I've gone through this problem, not on an LS1 car, but with my Turbo Buick. After I put on the huge front mount intercooler, my cooling system was screwed. I tried the two pullers/one pusher setup and that was my biggest problem. Get rid of the front pusher and just use the two pullers. There is more air moving through the radiator at 35-40 mph than any of those fans can create anyway. The front pusher fan is just an obstruction. Also make sure you have some type of seal around the radiator to make the air go through it and not around it. The air dam underneath is also a good thing so make sure it's there. Check your fans strength, mine would pull a shop rag against the front grill and hold it there. That's pulling through the radiator, a/c condensor and the intercooler. Good luck, I feel your pain!

 

Hmmm, what is the average temp you have found most FI LS1 car to run at? My Aeroforce usually reads anywhere beterrn 202*-212* but it's never broke 214* even in dead of summer. But I also went without A/C this summer. Which I will never do again by the way, especially not with black leather seats, LMAO.

Your also gonna run a little hotter with the iron block now right? About how much of a increase is that supposed to be?

 

I really don't know man.. Good questions. Maybe 220 isn't HOT with an iron block. I know 230 is hotter than I'm comfortable with, but its not what I would say is overheating by any means. If we were in the middle of summer, and I had the AC going full blast and in stop and go traffic, I'd be fine with it topping out at 230°. I'm just afraid that if its at 230 right now, what would it be in the worst case scenario situation..

 

Have you tried running the A/C right now even with it cooler to see if it raises any? It'd be worth a shot. Then you could get a rough estimate cause if it jumps up while it's cool outside & the A/C on then we know your gonna have issues on hot days. But if it doesnt budge, maybe it'll only climb a couple degrees? What were your average temps on the old set-up & aluminum block? In the 220's? If so then thats 10* or less more than the old set-up & could probably be attributed to the iron block. I say test it with the A/C around town tonight even if you only go up to WalMart & back to see how temp. fluxuate.



Can some members with iron blocks tell us what your average temp is while driving around please so we can get a better idea?

 

Im pretty sure I already said it in this thread somewhere already, but I'm too lazy right now to go back and read thru it all. But my AC doesnt work right now. One of my lines broke and I lost all the refrigerant, so until I get a new line, I can't run my AC to test it.

 

oh ****, thats right. My bad, I totally forgot you mentioned that.

 

LOL no biggie. I got a bottle of water wetter on my way home. I'll try it out and see if it helps at all...

 

Ok, so I did a little testing tonight. Unfortunately, in the whole scheme of things, I ended up taking one step forward and about 3 backwards, but I gathered some interesting data at least along the way. Sorry for the long post, but I'm using this kind of for my own reference notes so I can look back on, and just incase anyone else out there runs into the same problem(s) this could possibly help them out too (that is- if I can ever figure out what the hell is goin on here).

So I started her up and was letting it idle in the driveway while adding the water wetter to the radiator. The system was pretty full, so I was only able to put half the bottle of WW in. The whole time in my driveway (about 27 minutes of idling), it never even got above 178. So I put the cap on and shut the hood and went inside and got my wallet to go for a spin. When I got back out to the car, JUST from putting the cap on, it had got to 185, and it steadily climbed just as I was making my way out of the neighborhood. By the time I got to the main street, it was already at 200. I thought that was interesting that when I pressurized the system, the temp went up like that. That kinda makes me think that perhaps the stock cap could be playing a role in it.

Alright, so I pulled out of the neighborhood and turned on the axillary fans and drove it around town for about 5 or 6 miles pretty rigorously. The temp climbed to about 217, and then creeped to about 221, but didnt go any higher. The WW looked as if it was working. (For reference, I am running probably 40% antifreeze/ 60% water). I then got to a 3 or 4 mile stretch of backroad where I decided to just cruise along at 55mph. There were no stop signs or anything, so no stopping or accelerating. The temp started going down, and by the time I got to a stop sign, it had subsided to 204. So I start driving it towards the highway for some 70mph cruising. I figured that would be a good test to see if I was getting sufficient airflow through the FMIC (altho, it seemed to me that I was since the 55mph stretch moved the temps down substantially).

I got onto the highway and then cruised north for about 10 miles at a constant 70mph with the cruise control set. The temp steadily kept going down til it was at 199. I then decided to turn around since I was getting kind of far and continue my test going back south towards my house instead of away from it. So I turned around, and then got back up to 70mph (just going easy- part throttle ~30-40%). The temp climbed to 204 by the time I was at 70mph, but then it slowly started going back down and it got to 199 again.

At that point, I figured I would turn the extra fans off and see if they were making any difference on the highway. I didn’t expect them to be doing much at 70mph, but why not.. So I flipped the switch off, and to my surprise, the temp started to creep up. It got to 209, then just kept on going and going and going.. It got to 220, and by that time, I was 10 miles away from my house in the other direction, so I exited the highway and turned back around again heading north. By the time I got to 70mph again, the temp had climbed to 233. I had suspicion that something was definitely up. Theres no way I should be at that temp on the highway with the 16” fan pulling air. I held out until it got to 237, then I went ahead and turned back on the extra fans to get it under control. So after about 20 miles this time going north, the temp had gone down to 222. I turned around and the temp climbed to 226, but then started going back down.

I finally got back around to the exit of the highway to go to my house, and as I had cruised up to the stop sign at the end of the exit ramp, it was at 213. I couldn’t get it to go back to 199 on the highway though, so by this time, I knew something was up for sure. I putted along back to my house, and the temp just kept climbing and climbing. When I finally made it into my driveway, the temp was at 247! I let it idle for a minute to see if it would help, but it shot up to 251, and I immediately shut the engine off.

Ok, so I turned the key back on, and turned my switch off for the aux fans to see if the main 16” fan was working. Just as I suspected, it wasn’t. I do know for a fact it was working when I left my house because I could feel it blowing, and it was keeping the temps in check idling in my driveway before I turned my aux fans on when I went for my drive. So I check the main big 40 amp fuse for the fans and sure enough, its busted Ok, paperclip to the rescue for a quick temporary fix. But the fan still didn’t kick back on. At that point, I was starting to think that I had blown the fan motor.

Just for a little (more) background info, my ATI 16” fan motor gave up the ghost last thanksgiving when I was out of town and I drove the car back home with it running in the 230’s on the highway. This was with the stock radiator at the time. I replaced the waterpump, thermostat, radiator, 16” fan, and added the additional 7” fan at that time. The very day I got her back up and running from all that is when the intake manifold blew up. So this whole cooling system is pretty much all new.

ANYWAY! I thought I had ruined ANOTHER fan somehow since switching around relays didn’t turn the fan back on either. Ok, so I’m wondering right now if I have a wiring issue. Blowing a 40 amp fuse has to mean something is not right. (BTW, I blew 2 40A fuses when my ATI 16” fan crapped out on me). I started thinking of how I had the fan wired up. I have it wired with the ground from the #2 fan and the positive from BOTH #1 and #2 fans spliced together to the positive side of the 16” fan. I figured maybe that’s my problem. I cut the + wire coming from the #2 fan, so now its just got one + coming from the #1 fan relay. Turned the key on and got no voltage from the plug. At that point, I was VERY worried. So I actually turned the engine on and went back under the car to check it, and sure enough, its getting 13.9V. So I plug the fan in, and it starts blowing. The temp resided back to 190 idling in my driveway with all 3 fans on.

Alright, so things learned:
1) pressurizing the system makes the temp go up (does that mean I need a new cap? Or does it mean I've got air pockets STILL somewhere in the system?)
2) The extra fans DO help, but they are NOT sufficient enough to stop it from overheating if the main fan is not working- at least on the city streets, they will suffice on the highway, but thats it.
3) I have a horrible OIL leak somewhere! It must have leaked 1/4 of a quart from sitting in my driveway after I got back from testing. I think I know what it is though. When I was putting everything back together, I remember tightening my oil pressure sensor hand tight, but I don’t recall ever using a wrench on it.. I'm HOPING that’s all it is. And since I have to take the intake manifold off anyways to diagnose the knock sensors, that’s not a big deal to do while I’m at it under there.
4) Maybe my old wiring was putting too much stress on the electrical system. I’m hoping that the way I have it wired now works. If it doesn’t, I’m gonna just hook up the main 16” fan to its own designated relay, and it will be on at all times. I don’t think I need to worry about the system being too cold, and it would definitely eliminate anymore headaches and wondering about the stock wiring.
5) I typed entirely WAYYYYY too much in this post. please forgive me

 

ok i just installed all my turbo stuff and i just realized, a lot of guys are throwing away the black plastic piece that is angled towards the radiator because it "is in the way of the intercooler" but if you look from the bottom of the car, the plastic air dam on the bottom pushes air up towards the radiator and then that plastic piece pushes it back toward the radiator, i almost got rid of it myself until i thought about it. i just trimmed it so it sits up against the intercooler. and yes air can still go through the IC. you know which piece im talking about? i can post a pic later if needed

 

Yes, I know what you are talking about. And yes, my air dam is on. Infact, it is new too because I had cut the old one to make room for my old dual IC setup. (The supplied procharger kit).. But now I have a new one that is full length. And btw, my new FMIC is not typical, it is mounted horizontally. (parallel to the road) So I rely very much on that air dam scooping up air!

https://ls1tech.com/forums/forced-in...c-project.html

 

you, sir, are blocking the radiator! im not talking about the air dam i was talking about the big aluminum piece. but judging from your pictures, the airflow (even with your little tunnel from the license plate) is all jacked up going to the radiator. first, the air dam is right next to the intercooler.


the airdam isnt angled enough to make the air all of a sudden turn at a right angle and go up through the intercooler. if your airdam was twice as low and swooped more forward, it might work better.

second- the air that does make it through the IC will be hotter and the flow will be turbulent. then it hits your aluminum shroud and turns again into the radiator. also keep in mind that the more fans sitting on the radiator, the less surface area you have. honeslty i think all your issues are from the intercooler placement. i wish i could explain all that better, i dont know how to type all that so it makes sense :/

 

Well, for one, that pic you quoted above isn't how I ended up running the piping, scroll down to post#9 in my FMIC thread..

I understand your concern. Believe me, I've wondered that myself. However, go back and read post#48 in this thread. At highway speeds (with the fans on) The ECTs are NOT a problem. That in itself right there tells me the air dam provides enough air to get into the cavity above the IC and be sucked in through the radiator.

Yes, it will definitely be warmer than ambient air since it has had to go through the IC, but I really don't think that is my main problem. I am not the first one to do a horizontal FMIC. I've seen it done a few times, and to the best of my knowledge, none of the other guys had ECT issues.

 

Oh yeah, just had to add one more problem to the list that I realized tonight. My BPV is stuck open. I was looking at it when the car was off, and it was wide open. I am pretty sure that is because I was lazy when I repainted it this time around, and I didnt take it apart, so some paint must have got in there on the stem of the valve and clogged the orface up So I get to look forward to fixing that too! I swear, it never ends

 

sounds like the fans were cooling it on the freeway, not the airflow itself.

 

I agree with the radiator being blocked off from airflow! And I think you tripped out your fans because they became overloaded. Bear with me because it's gonna sound *** backwards but it's true. It's never a good idea to encase a radiator or any kinda of H/E the way you did with the aluminum sheet metal and have all the sides sealed in. Any H/E is a restriction to airflow in general if placed in an air-stream(no surprise there). If you seal up the edges of a radiator in an attempt to force air through it you will end up causing a positive area infront of the radiator where air will stall, at which point the air will act as a buffer and air will find it's way elsewhere.
IIRC, the orifice in front of a H/E should be 3/4th of area of the H/E itself, it should actually be smaller than the H/E. Conterintuative I know. It should also be 6-8 inches away from the H/E to allow the space between to act as a volute. There's some good books about how to maximize air-flow around H/E.

I would suggest taking the license plate cover off and and open that flap, run it around like you just did, with and without fans and see what happens.

 

i think you got a crack in a cylinder sleeve. have you detonated this motor?

 

I would pray to jebus not. this motor just got assembled & instantly had the overheating issues.


And Chad I believe it's perfectly normal for the system to increase heat with the cap on. If you think about it with the cap off it's allowing heat to exit the neck along with steam. Once you cap that it's trapped inside to circulate the system, so technically it should build some heat. I know with my car by the time I'm a few miles from my house it's up to 204*. I never see sub 200* temps at any point after I start driving. My temps usually climb up to 206-208* in slow stop & go traffic.

 

I disagree. If it were the fans, then it would not have cooled off from 220 to 199 by getting on the highway. If it were the fans alone, driving around town vs driving on the highway wouldnt make a difference in ECTs.

So why does the stock system have a shroud then? And there definitely isnt 6-8" away from the front of the condenser from the stock shroud.

I do think opening up the front "tunnel" behind my license plate filler panel would indeed be a good test. I'll have to modify the shroud though because I never did get around to doing that part when I put the shroud together. So that idea never made it past mock-up. It will definitely be done now though.

Good lord, I sure hope you are kidding or wrong! This motor is brand spankin new! It hasnt been above 40% throttle, and I dont see at all how it could have dteonated.

Yea, I'd be happy if it would run in the 200-210 range. I think I can get it there with some more tweaking. The WW did seem to drop temps about 10 degrees, so I'm on the way.

 

Take a look at these fans. I used these on my GN...yeah I know they're not for an LS1 Camaro. Well I ran a Camaro aluminum radiator in the GN an it fit perfectly. These fans fit the radiator perfectly after you trim off the outer mounting tabs. My intercooler caused my car to heat badly...I put these fans on and booya! It went from 220+ steady to 165-170 steady in 100 deg heat outside. These will move some serious air and they're cheap too.


http://www.gbodyparts.com/product_in...9c405b1e4c488b

I'm not sure if they will fit or not, but its just a suggestion from my previous experience using them.

 

Yea man, they wont fit I guarantee it. The procharger is too close to the radiator for anything bigger than a 9" fan on the drivers side.