Help with knock above 10lbs of boost
9 Second Club
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 13,616
Likes: 185
From: Norn Iron
Originally Posted by stevieturbo
Well I'm sure the fairys arent tuning them....There must be some human involvement.
As Forcefed has described. If you're tuning on a dyno, there really should be no need to go near the plugs.
As Forcefed has described. If you're tuning on a dyno, there really should be no need to go near the plugs.
Geebus, didn't mean to start an in depth discussion what's the best method to monitor for knock. I was just curious cause there seems to be the camp of "watch for knock" then there's the camp of "above a certain mod level or hp, knock sensors suck so just read the plugs". It seems like somewhere in the middle is where the best method lies. Typically I relax the knock tables a bit, especially the recovery rate since the factory has is ridiculously slow. This way I can see more precisely where it's picking up knock. Then after a driving/tuning session I'll pull a plug or 2 and make sure there are no signs of detonation which will agree with my logs.
Has the engine been opened up? As in such items as the knock sensors been removed?
If so, and they are not properly torqued, there's a source of "incurable knock".
BTDT: Turbo Buicks are notorious for fubar'd sensor installs.
If so, and they are not properly torqued, there's a source of "incurable knock".
BTDT: Turbo Buicks are notorious for fubar'd sensor installs.
hey man steve likes to use sensors. can't "knock" him for it. there are a hundred ways to skin this cat.
sheeit back in the day my grandpappy had a stethoscope with a long steel rod on the end. it was a multipurpose bearing/valvetrain/knock detector
actually that sounds like an awesome tool to have...i wonder if they still make it
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Originally Posted by truckdoug
hey man steve likes to use sensors. can't "knock" him for it. there are a hundred ways to skin this cat.
sheeit back in the day my grandpappy had a stethoscope with a long steel rod on the end. it was a multipurpose bearing/valvetrain/knock detector
actually that sounds like an awesome tool to have...i wonder if they still make it
sheeit back in the day my grandpappy had a stethoscope with a long steel rod on the end. it was a multipurpose bearing/valvetrain/knock detector
actually that sounds like an awesome tool to have...i wonder if they still make it
Thx, guys, TRUCKDOUG im gonna try posting it lets see if this works.
Btw, im all over the sloppy stuff been for years, its why i went turbo actually. I only found one tune for hp tuners that was close to my setup, but the injectors were bigger and i figured it would skew alot of things.
Btw, im all over the sloppy stuff been for years, its why i went turbo actually. I only found one tune for hp tuners that was close to my setup, but the injectors were bigger and i figured it would skew alot of things.
9 Second Club
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 13,616
Likes: 185
From: Norn Iron
The bottom line here is the dyno operator doesnt appear to know how to tune based on information supplied. Although that info is also rather sparse.
9 Second Club
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 13,616
Likes: 185
From: Norn Iron
hey man steve likes to use sensors. can't "knock" him for it. there are a hundred ways to skin this cat.
sheeit back in the day my grandpappy had a stethoscope with a long steel rod on the end. it was a multipurpose bearing/valvetrain/knock detector
actually that sounds like an awesome tool to have...i wonder if they still make it
sheeit back in the day my grandpappy had a stethoscope with a long steel rod on the end. it was a multipurpose bearing/valvetrain/knock detector
actually that sounds like an awesome tool to have...i wonder if they still make it
There are many fools on here who just randomly think a sensor does a specific job and tells all. Do they ****, for many reasons already explained. It's a bit like all this "self tuning" bullshit...then people posting lots of problems because the ecu isnt tuning their car. LOL...who'd have thought.
GIGO.
And I've already stated the best option by far, is essentially that mechanical stethoscope. No ******* about pulling plugs, you will hear it in real time and it is far more sensitive than trying to visualise something after the event by looking at a plug. Assuming the person even knows what to look for. And they'd still never know what rpm etc the detonation occurred.
I'm certainly not saying pulling plugs is not a viable option, of course it is. But it's very naive to think it is the only option.
no sir, oil pan swap and valave springs only
You guys arguing back and forth about what method to use... Wouldn't it be safe to say that a good tuner uses every method available at any given time? I know I always try to compare any data gathered against something else before I make any hard changes. It's just a way to be safe especially when working on somebody else's pride and joy and just pure good business practice.
OP... as said by myself and two other guys, pull your timing down to 10ish degrees (.80g and up is where I'd start) at anything close to boost and datalog it for us. Make sure you get both tables if there are two. It's is going to be a pig... Deal with it until you feel that it safe. Use a wideband as well. See anything close to 12 AFR... let out. Post it up and we will do our best to help.
OP... as said by myself and two other guys, pull your timing down to 10ish degrees (.80g and up is where I'd start) at anything close to boost and datalog it for us. Make sure you get both tables if there are two. It's is going to be a pig... Deal with it until you feel that it safe. Use a wideband as well. See anything close to 12 AFR... let out. Post it up and we will do our best to help.
Last edited by RelentleZ; Mar 8, 2017 at 07:01 AM.
i think we're all saying the same thing...use every method available. redundancy in measurement is guten tag.
if you're more versed in an aural knock detector thing, cool use that.
if you spent a lot of time reading plugs and have a grasp on that....use that
like any tool, it's only as useful as the person using it
OP, post your actual tune please. we can be a lot more helpful that way.
if you wanna learn to tune the sloppy wiki has some great starter tunes to get your feet wet.
and this thread https://ls1tech.com/forums/forced-in...ers-boost.html
is fairly complete. i dont agree 100% with everything but the guy has a good grasp of whats going on as far as hardware/software and explains it realy well.
if you're more versed in an aural knock detector thing, cool use that.
if you spent a lot of time reading plugs and have a grasp on that....use that
like any tool, it's only as useful as the person using it
OP, post your actual tune please. we can be a lot more helpful that way.
if you wanna learn to tune the sloppy wiki has some great starter tunes to get your feet wet.
and this thread https://ls1tech.com/forums/forced-in...ers-boost.html
is fairly complete. i dont agree 100% with everything but the guy has a good grasp of whats going on as far as hardware/software and explains it realy well.
Thx, guys, TRUCKDOUG im gonna try posting it lets see if this works.
Btw, im all over the sloppy stuff been for years, its why i went turbo actually. I only found one tune for hp tuners that was close to my setup, but the injectors were bigger and i figured it would skew alot of things.
Btw, im all over the sloppy stuff been for years, its why i went turbo actually. I only found one tune for hp tuners that was close to my setup, but the injectors were bigger and i figured it would skew alot of things.
You guys arguing back and forth about what method to use... Wouldn't it be safe to say that a good tuner uses every method available at any given time? I know I always try to compare any data gathered against something else before I make any hard changes. It's just a way to be safe especially when working on somebody else's pride and joy and just pure good business practice.
OP... as said by myself and two other guys, pull your timing down to 10ish degrees (.80g and up is where I'd start) at anything close to boost and datalog it for us. Make sure you get both tables if there are two. It's is going to be a pig... Deal with it until you feel that it safe. Use a wideband as well. See anything close to 12 AFR... let out. Post it up and we will do our best to help.
OP... as said by myself and two other guys, pull your timing down to 10ish degrees (.80g and up is where I'd start) at anything close to boost and datalog it for us. Make sure you get both tables if there are two. It's is going to be a pig... Deal with it until you feel that it safe. Use a wideband as well. See anything close to 12 AFR... let out. Post it up and we will do our best to help.