Best 16 injector intake.
01-21-2009, 09:13 PM
#22
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mine is a Beck. he'll make you anything you want for any heads you want.
this one is for LS7 style heads. Long story, but I actually had him make me two for this car, but I already sold the other one. i used an 8 injector setup, but he said he could have set it up for 16 easy.
this one is for LS7 style heads. Long story, but I actually had him make me two for this car, but I already sold the other one. i used an 8 injector setup, but he said he could have set it up for 16 easy.
01-21-2009, 09:31 PM
#23
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PSJ
My intake is just a GMPP intake (nothing fancy) with extra bungs welded in for the 16 injectors.
PWRTRIP - There are two ideas (maybe more?) behind running the 16 injectors.
1 - You need more injector (16 - 100+ injectors for instance
) and you don't or can't run the big boy injectors which are cost prohibitive.
2 - You run them in staged injection using BS3 (this is what I'm doing). So the primary injectors can be relatively small (lets say something like a 36) to allow you to have good resolution for idle and cruise, plus you don't need a lot of power to keep your car rolling on the highway. Then the second set comes in (both sets running) at a certain trigger point which provides enough fuel while under boost, etc.
With option 2 you can run a totaly seperate fuel system for each set of injectors. So you can have regular pump gas in your stock tank for startup, idle, and cruise. Then race gas in a small fuel cell for WOT, etc. That way you can run around on kill all the time, if so desired, without burning race gas sitting at a stop light. Kurt did this for the Power Tour and used something like one small tank of race gas for the entire tour. You just have to remember that you aren't running straight race gas once the second set of injectors comes in, you are running a mix of race gas/regular gas. Kurt was talking about running 87 octane at one point, but I'm not sure if he tried it out.
My car is going with the route above using a small fuel cell in the spare tire area (like Jim's car had).
My intake is just a GMPP intake (nothing fancy) with extra bungs welded in for the 16 injectors.
PWRTRIP - There are two ideas (maybe more?) behind running the 16 injectors.
1 - You need more injector (16 - 100+ injectors for instance
) and you don't or can't run the big boy injectors which are cost prohibitive.2 - You run them in staged injection using BS3 (this is what I'm doing). So the primary injectors can be relatively small (lets say something like a 36) to allow you to have good resolution for idle and cruise, plus you don't need a lot of power to keep your car rolling on the highway. Then the second set comes in (both sets running) at a certain trigger point which provides enough fuel while under boost, etc.
With option 2 you can run a totaly seperate fuel system for each set of injectors. So you can have regular pump gas in your stock tank for startup, idle, and cruise. Then race gas in a small fuel cell for WOT, etc. That way you can run around on kill all the time, if so desired, without burning race gas sitting at a stop light. Kurt did this for the Power Tour and used something like one small tank of race gas for the entire tour. You just have to remember that you aren't running straight race gas once the second set of injectors comes in, you are running a mix of race gas/regular gas. Kurt was talking about running 87 octane at one point, but I'm not sure if he tried it out.
My car is going with the route above using a small fuel cell in the spare tire area (like Jim's car had).
01-22-2009, 08:35 AM
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From what I understand BS3 activates both sets (although I could certainly be wrong). W2W had this useful calculation on their website for calculating the combined octane:
EO = ((SFR/(SFR+PFR))*HO)+((PFR/(SFR+PFR))*PO) where
EO - effective octane
SFR - secondary fuel injector flow rate
PFR - primary fuel injector flow rate
HO - secondary octane
PO - primary octane
The greater the spread in your injector flow rates, the higher your effective octane will be (assuming you are using the same primary and secondary fuels).
EO = ((SFR/(SFR+PFR))*HO)+((PFR/(SFR+PFR))*PO) where
EO - effective octane
SFR - secondary fuel injector flow rate
PFR - primary fuel injector flow rate
HO - secondary octane
PO - primary octane
The greater the spread in your injector flow rates, the higher your effective octane will be (assuming you are using the same primary and secondary fuels).
01-22-2009, 08:54 AM
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Here are a couple threads with some good discussion on it:
https://ls1tech.com/forums/forced-in...rking-out.html
https://ls1tech.com/forums/fueling-i...injectors.html
And a good summary post by Kurt:
The box is sequential, when it makes the second set come on it re-caculates the pulse width for the two injectors and fires them together in the original sequential order.
Most people that use this option are running methanol with 16 injectors on common fuel system. The only cars using the dual fuel that I know of are Jim and our Nova. I ran the Hot Rod Drag Week on 10 gallons of race gas for 1600miles, although 2 of the 5 tracks rained out.
Kurt
https://ls1tech.com/forums/forced-in...rking-out.html
https://ls1tech.com/forums/fueling-i...injectors.html
And a good summary post by Kurt:
The box is sequential, when it makes the second set come on it re-caculates the pulse width for the two injectors and fires them together in the original sequential order.
Most people that use this option are running methanol with 16 injectors on common fuel system. The only cars using the dual fuel that I know of are Jim and our Nova. I ran the Hot Rod Drag Week on 10 gallons of race gas for 1600miles, although 2 of the 5 tracks rained out.
Kurt
01-22-2009, 04:22 PM
#30
2 - You run them in staged injection using BS3 (this is what I'm doing). So the primary injectors can be relatively small (lets say something like a 36) to allow you to have good resolution for idle and cruise, plus you don't need a lot of power to keep your car rolling on the highway. Then the second set comes in (both sets running) at a certain trigger point which provides enough fuel while under boost, etc.
With option 2 you can run a totaly seperate fuel system for each set of injectors. So you can have regular pump gas in your stock tank for startup, idle, and cruise. Then race gas in a small fuel cell for WOT, etc. That way you can run around on kill all the time, if so desired, without burning race gas sitting at a stop light. Kurt did this for the Power Tour and used something like one small tank of race gas for the entire tour. You just have to remember that you aren't running straight race gas once the second set of injectors comes in, you are running a mix of race gas/regular gas. Kurt was talking about running 87 octane at one point, but I'm not sure if he tried it out.
My car is going with the route above using a small fuel cell in the spare tire area (like Jim's car had).
I want to set up a fuel cell like Stenod just did on Toonz's car except make it into two fuel cells. What I'm currently trying to figure out is how large to make each fuel cell. From my thought now which is completely random I'm thinking one 12 gallon tank with 93 and one 4 gallon tank with Q16 or the methanol my brother and I are working on, but I'm not sure.
I've also been trying to figure out what fuel pumps to put in each cell. At the moment I'm thinking dual walbro 340s in the large tank and a single in the race gas setup. I'm trying to decide on those versus running a denso supra pump. The densos flow a little more, but have a much larger draw. Thoughts?
From what I understand BS3 activates both sets (although I could certainly be wrong). W2W had this useful calculation on their website for calculating the combined octane:
EO = ((SFR/(SFR+PFR))*HO)+((PFR/(SFR+PFR))*PO) where
EO - effective octane
SFR - secondary fuel injector flow rate
PFR - primary fuel injector flow rate
HO - secondary octane
PO - primary octane
The greater the spread in your injector flow rates, the higher your effective octane will be (assuming you are using the same primary and secondary fuels).
EO = ((SFR/(SFR+PFR))*HO)+((PFR/(SFR+PFR))*PO) where
EO - effective octane
SFR - secondary fuel injector flow rate
PFR - primary fuel injector flow rate
HO - secondary octane
PO - primary octane
The greater the spread in your injector flow rates, the higher your effective octane will be (assuming you are using the same primary and secondary fuels).
Those two threads have hints of what I was planning on doing exactly. I'm glad you posted a link to them. I'm going to use stainless 1/2 inch tubing for a feed and return on both cells. The controller for the extra 4 injectors is from splitsec like Hunter02ss posted. I think it should be pretty cool. I have it costing around $1450 for the pumps, injectors, lines, fittings, and PCM setup. I still need to price a spacer for 4 extra injectors, the rails for that, fuel filters, fuel cell, and the regulators. I'm guessing it's going to be around $2600-2750 for the whole setup. It's expensive, but still a lot cheaper than running a staged BS3 system for $3000 and then having to buy both fuel systems.
