600rwhp FI: Building fuel system from scratch, lots of questions!!
03-28-2009, 01:28 PM
#1
600rwhp FI: Building fuel system from scratch, lots of questions!! I think I need to run some new fuel lines for my project car.
It has an LS1 with forged rods and dished pistons. I want to leave the door open for a supercharger making about 500-600 rwhp.
I am going to buy some aftermarket fuel rails.
1) What size fuel line should I run from the pump to the tank? What size line for the return?
2) Are aluminum (hard) fuel lines okay?
3) Do the aluminum Summit brand AN-style fittings work okay?
4) What pump (or pumps) should I run? The quieter the better. The fuel tank will have to be inline, not an intank. Would I want two inline pumps, a voltage regulator, some sort of boost-referenced switch?
5) Is there an affordable fuel filter out there that won't hold me back?
6) What regulators will get the job done and not cost a lot? Any brands/models to stay away from?
7) For this kind of application, would the fuel pressure regulator be controlled by the vacuum system, or run independent of engine vacuum? (Sorry but I know very little about fuel pressure regulators.)
Thanks, -Dave
It has an LS1 with forged rods and dished pistons. I want to leave the door open for a supercharger making about 500-600 rwhp.
I am going to buy some aftermarket fuel rails.
1) What size fuel line should I run from the pump to the tank? What size line for the return?
2) Are aluminum (hard) fuel lines okay?
3) Do the aluminum Summit brand AN-style fittings work okay?
4) What pump (or pumps) should I run? The quieter the better. The fuel tank will have to be inline, not an intank. Would I want two inline pumps, a voltage regulator, some sort of boost-referenced switch?
5) Is there an affordable fuel filter out there that won't hold me back?
6) What regulators will get the job done and not cost a lot? Any brands/models to stay away from?
7) For this kind of application, would the fuel pressure regulator be controlled by the vacuum system, or run independent of engine vacuum? (Sorry but I know very little about fuel pressure regulators.)
Thanks, -Dave
03-28-2009, 02:26 PM
#3
For 600rwhp you could do racetronix pump in tank, 60 pound injectors. stock reg,lines and filter should be fine and even stock rails.
If you plan to go past 600 then would say time to get serious. I am getting twin intank pump from lonnies with lines, boost referenced reg ,rails, filter. Good for 1000rwhp plus. Even the twin intank part of the system would likely be great for now and you could add the rest of it later. I am pretty sure system I am getting has 8 an feed lines and 6 an return. For 600rwhp likely could do 6 an feeds not sure on return. Most guys will run a boost referenced regulator and better filter as well as you start going up past your stated power level.
If you plan to go past 600 then would say time to get serious. I am getting twin intank pump from lonnies with lines, boost referenced reg ,rails, filter. Good for 1000rwhp plus. Even the twin intank part of the system would likely be great for now and you could add the rest of it later. I am pretty sure system I am getting has 8 an feed lines and 6 an return. For 600rwhp likely could do 6 an feeds not sure on return. Most guys will run a boost referenced regulator and better filter as well as you start going up past your stated power level.
03-28-2009, 02:37 PM
#4
Reply in bold...
I think I need to run some new fuel lines for my project car.
It has an LS1 with forged rods and dished pistons. I want to leave the door open for a supercharger making about 500-600 rwhp.
I am going to buy some aftermarket fuel rails.
1) What size fuel line should I run from the pump to the tank? What size line for the return?
-8 feed -6 return
2) Are aluminum (hard) fuel lines okay?
Yes but I prefer either SS hose or the ultralight
3) Do the aluminum Summit brand AN-style fittings work okay?
Yes, its a 60/40% they leak, they are cheaper for a reason.
4) What pump (or pumps) should I run? The quieter the better. The fuel tank will have to be inline, not an intank. Would I want two inline pumps, a voltage regulator, some sort of boost-referenced switch?
5) Is there an affordable fuel filter out there that won't hold me back?
The summit filters work fine.
6) What regulators will get the job done and not cost a lot? Any brands/models to stay away from?
My preference is Aeromotive, not sure you want to skimp on fuel, one bad move and you can kill your motor.
7) For this kind of application, would the fuel pressure regulator be controlled by the vacuum system, or run independent of engine vacuum? (Sorry but I know very little about fuel pressure regulators.)
The fuel pressure regulator will be vacuum and boost referenced to the intake.
Thanks, -Dave
It has an LS1 with forged rods and dished pistons. I want to leave the door open for a supercharger making about 500-600 rwhp.
I am going to buy some aftermarket fuel rails.
1) What size fuel line should I run from the pump to the tank? What size line for the return?
-8 feed -6 return
2) Are aluminum (hard) fuel lines okay?
Yes but I prefer either SS hose or the ultralight
3) Do the aluminum Summit brand AN-style fittings work okay?
Yes, its a 60/40% they leak, they are cheaper for a reason.
4) What pump (or pumps) should I run? The quieter the better. The fuel tank will have to be inline, not an intank. Would I want two inline pumps, a voltage regulator, some sort of boost-referenced switch?
5) Is there an affordable fuel filter out there that won't hold me back?
The summit filters work fine.
6) What regulators will get the job done and not cost a lot? Any brands/models to stay away from?
My preference is Aeromotive, not sure you want to skimp on fuel, one bad move and you can kill your motor.
7) For this kind of application, would the fuel pressure regulator be controlled by the vacuum system, or run independent of engine vacuum? (Sorry but I know very little about fuel pressure regulators.)
The fuel pressure regulator will be vacuum and boost referenced to the intake.
Thanks, -Dave
03-28-2009, 02:46 PM
#5
Troy
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03-28-2009, 03:20 PM
#9
I do want the system to be quiet- as quiet as possible. The factory Bosch pump is mounted in an insulated spare tire compartment on rubber mounts. Although it's not as quiet as an intank, it's not obtrusive to the passenger compartment, either.
As quiet as possible is the goal. Which one is best?:
1) Running one big pump all the time.
2) Running one pump and then having another pump turn on when the system goes into boost.
3) Having a voltage regulator ramp up the pump to get a little extra out of it when it goes into boost.
I want to find a balance between quiet, simple, reliable, and efficient, all using external pump(s). Making the Jag fuel tank accomodate an internal pump just isn't an option for me.
As quiet as possible is the goal. Which one is best?:
1) Running one big pump all the time.
2) Running one pump and then having another pump turn on when the system goes into boost.
3) Having a voltage regulator ramp up the pump to get a little extra out of it when it goes into boost.
I want to find a balance between quiet, simple, reliable, and efficient, all using external pump(s). Making the Jag fuel tank accomodate an internal pump just isn't an option for me.
03-28-2009, 04:34 PM
#11
This isn't a GM vehicle - I think my fuel lines are all 5/16". Heck, I think the feed tube coming out of my fuel tank is a 1/4" OD. (That will obviously need replaced.)
Would this be a good fuel pump and regulator choice?
Mallory 5110FI
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku
Recommended Regulator
Mallory 4305M
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku
Holley 512-504 Fuel Pressure Regulator
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku
One 25' roll of 1/2" tubing should be enough to run both a feed and return line, so I could probably get away with using 1/2" for both feed and return, right?
Would this be a good fuel pump and regulator choice?
Mallory 5110FI
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku
Recommended Regulator
Mallory 4305M
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku
Holley 512-504 Fuel Pressure Regulator
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku
One 25' roll of 1/2" tubing should be enough to run both a feed and return line, so I could probably get away with using 1/2" for both feed and return, right?
03-28-2009, 04:35 PM
#12
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with my 370 build, i bought an in-line 255 kit to help my in tank 255. I have 79# injectors up front to help. I don't plan on making more than 800rwhp on my new setup
03-28-2009, 06:22 PM
#14
Two Walbro 255s designed for external use would be great. They come with an insulating cover and rubber isolated clamps and are very quiet. You can barely here them when the engine is OFF on any of the LSx engine swaps I have done. When even the stock swap engines are running I have never been able to hear the pumps over the engine. One *should* get you close to 600HP, but two will do it much more safely.
03-28-2009, 06:46 PM
#15
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Two Walbro 255s designed for external use would be great. They come with an insulating cover and rubber isolated clamps and are very quiet. You can barely here them when the engine is OFF on any of the LSx engine swaps I have done. When even the stock swap engines are running I have never been able to hear the pumps over the engine. One *should* get you close to 600HP, but two will do it much more safely.
Thanks.
03-29-2009, 10:47 AM
#16
Yea, everyone says dual pumps but I have no idea exactly what that means. Yea, two pumps, I get that, but how are they hooked up - series or parallel? Do they run together all the time?
Not to Hijack the thread...but just wondering if the inline pumps are ran in series(in the same line) or Parallel (dual feed lines). Also, what mods would have to be done to the in-tank pump(f-body)?? Just remove the guts from the in-tank, and run the new external pumps?
Thanks.
Thanks.
03-29-2009, 02:36 PM
#17
Dual pump set up is when you have one pump that runs all the time and the other doesn't run until the hobbs switch turns it on. (When a supercharger or turbocharger starts to make boost and you have a predetermined point at which the engine requires more fuel the hobbs switch energizes the second pump to turn on and help out) This will allow you to cruise (low fuel demand) and not circulate that much fuel. If you had both pumps working all the time then you would be circulating a max amount of fuel all the time since the engine is not going to use all the fuel the system is sending it at cruising throttle positions. This would in turn cause problems with premature failure with the pumps. My suggestion is to call Lonnie at Lonnies Performance who is a sponser on the site. He can fix you up with anything and is very knowledgeable. Probably ought to move the thread to the fuel injection forum. You'll get a bigger response from there. Good luck. Chris
03-29-2009, 03:19 PM
#18
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