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Alright guys its time to finish out my red 98Z. Has everything in my sig. Compression is 9.5:1. I'm sure a D1X would be fine but I don't wanna be like so many and wish I'd gone bigger later. So F1 it is. Car only has hotwire with a 255 and 60Lb injectors. So fuel system has to be done also. I have the Moser with a 3.70 gear. Which I regret going so low. I should have done a 3.50 at most. Next is transmission. The Performabuilt LVL2 is coming out. I'm thinking I could upgrade it to a Performabuilt LVL 3 or go 4L80. Not sure so that's why I'm throwing that out there. Also converter. I will need a new one. My choices would be among Yank, Circle D and FTI. I know all 3 are good.
This car is a weekend warrior that does go to the track. It has AC and all accessories but back seats removed. I mean only people without legs can even fit in those back seats anyway. One other thing I would like to consider is running E85. We have Sheetz gas stations here in NC so E85 is easy to get. I know with the 98 PCM that might present issues. But I don't know all my options there other than 99-02 PCM and repin.
So with all that said I'm asking you guys to spend my money for me. Ha ha. All opinions and recommendations are welcome. I'll be talking to Bob at some point as it has his blower cam and I got my Moser from him also. Anyone who wants is welcome to PM me. Thanks guys. Look forward to what you guys have to say. I tend to do searches and read there first because there are so many on here far far more knowledgeable than me, But I wanted to start my own thread so I don't have to jump around so much. Thanks.
Oh and I know you Turbo guys want me to go turbo. I considered it. I use to have two 87 Turbo Regals. But I'm gonna stick to Procharger on this one. Maybe my other Z.
Whatever headunit/supporting mods you choose, make sure to go with the biggest, least restrictive piping, intercooler,, and air filter you can fit. Maybe even consider some hacking in spots to make it fit. Otherwise you will be down on boost and find yourself redoing the piping which can be expensive and a PITA. That's my biggest learning after 10 years with a procharged car.
Go with the F1a-94 head unit instead of the F1a. I would use ethanol for sure even though it's probably not necessary for your 9.5 to 1 compression. I use 50% ethanol with 10.6 to 1 compression for reference. Use the biggest crank pulley you can so you don't have to go very small on the blower pulley to reach the boost level you want and use any proven techniques to eliminate belt slip right from the git go.
Whatever headunit/supporting mods you choose, make sure to go with the biggest, least restrictive piping, intercooler,, and air filter you can fit. Maybe even consider some hacking in spots to make it fit. Otherwise you will be down on boost and find yourself redoing the piping which can be expensive and a PITA. That's my biggest learning after 10 years with a procharged car.
Thanks man. This is why I'm trying to get as much info from guys who have been there already. I don't wanna be in that "I should have done this" place. Like so many of us have been before messing with cars. I really wanna try and get it right the first time. My main objective is matching the blower, stall and gear up. Fuel system will simply be what's needed to handle the HP. I think the Fast 90/90 is fine but if need be I can change that also but don't want to spend money just for the sake of spending it.
Go with the F1a-94 head unit instead of the F1a. I would use ethanol for sure even though it's probably not necessary for your 9.5 to 1 compression. I use 50% ethanol with 10.6 to 1 compression for reference. Use the biggest crank pulley you can so you don't have to go very small on the blower pulley to reach the boost level you want and use any proven techniques to eliminate belt slip right from the git go.
Yeh I've read all about the Aster bracket. I know belt slippage is an issue when you get into the F1 series. Its something I want to avoid if I can. My car already has the ATI Balancer on it. I had the crank pinned and the ATI Balancer put on when I had the engine built.
I think a previous post is referring to the larger crank pulley vs the 7.65 version. See link. Using the larger 8.65 pulley allows you to use a larger head unit pulley.
The 8.65 pulley because its circumference is larger means more belt wrap, therefore less potential for belt slippage. Same goes the head unit pulley. The larger the pulley the more belt wrap. The combination ratio between the two pullies allows you to calculate head unit rpm and approximate boost level.
Although the Gates Green belt used to be the preferred choice for the Fbody Procharger, Gates new and improved RPM belt doesn't stretch like the green belt that requires more adjustment after break in. Some on this forum prefer the RPM belt and say it is much better for avoiding belt slippage, heat, and wear.
You will need an LS2 waterpump if you install the Aster Bracket because of the bell on the water pump. You can modify the Aster Bracket by adding a larger 50mm pulley. The 50 mm pulley doesn't spin as fast as the smaller Aster pulley. Plus it has larger bearings inside as well.
I have a Yank 3450 blower converter. It works well with my Performabuilt Level 3 4l60e transmission. Like you I started with 3.73 gears, dropped down to 3.42 gears and now have 3.23 gears. With all of the torque and RWHP (engine is TSP LQ9 370 with a D1 SC), you can blow the tires easily, so IMO if you plan on a lot of cruising and city driving, the 3.23/3.08 gear range is better than 3.73 gears especially with a 3400 -3600 stall converter..
Vendors now make a pretty stout 4l60e. I would stick with it instead of the conversion to the 80. My next upgrade for the 60 might be to have Performabuilt install the close ratio gear set. Wish, now I would have Performabuilt do that when it was rebuilt recently with all of the most recent upgrades. It originally was a 2007 level three version.
With the close ratio gear set, city driving with the 60 and a 3400 stall should make city cruising better and maybe better track times.
Racetronix will spec you a 510lph dual pump kit for your 98. It's not advertised on their site. It's good to 1000 rhwp on gas. It comes with upgraded wire kit that is modified so it can still use the yellow bulkhead connector on the 98 fuel hat assembly.
IMO don't go cheap on an intercooler especially if you choose the F1 and want to run a lot of boost. IMO the intercooler is not so critical if you keep boost around 10-12 lbs say with a D1.
It appears that the piping on the Procharge FMIC kit is steel. A good aluminum welder can easily duplicate their system with much lighter 3 inch aluminum piping. There aren't a lot on intricate bends for an FBody fmic system. An S bend pipe up to the throttle body works well without having to cut and weld a piece with the same angles.
Overheating if you plan to keep AC?
Do a search for fixes. It depends a lot on where you live and what the average summer ambient temp is. If it's about 85 you probably won't have any issues. But when temps reach 100 degrees and higher then overheating might become an issue just like it is on the Corvette C7 Z06. The ac condenser parked just ahead of the radiator doesn't allow the radiator to cool so well when temps reach a steady 100 or more degrees in city driving.
I think a previous post is referring to the larger crank pulley vs the 7.65 version. See link. Using the larger 8.65 pulley allows you to use a larger head unit pulley.
The 8.65 pulley because its circumference is larger means more belt wrap, therefore less potential for belt slippage. Same goes the head unit pulley. The larger the pulley the more belt wrap. The combination ratio between the two pullies allows you to calculate head unit rpm and approximate boost level.
Although the Gates Green belt used to be the preferred choice for the Fbody Procharger, Gates new and improved RPM belt doesn't stretch like the green belt that requires more adjustment after break in. Some on this forum prefer the RPM belt and say it is much better for avoiding belt slippage, heat, and wear.
You will need an LS2 waterpump if you install the Aster Bracket because of the bell on the water pump. You can modify the Aster Bracket by adding a larger 50mm pulley. The 50 mm pulley doesn't spin as fast as the smaller Aster pulley. Plus it has larger bearings inside as well.
I have a Yank 3450 blower converter. It works well with my Performabuilt Level 3 4l60e transmission. Like you I started with 3.73 gears, dropped down to 3.42 gears and now have 3.23 gears. With all of the torque and RWHP (engine is TSP LQ9 370 with a D1 SC), you can blow the tires easily, so IMO if you plan on a lot of cruising and city driving, the 3.23/3.08 gear range is better than 3.73 gears especially with a 3400 -3600 stall converter..
Vendors now make a pretty stout 4l60e. I would stick with it instead of the conversion to the 80. My next upgrade for the 60 might be to have Performabuilt install the close ratio gear set. Wish, now I would have Performabuilt do that when it was rebuilt recently with all of the most recent upgrades. It originally was a 2007 level three version.
With the close ratio gear set, city driving with the 60 and a 3400 stall should make city cruising better and maybe better track times.
Racetronix will spec you a 510lph dual pump kit for your 98. It's not advertised on their site. It's good to 1000 rhwp on gas. It comes with upgraded wire kit that is modified so it can still use the yellow bulkhead connector on the 98 fuel hat assembly.
IMO don't go cheap on an intercooler especially if you choose the F1 and want to run a lot of boost. IMO the intercooler is not so critical if you keep boost around 10-12 lbs say with a D1.
It appears that the piping on the Procharge FMIC kit is steel. A good aluminum welder can easily duplicate their system with much lighter 3 inch aluminum piping. There aren't a lot on intricate bends for an FBody fmic system. An S bend pipe up to the throttle body works well without having to cut and weld a piece with the same angles.
Overheating if you plan to keep AC?
Do a search for fixes. It depends a lot on where you live and what the average summer ambient temp is. If it's about 85 you probably won't have any issues. But when temps reach 100 degrees and higher then overheating might become an issue just like it is on the Corvette C7 Z06. The ac condenser parked just ahead of the radiator doesn't allow the radiator to cool so well when temps reach a steady 100 or more degrees in city driving.
HTH, Good luck with your project.
I meant the Damper. Not sure what I was thinking. I had it installed and crank pinned when motor was built years ago. Do you know people who build front-mounts for the 4th Gen. It seems like I saw someone either on here or on youtube that had a different front mount on their car that wasn't the one from Procharger. Their front mount would be more than enough for me. That thing is good for like 1300 hp I think. One thing is I don't want to have to run an insane amount of boost. I'm not looking to push the motor to its limits. I'd just rather have more blower than I need so if I wanna go faster later its there to be had and not have to upgrade. I think the Performabuilt LVL 3 will be good for me. I'm not gonna push it too 900 rwhp. I'll see what they have to say. And you're exactly right about the gear. Blowing the tires off every second is no fun. Its fun at first. But "spinning ain't winning".
A search will literally give you hundreds of example pics of various ways to hang the FMIC (front mounted intercooler) on the front frame horns. Most hang the intercooler from a bar with tabs the attaches to either side of frame end where the steel front bumper is originally attached.
IMO the critical issue is where you hang it in relation to the intercooler pipes so it's high enough so the pipes tuck in above the front fender splash shields but far enough back so the intercooler fits inside the cover and is located so it's front face gets as much air as possible thru the front bumper cover.
Some intercoolers have mounting holes on the top and bottom of the intercooler. Some have mounting tabs on each side of intercooler. A 26 X 4 inch intercooler can weigh as much a 25 lbs or more and it's hanging out almost to the front of the car so it needs to be secure so the mounting bolts don't shear off. A universal one size fits all intercooler bracket is difficuilt to make because there are so many variations of intercoolers where the mounting holes for brackets are not standardized on the top, the bottom or on the sides.
IMO the best way to support the cooler is from the sides like Procharger kit. The brackets are out of the way on either side and don't interfere with the bumper cover top or bottom.
You can make two simple brackets like the pic in the link. It mounts to the frame horns with three grade 8 bolts on either side. The intercooler mounts to the bracket with two bolts on either side. My brackets currently supports the top and bottom the intercooler for now. My welder will be welding mounting tabs on the intercooler sides. This will allow me to eliminate the bracket on the top and bottom which complicate the bracket and just get in the way for the bumper cover, especially on the bottom of the cover.
The two simple aluminum side brackets will weight less than 3 lbs. It's simple, can be made out of steel or aluminum and will mount with a total of 10 bolts. The entire assembly can installed with just six bolts after attaching the brackets to the intercooler.
The side bracket on the driver side is also a good place to mount the alky pump if you decide to add a meth kit.
Filter:
When you plan your system for the intercooler, the pipes and the air filter account for the pipe bends and angles so you eventually have room for the air filter (a big one). It's all about surface area for the air filter so you want as much as what you can fit into a very limited space on the driver side.
If you decide on the F series head unit, I am pretty sure you will need the larger 'big red' bypass valve. There are two versions. If I had to do it again, I would get the unit that has muffled vents. Mine is really noisey if you like noise. IMO, it cool at first, but get's old really fast so wish that I had gotten the other muffled version.
I recall that when you exceed 10-12 lbs of boost that you will want to move from the black bypass valve to the red version(s). You are pushing a lot of air with the f series, and when you let off the gas in boost, you need a big vent to atmosphere so not sure if the black valve is big enough to vent that much air.
Talk to Bob at Brute Speed first for his opinion for the bypass valve.
Last edited by dlandsvZ28; 07-07-2020 at 09:59 AM.
Reason: edit content
Definitely go bigger if you think you'll want to in the future. Because as you mentioned, when you want to do it after the fact it sucks haha. Thankfully from what I've read is the difference between a P1 and D1 is the impeller so I should be able to just upgrade that inside my P1 housing. You'll definitely need a fuel system as you mentioned. I'm DW300C pump with 60lb injectors and when I go up in boost I'll need more fuel.
Don't waste your money on the Procharger branded stuff just for the brand. I know procharger units are great and I love mine but $2,000 for a large intercooler is ridiculous. And the fan shroud does not fit well(atleast not mine). I bought the same size intercooler from Misihimoto with a LIFETIME warranty. And I'm going to make my own sheetmetal fan shroud. I have a P1SC on my car with the basic tiny intercooler and even on my low boost it just isn't doing enough when I'm cruising. I'm seeing IATs in the 110* to 120* range on the interstate and all the way up to 150* in traffic. So I'm going with a much larger intercooler(the same size as Prochargers Race intercooler) and a tubular front crash bar. The factory crash bar won't allow the bigger intercooler and a tubular bar will allow more airflow. As it's been said already make sure your piping is good and routed well so you can have a big enough intake filter(I have to re-route mine to fit a bigger filter.
IMO you might save some money by making your own shroud, but in the long run the shroud from Mighty Mouse fits perfectly for the fbody and is cut for standardized 16 inch and nine inch puller fans.
It fits about as tight as it can against the rear of the radiator compared to the ATI Fbody fan shroud which fits loosely, isn't cut for a second fan and is two pieces rather than just one.
For the life of me I can't remember the name of the vendor I bought the tubular crash bar from. It's a nice piece that is very effective for a bumper cover support and crash bar, but IMO didn't work at all when trying to fit a large 26 X 4 inch intercooler inside the tubular frame. With it you can't raise the cooler high enough so the in and out inlets fit above the lower bar. So you have to lower it so they are under the lower tubular bar. Doing so then interferes with the lower part of the Camaro bumper cover. It also then doesn't line up with the hole that is needed in the cover for air to get to the cooler.
As you can see in the pic above, I had to remove the lower tubing bar and also weld in hangers to hang the intercooler on. As I said previously raising the intercooler to the correct height also allows you to tuck the pipes into the cover and above the splash shields. Ignore the poor welds, was learning how to mig weld at the same time as trying to make a decent hanger for the intercooler, So if you opt for this support be prepared to modify it so you can actually fit a larger intercooler inside of it. Plus the tubular support weighs a lot too compared to two aluminum side brackets (about 3 lbs).
To get a better result for the intercooler, I hacked and hacked, but finally trashed it all for two side brackets. Simple, easy to make, and very effective since you can raise the intercooler up or down and also fore and after by drilling several mounting holes in the side brackets.
Last edited by dlandsvZ28; 07-08-2020 at 08:41 AM.
Reason: edit content
IMO you might save some money by making your own shroud, but in the long run the shroud from Mighty Mouse fits perfectly for the fbody and is cut for standardized 16 inch and nine inch puller fans.
It fits about as tight as it can against the rear of the radiator compared to the ATI Fbody fan shroud which fits loosely, isn't cut for a second fan and is two pieces rather than just one.
For the life of me I can't remember the name of the vendor I bought the tubular crash bar from. It's a nice piece that is very effective for a bumper cover support and crash bar, but IMO didn't work at all when trying to fit a large 26 X 4 inch intercooler inside the tubular frame. With it you can't raise the cooler high enough so the in and out inlets fit above the lower bar. So you have to lower it so they are under the lower tubular bar. Doing so then interferes with the lower part of the Camaro bumper cover. It also then doesn't line up with the hole that is needed in the cover for air to get to the cooler.
As you can see in the pic above, I had to remove the lower tubing bar and also weld in hangers to hang the intercooler on. As I said previously raising the intercooler to the correct height also allows you to tuck the pipes into the cover and above the splash shields. Ignore the poor welds, was learning how to mig weld at the same time as trying to make a decent hanger for the intercooler, So if you opt for this support be prepared to modify it so you can actually fit a larger intercooler inside of it. Plus the tubular support weighs a lot too compared to two aluminum side brackets (about 3 lbs).
To get a better result for the intercooler, I hacked and hacked, but finally trashed it all for two side brackets. Simple, easy to make, and very effective since you can raise the intercooler up or down and also fore and after by drilling several mounting holes in the side brackets.
Sorry I didn't Specify. My Procharger is attached to my GTO, not my fbody. Unfortunately I haven't found anyone that makes a decent aftermarket fan shroud, the procharger one doesn't fit well, and no one makes a tubular crash bar. That's why I'm trying to find someone local to me to fab one up.
Man, just make your own, get some sheet aluminum, harbor freight sells cheap break to bend it and just cut the hole for your fans.
For the fan shroud I could. But I figured I'd just have someone with more tools and space than me do it when they make my tubular brace bar. My current living situation leaves me limited on working space. But most importantly I need a tubular front brace to allow the space for a bigger intercooler. This tiny one is worthless. My IATs are at 110 cruising in the heat of the day and will hit 160 in traffic(which is rare that I'm in traffic).
Conan, those pics look great man. I love the way you made the holes for air flow in the front of the bumper and then installed the Z28 grill over it. Functional and still looks really good and stylish. Looks factory frankly. I need to bring you my car and let you do all my install.
07-03-2020, 09:39 PM
Procharger guys chime in, all welcome 
