silent_soul

iTrader: (2)

I never once considered that....would solve alot of the piping issues and help my put it on the drivers side(less things would need to be moved)

I think I might do that, no idea why i never thought of that. one of the many reasons I posted this on here(looking for great and useful insight)

Pocket

iTrader: (22)

Wow, where to begin...

First off, a remote setup will work fine. Give it a go. If you can mount it solidly and inline with the crank, everything will work fine

Remote setups allow for easy use of an ATA intercooler and plenty of pipe to mount a meth kit if desired

The ford blowers are all self contained units, so mount them anywhere the fit your chassis and let it spin. T-bird M90s are the only ones without a built in bypass valve. Use a Saab/bosche unit with them. They can be angled or flipped without consequence

The whine come from air being compressed in the SC. Mount the TB downstream and the SC will whine constantly. Mount it to the SC and it will be quieter out of throttle, but the increased plenum will reduce throttle response

50% decrease in efficiency is totally false. If anything the overall efficiency can be bolstered by a better intercooler not restricted to what you can fit under the head unit

silent_soul

iTrader: (2)

Thanks man, your thread was found while i was looking up info, and is booked marked(tons of good info)

I figure ill get the project parts and planning and some progress and hopefully then it will come off less like a wild dream. Right now trying to pick up the s/c, spare hood, some more piping, and figuring where the easiest point to mount for least work will be.

I still think im going to mount it on the passenger side, just because I dont want to block my view on the driver side if I can avoid it any. It will also force me to clean up my engine bay alittle bit which is already on the to do list.

Pocket

iTrader: (22)

I've got my old m122 kit still and I'd let it go for a reasonable number. Also have a m122 and cobra m112 blowers I bought for the next project, but not sure ill go with them anymore

Shoot me a PM if you want one

firebird_1995

iTrader: (1)

Jon (pocket) is a great guy and fabricator. If they're still available, I would highly reccomened hitting him up for one of his pre made kits. I can guarantee you will save a considerable amount of time and probably money too by going this direction. Earlier this year I built a remote mount kit for an lt1 in my Monte Carlo SS. Initially I set out to mount the throttle body to the inlet of the supercharger and found out through a lot of trial, error, money, and time that when running it remote and through an intercooler there is just too much plenum volume to achive a decent idle below 1600 rpms. I eventually moved the throttle body to the stock location and am currently finishing up on some small details. It does make a lot of noise at idle this way because the supercharger is pulling in air completely unrestricted at the inlet, and the bypass valve has to exhaust the unused air back into the inlet side of the supercharger. I recently bought a standard BOV used on the centrifugal style of superchargers and have just started playing with it in an effort to keep the noise down at idle and to help driveability at part throttle. As soon as the rain stops here it is ready to road test.
As far as loosing any advantage of the roots style blowers by remote mounting goes, I've seen in my prior datalogs during road tuning that the map sensor reports -6 psi of vacuum (part throttle cruise pressure) to +10psi of boost in .45 seconds.Although, I've never seen what a traditional style roots setup does in comparison, I felt that it was a decent result.

Pocket

iTrader: (22)

I never tried it, but an idea to quiet the remote SC is a twin TB setup. Stock unit with all the sensors in the stock location, then a larger unit, say 102mm off ebay mounted pre-SC. No sensors on the big TB, bump the stop so its constantly open a little, then use a throttle cam setup like one from a Fiero to make a progressive cable system. Therefor, the intake mounted TB acts like a normal TB and the larger TB mounted to the SC only throttles incoming air. If the SC doesnt have much air to compress, it doesnt make any noise and the progressive opening would keep it closed for 90% of standard driving time

Never built it, but did a good bit of brainstorming on the issue

For those wondering, heres my old setup


In the car using the old tensioner bracket. I redesigned it to move the tensioner to the slack side to correct an early design flaw


Pic of the custom balancer hub assembly I designed. It uses a custom cut hub, centering ring, LT1 balancer, stand off spool and inverted 10 rib SBC pulley


How it sits now. If anyone wants it, shoot me a PM

firebird_1995

iTrader: (1)

I actually did a little testing with a dual tb setup. It helped quiet it down at idle but I was concerned with the rate the supercharger tb opened in relation to the intake tb. It felt to me like at part throttle with the bypass closed (making boost) there was a dead spot where maybe the supercharger tb needed to be wide open. This is the only pic I've got of the setup. Basically I used an arm off the supercharger tb to pull open the intake tb. It was crude but worked. I didn't spend much time with that setup after feeling the "dead spot" but it may have been an easy fix with adjusting the length of the arm. I did some idle tuning with the BOV setup yesterday and it seems promising.

SSZ

Very interesting. Do you guys have any pics of the piece you bolt to the bottom of the S/C to channel the air to the engine? Intriguing for sure. Were you guys happy with the results?

Ping King

iTrader: (20)

Couldn't you also plumb a large bypass in and remove the tb from the inlet of the blower? It should function the same way..no?

firebird_1995

iTrader: (1)

I'm pretty happy with it. The power is right on tap. Its a little loud but some people like it that way. I'm trying to figure out how to upload pics from my phone right now but I've got an entire build thread with the whole process here...
http://ltxtech.com/forums/showthread...Carlo SS build
I'll try to upload some pics

Pocket

iTrader: (22)

I was thinking about a progressive opening. Play with the ratio between the main and upstream TB to work out any dead spots. Probably set the idle screw on the upstream to 5% or w/e so the TB never closes. This allows some air to feed the engine when at low throttle. Probably set the upstream to be WOT above 50% or so intake TB. Just rough estimates though

Curious to see how the BOV works with the rest of the system. I tried a BOV on my M90 setup and it didnt work out so well. Used a bosche (porsche) BPV and it idled and ran great idle/part throttle/WOT. The stock BPV on the M122 never gave me any trouble with managing boost. I ported it to the rear of the intake so when the TB was closed, the intake was in vacuum, so the BPV opened. If mounting the TB to the SC inlet, the BPV must be ported to the neck between the TB and rotors

Mid-fab pic, but it gets the idea across. Simple design really, take the oddball outlet shape pointed down and forms it to a 3" tube pointed forward. The BPV is part of the SC, so the half tube running back connects the charge pipe to the BPV which puts the air back in the SC inlet


For what I had in it, yes. I feel my setup is more drag oriented vs street from the excessive noise. It was very consistent, for what it was

From a noise perspective, no. You could mount a 4" BPV and it still be noisy. The sound comes from air being compressed by the rotors, as you naturally hear when the car is at WOT. As long as there is air in the SC, it will be compressed. A BPV vents the pressurized air to a non-pressurized area, so boost drops back to vacuum, like when you're at idle or low throttle. The pressure/vacuum of the charge pipe makes no difference on the presence of air in the SC, so the noise will persist

Instant torque is intoxicating. Main reason I put a SC vs turbo on all my toys

firebird_1995

iTrader: (1)

So far its working pretty good. It did quiet it down at idle a little bit. I mainly did it to have better control over the boost. I suppose I've got a mild cam so I don't have a very strong vacuum signal to begin with. The stock m122 bypass closed around 10" of vacuum on my setup which made for poor driveability at part throttle. I could only go about 25% throttle before it would kick in. I did a lot of reading on the ford sites to see what the stock gt500's were like in terms of boost and drivability and I think the reason the bypass works better for them is the location they source the vacuum for the valve. Because they are ahead of the rotor, they never see boost on that line, and I would be willing to bet the vacuum signal is a little stronger than it would be after the rotors.
What issues did you have with the BOV on your m90 setup?

Pocket

iTrader: (22)

The BOV on the m90 was in an elbow next to the sc outlet. It would pop open as it should, but at idle it stayed closed. The sc would continue to pressurize the air to the TB until it over powered the poppet valve or blew a coupler off. The 4" 90* bend at the TB was silicone and would balloon to about 6"

Switching to the external BPV fixed that. I later switched to an aftermarket part to change the spring rate. It didn't seem to do anything