your childish and schoolyard attempt to slam me with your Honda comment; you're way off base. I dn't own an import thank you very much. But much like you, I went through a divorce and now have primary physical custody of my 4 kids so I'm doing what any responsible parent should do IMO. Doing for them!
Anything else N00b?
My response to age wasn't a butthurt. I ahve no idea where you got that from. It was merely an amusement that we are the same age.
As for my experience with stangs.....well, yeah, you can say I've owned a few. N/A, FI, Pushrod, and modular. For you to speak broadly about fords ECU being VERY forgiving seems ignorant to me. In an N/A 4V, slapping on a CAI/RAI, midpipe and carback, you should definitely have the A/F checked as it will go lean at WOT more times than not. ANd your comment in the other thread about the Cobra makes me seriously wonder what knowledge you have in modulars. At least in 4V's.
Even with your explenation, I still ahve no idea why you brought up tuning in your pushrod. It really has no bearing on this conversation IMO.
As for me....well, I did have to sell my procharged mach 1. Why? simple, taking care of my 4 kids on my own is more important. As for your childish and schoolyard attempt to slam me with your Honda comment; you're way off base. I dn't own an import thank you very much. But much like you, I went through a divorce and now have primary physical custody of my 4 kids so I'm doing what any responsible parent should do IMO. Doing for them!
Anything else N00b?
Last edited by prochargedpony; 05-07-2010 at 07:23 AM.
05-07-2010 | 11:26 AM
#30
Funny thing is it was a question, not a childish attempt to slam you, but thanks for playing. I was actually just trying to make conversation with you, hence the reason why I said I got rid of mine because of a divorce, if I was slamming you I would have said why get rid of the stang for a honda and went on from there. Congrats on the kids, I share custody of my daughter lucky my ex is a good person and would like me to be very active in our daughters life. I know quite a bit about 4v cars, my lincoln has an 03 cobra motor. Oh and if i was slamming you why would I have given you probs about knowing anything about mustangs......
That's almost like saying a Camaro has a Corvette engine in it.
05-07-2010 | 11:39 AM
#31
05-07-2010 | 11:43 AM
#32
My car has an 03 cobra motor swap!!!!!!!! I Know it wasn't stock with an 03 cobra motor!!!!!!!! If it did then I should have not shelled out 5600 for my cobra motor and t56 engine for the car.... If they did ****, I would pick them up for 1500-2500 all day long and sell the engine and transmission for 5g's and make some serious cash off that deal.
05-07-2010 | 01:15 PM
#33
TECH Apprentice
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 335
Likes: 0
From: CA
Funny thing is it was a question, not a childish attempt to slam you, but thanks for playing. I was actually just trying to make conversation with you, hence the reason why I said I got rid of mine because of a divorce, if I was slamming you I would have said why get rid of the stang for a honda and went on from there. Congrats on the kids, I share custody of my daughter lucky my ex is a good person and would like me to be very active in our daughters life. I know quite a bit about 4v cars, my lincoln has an 03 cobra motor. Oh and if i was slamming you why would I have given you probs about knowing anything about mustangs......
05-07-2010 | 01:30 PM
#34
Sorry when I replied I confused you with the other guy with the yellow gt in his sig and showed he sold it, that was my bad. I apologize for that.
