Well balanced 1000rwhp NO lag setup?
01-22-2017, 12:04 PM
#1
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Well balanced 1000rwhp NO lag setup? I have maxed out my harrop HTV 2300 supercharger for 2 race seasons now. Strugling with high IAT because its running overspeed.
Setup feels really good with NO "lag" and I got 800whp and 1100rwnm. But the IAT gets to high. Tried meth injection, oversized cooling system and so on but the supercharger are just a heat pump..
So I am thinking of testing a twin turbo setup. I want around 1000rwhp lots of torque and dont need any room for going higher.
I am used to the supercharger and want instant power with a broad powerband.
I know it will never be as good as a supercharger, but what turbo setup will be the best for my goals? costs no issue.
What turbos?
Header setup?
Tips?
Fuel system and block are good to go.
AFR 230 heads
Steel block
4" cank
FI cam
Manual sequensial trans
Setup feels really good with NO "lag" and I got 800whp and 1100rwnm. But the IAT gets to high. Tried meth injection, oversized cooling system and so on but the supercharger are just a heat pump..
So I am thinking of testing a twin turbo setup. I want around 1000rwhp lots of torque and dont need any room for going higher.
I am used to the supercharger and want instant power with a broad powerband.
I know it will never be as good as a supercharger, but what turbo setup will be the best for my goals? costs no issue.
What turbos?
Header setup?
Tips?
Fuel system and block are good to go.
AFR 230 heads
Steel block
4" cank
FI cam
Manual sequensial trans
01-22-2017, 03:19 PM
#4
9 Second Club
No matter what lies anyone tells you.....you will never get the same instant hit, ie NO lag from turbos as you will with a supercharger.
Other than perhaps running a very effective anti-lag system ( and running turbo components to live with sustained use of it )
As the others say...fit a bigger blower. It is that simple. There is a new 2650cc blower if you wanted to stay with a Rootes, or go for the more efficient Whipple
https://www.superchargerforums.com/t...rcharger.3404/
Of course, do not overlook a good centrifugal either, it may well be better suited to drifting and cool air anyway.
But as with any blower....assuming belts live. Drifting would be a harsh environment for that.
For turbos, the easiest thing I can suggest is to browse the Gen5 forum. There seem to be more TT kits there than most other forums.
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=74
As for headers....entirely up to you and what there is room to fit on your car. But you do not need anything fancy for that power level, and OEM cast manifolds will be robust and generally do lend themselves well to faster spooling. Turbos like heat, keeping the turbo close to the engine is good.
As for turbos....there really are so many out there these days, but for fast spool and transient spool....the EFR's are probably the best bet. These would easily do 1k...although you could maybe go for a slightly smaller unit.
https://agpturbo.com/borg-warner-efr-7670/
I'd sooner spend the money on the right turbos before worrying about fancy manifolds.
For intercooler....fabricate a unit using a Garrett core. They are the best. Although Bell and Treadstone do similar high density cores now too of Garrett dont have anything in the correct size.
And as mentioned earlier...may as well make use of anti-lag too if you can. Fit a decent ecu, run DBW and you will have all the options you could think of. It'll make anti-lag easy, it'll make throttle blip downshifts easy for the seq box too. So in general, an all round better package.
With any decent anti-lag system though you wont be able to run a brake booster for obvious reasons. Although if you're a serious drifter I doubt you'd have one anyway due to the braking setup.
Other than perhaps running a very effective anti-lag system ( and running turbo components to live with sustained use of it )
As the others say...fit a bigger blower. It is that simple. There is a new 2650cc blower if you wanted to stay with a Rootes, or go for the more efficient Whipple
https://www.superchargerforums.com/t...rcharger.3404/
Of course, do not overlook a good centrifugal either, it may well be better suited to drifting and cool air anyway.
But as with any blower....assuming belts live. Drifting would be a harsh environment for that.
For turbos, the easiest thing I can suggest is to browse the Gen5 forum. There seem to be more TT kits there than most other forums.
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=74
As for headers....entirely up to you and what there is room to fit on your car. But you do not need anything fancy for that power level, and OEM cast manifolds will be robust and generally do lend themselves well to faster spooling. Turbos like heat, keeping the turbo close to the engine is good.
As for turbos....there really are so many out there these days, but for fast spool and transient spool....the EFR's are probably the best bet. These would easily do 1k...although you could maybe go for a slightly smaller unit.
https://agpturbo.com/borg-warner-efr-7670/
I'd sooner spend the money on the right turbos before worrying about fancy manifolds.
For intercooler....fabricate a unit using a Garrett core. They are the best. Although Bell and Treadstone do similar high density cores now too of Garrett dont have anything in the correct size.
And as mentioned earlier...may as well make use of anti-lag too if you can. Fit a decent ecu, run DBW and you will have all the options you could think of. It'll make anti-lag easy, it'll make throttle blip downshifts easy for the seq box too. So in general, an all round better package.
With any decent anti-lag system though you wont be able to run a brake booster for obvious reasons. Although if you're a serious drifter I doubt you'd have one anyway due to the braking setup.
01-22-2017, 06:13 PM
#5
Idk why more guys who max out there blower don't just add a turbo to it. Yes you do lose some of the bottom end power since until the turbo spools your blower is "sucking" through it and blowers don't like to suck.
I built a setup like this with a S480 feeding a TVS1900 and it worked pretty well. Still not as well as a blower by itself or a big turbo by itself, but was a good middle ground for no lag and more than a blower could do by itself.
I built a setup like this with a S480 feeding a TVS1900 and it worked pretty well. Still not as well as a blower by itself or a big turbo by itself, but was a good middle ground for no lag and more than a blower could do by itself.
01-22-2017, 08:30 PM
#6
Idk why more guys who max out there blower don't just add a turbo to it. Yes you do lose some of the bottom end power since until the turbo spools your blower is "sucking" through it and blowers don't like to suck.
I built a setup like this with a S480 feeding a TVS1900 and it worked pretty well. Still not as well as a blower by itself or a big turbo by itself, but was a good middle ground for no lag and more than a blower could do by itself.
I built a setup like this with a S480 feeding a TVS1900 and it worked pretty well. Still not as well as a blower by itself or a big turbo by itself, but was a good middle ground for no lag and more than a blower could do by itself.
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01-23-2017, 02:09 AM
#8
Idk why more guys who max out there blower don't just add a turbo to it. Yes you do lose some of the bottom end power since until the turbo spools your blower is "sucking" through it and blowers don't like to suck.
I built a setup like this with a S480 feeding a TVS1900 and it worked pretty well. Still not as well as a blower by itself or a big turbo by itself, but was a good middle ground for no lag and more than a blower could do by itself.
I built a setup like this with a S480 feeding a TVS1900 and it worked pretty well. Still not as well as a blower by itself or a big turbo by itself, but was a good middle ground for no lag and more than a blower could do by itself.
As Steve and others have said, go for a bigger blower! Istant power when you want it.
Although I have to ask why do you need the extra power? There are some successful drifters running NA LS engines. Do you really need 1000rwhp to smoke tires?
Is there an option to fit a larger intercooler? If it's the older top mounted design can you not fit a spaced between the lid and base of the maifold and run a taller intercooler brick? There was someone doing this for truck setups.
01-23-2017, 04:02 AM
#9
9 Second Club
Idk why more guys who max out there blower don't just add a turbo to it. Yes you do lose some of the bottom end power since until the turbo spools your blower is "sucking" through it and blowers don't like to suck.
I built a setup like this with a S480 feeding a TVS1900 and it worked pretty well. Still not as well as a blower by itself or a big turbo by itself, but was a good middle ground for no lag and more than a blower could do by itself.
I built a setup like this with a S480 feeding a TVS1900 and it worked pretty well. Still not as well as a blower by itself or a big turbo by itself, but was a good middle ground for no lag and more than a blower could do by itself.
What sort of power delivery did it have ? Should still have been a blast ?
01-23-2017, 04:43 AM
#10
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Thanks for all the great replys! 
Fitting a bigger blower may just be the best solution.
I have been thinking of the 4L and 4,5L whipple. But its a freaking huge unit! Anyone know what the weight is? The weight will also be really high, above the hood actually.
Is there any more info about the front inlet 4,5L whipple? Cant find much
Yes I have tried a bigger intercooler. Today I have a normal sized engine radiator, an12 lines and a 50gallon waterpump. Thats only for inlet cooling!
Almost the same setup as I use for the engine itself, but with rear mounted radiator.
Turbo AND supercharger goes against my building filosofi. Less is more. Less parst to **** up. Keeping it simple, safe and reliable are important. Thats one of the reasons I went with a supercharger setup.
Yes I need 1000rwhp You can se the car in action in this video from Gatebil. I am the bright yellow car from 3.30. This is on sticky semislick tires and a rearend setup like a drag car for maximum grip.
Fitting a bigger blower may just be the best solution.
I have been thinking of the 4L and 4,5L whipple. But its a freaking huge unit! Anyone know what the weight is? The weight will also be really high, above the hood actually.
Is there any more info about the front inlet 4,5L whipple? Cant find much
Yes I have tried a bigger intercooler. Today I have a normal sized engine radiator, an12 lines and a 50gallon waterpump. Thats only for inlet cooling!
Almost the same setup as I use for the engine itself, but with rear mounted radiator.
Turbo AND supercharger goes against my building filosofi. Less is more. Less parst to **** up. Keeping it simple, safe and reliable are important. Thats one of the reasons I went with a supercharger setup.
Yes I need 1000rwhp
You can se the car in action in this video from Gatebil. I am the bright yellow car from 3.30. This is on sticky semislick tires and a rearend setup like a drag car for maximum grip.
01-23-2017, 10:50 AM
#12
IAT's were never a problem because the turbo isn't really working hard to make pressure, it's just supplying the blower with a lot more volume of air so it's really not heating the air up much.
It was a lot of fun! Like I said, it lacked a little on the bottom of a blower only setup, and lacked a little on the top of a turbo only setup, but the middle was AWESOME! lol
The Hellion guys did this kind of a setup and made 1000hp with it on a Mustang back in the day but it took 40lbs of boost to do it. Took the blower off and made the same 1000hp with 30lbs of turbo only but he said they really missed the instant power from the blower on the bottom, lol
01-23-2017, 10:52 AM
#13
9 Second Club
Good video.
-12 lines would be pretty small for a water chargecooler...you'd really want lines around 3/4 to 1". -12 are nowhere near that
As said, search the Gen5 forum, there are lots of twin turbo kits there. As to whether their AGP low mount kit would fit your car....I'd guess probably not. But you could build something similar. The Gen5's seem to have lots of ground clearance and I suspect your car would be a lot lower.
I made mine along those lines, but as I had less ground clearance had to lift the turbos up a bit, so mine sit no lower than the base of the sump. But it is tight. It leaves a lot of room free up top like that and makes downpipes dead easy vs top mount turbos. Just depends where you have the room though and what might work best for you.
-12 lines would be pretty small for a water chargecooler...you'd really want lines around 3/4 to 1". -12 are nowhere near that
As said, search the Gen5 forum, there are lots of twin turbo kits there. As to whether their AGP low mount kit would fit your car....I'd guess probably not. But you could build something similar. The Gen5's seem to have lots of ground clearance and I suspect your car would be a lot lower.
I made mine along those lines, but as I had less ground clearance had to lift the turbos up a bit, so mine sit no lower than the base of the sump. But it is tight. It leaves a lot of room free up top like that and makes downpipes dead easy vs top mount turbos. Just depends where you have the room though and what might work best for you.
01-23-2017, 11:08 AM
#14
Restricted User
Good video.
-12 lines would be pretty small for a water chargecooler...you'd really want lines around 3/4 to 1". -12 are nowhere near that
As said, search the Gen5 forum, there are lots of twin turbo kits there. As to whether their AGP low mount kit would fit your car....I'd guess probably not. But you could build something similar. The Gen5's seem to have lots of ground clearance and I suspect your car would be a lot lower.
I made mine along those lines, but as I had less ground clearance had to lift the turbos up a bit, so mine sit no lower than the base of the sump. But it is tight. It leaves a lot of room free up top like that and makes downpipes dead easy vs top mount turbos. Just depends where you have the room though and what might work best for you.
-12 lines would be pretty small for a water chargecooler...you'd really want lines around 3/4 to 1". -12 are nowhere near that
As said, search the Gen5 forum, there are lots of twin turbo kits there. As to whether their AGP low mount kit would fit your car....I'd guess probably not. But you could build something similar. The Gen5's seem to have lots of ground clearance and I suspect your car would be a lot lower.
I made mine along those lines, but as I had less ground clearance had to lift the turbos up a bit, so mine sit no lower than the base of the sump. But it is tight. It leaves a lot of room free up top like that and makes downpipes dead easy vs top mount turbos. Just depends where you have the room though and what might work best for you.
01-23-2017, 11:12 AM
#15
9 Second Club
Go measure inside the hose fittings. They will not be 3/4"
I had to use -12 teflon fittings for my oil lines just to ensure no fitting was smaller than 12.5mm as per block internal galleries.
The smallest ID on those fittings was around 14mm. ( 3/4" would imply 19mm )
Same with people using -10 for oil...that will drop things down to near 10mm at the fittings which is smaller than internal block galleries.
I had to use -12 teflon fittings for my oil lines just to ensure no fitting was smaller than 12.5mm as per block internal galleries.
The smallest ID on those fittings was around 14mm. ( 3/4" would imply 19mm )
Same with people using -10 for oil...that will drop things down to near 10mm at the fittings which is smaller than internal block galleries.
01-23-2017, 11:12 AM
#16
Since it is a track only car you could try E85 or even straight methanol for fuel, but it does require a careful maintenance routine. 410 sprint cars are around 950 hp and run similar speeds with a tiny 12" x 20" radiator and don't normally have cooling issues. Sprint cars don't even have a fan for the radiator.
01-23-2017, 11:40 AM
#19
01-23-2017, 11:48 AM
#20
TECH Fanatic
